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Discussion point: Telco quality?
by Paul Ferguson 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

This latest fiber cut just kind of jarred my brain into the realization of what "telco quality" services really boils down to. In the end, all services, both traditional telephony services and data services, are more alike than people give them credit for. :-) - paul

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Co-locate weather conditions (Re: MAE NY?)
by Sean Donelan 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

davediaz(a)netrail.NET (David Diaz) writes: >This was all good with the exception of temp for condensation. >Condensation can occur at just about any temp (within reason) that is what >Dew Point is. Humidity is Dew point/(room) Temperature. When they match >you have humidity of 100% and start to see condensation/fog. Anyway this >is from flight school. I have heard different engineers recommend 40% >humidity and maybe 67.5 degrees temp. Something about enough humidity to >avoid static dischargies etc...?? Normally people pay consultants a lot of money to go look this stuff up in libraries :-) You are correct, it is actually a XY curve plotted with both relative humidity and temperature. Condensation/fog is not good for a co-locate space. In addition to electrostatic discharge other issues include corrosion, fungial growth, affect on the other material stored in the area, and of course comfort for the human occupants. Go to far in any direction, and you'll have problems. You are looking for the sweet spot. The problem for a co-locate operator is there isn't one, but several depending how the occupants decide to use the space. Further, what is 'acceptable' may vary depending whether you are the one paying the utility bill, or if someone else is paying it. cigars 70f/70% R.H. wine 56f/>20% R.H. mag tapes 63f/25% R.H. (> 10yr storage) mag tapes 70f/40% R.H. (< 5yr operating) museum objects 70f/50% R.H. photographs 68f/35% R.H. color photos 40f/35% R.H. books/paper 70f/35% R.H. "clean rooms" 72f/50% R.H. You'll notice I didn't list 'co-locate space'. If you do some research you will find the 'optimum' settings are always one study away from changing. As researchers discover new and inventive ways for Murphy to attack, they also discover the previous settings sometimes created the perfect petri dish for problems to grow. People get very religious about the 'correct' environment. And we haven't gotten into things such as filtration for dust, smoke, gases, pollutants. Or other issues like electromagnetic interference, vibration, lighting, acoustic noise, sesimic stability, floor loading, fire prevention and resistance, etc. Government and technical sites of interest Magnetic media storage http://www.nml.org/ Books, paper, photographs http://www.loc.gov/ General storage http://www.nara.gov/ Electrostatic discharge http://www.eosesd.org/ -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Affiliation given for identification not representation

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WCG
by jamie＠dilbert.ais.net 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

Anyone know any contacts with a pulse at WCG? E-mailed noc and contacts for aads ; our peering w/them has been down for weeks.. nobody seems to be alive over there. TIA. -jamie -- jamie rishaw (efnet:gavroche) American Information Systems, Inc. Tel:312.425.7140, FAX:312.425.7240 Help stop spam! router(config)#no ip routing thirty thousand feet above the earth..youre a beautiful thing..

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Re: FYI
by William Allen Simpson 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

Yes! I _was_ attending, but got stuck in a huge construction project on the first morning (following the Merit web page directions that M14 was the "best" route), and missed the first presentation. I was able to hear it off the net later. If I had a better connection, I would have been able to see them. I think this is a real benefit to all of us. Thanks! I plan on going back and checking out NANOGs I've missed. Keep this up, and I may never need to go to a NANOG in person again (much rejoicing). But, I'd miss your smiling faces, you big bunch of galoots.... ;-) > I really, really appreciate the effort and expense that everyone went to > to broadcast NANOG 13 and subsequently make it available for later > listening. I wasn't able to watch it in June, and I'm very glad to be > able to view it now. Thank you! :-) > WSimpson(a)UMich.edu Key fingerprint = 17 40 5E 67 15 6F 31 26 DD 0D B9 9B 6A 15 2C 32

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100% humidity in the L.A. 9-1-1 communications room
by Sean Donelan 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

In the catagory of stuff happens: http://www.cnn.com/US/9810/12/la.911.ap/ Does your co-locate have a sump pump? -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Affiliation given for identification not representation

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Re: Internet 1, Backhoe 0
by Harold Willison 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

I have a pretty good source for custom tshirts.. I can check into pricing if these shirts arent being made by anyone yet. Whats the tshirt design? Picture on the front or back? Any wording on them? If so.. what? I can have the 'backhoe-targeted-in-gun-sights' picture made this evening sometime. Hmm.. probably will make several different versions and let folks vote on which is the preferred one. Of course, someone could already be doing this, and I could be way behind on this. Seems to me I remember this mentioned a few months back.. >>Now just if we could get those t-shirts with backhoes-targeted-in-gun-sights, >>then that'd be 20-30 orders right there, easily. *-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-* | Harold Willison AGIS Network Engineering | * Senior Network Engineer 313-730-5151 * | noc(a)agis.net 313-730-1130 x-5649 | | harold(a)agis.net 24 hours a day, 7 days a week | | <bold><italic> <underline>http://www.agis.net</underline></italic></bold> |<bold><italic> </italic></bold>\*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*/

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FYI
by Pam Ciesla 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

>From mark(a)vielle.datasys.net Sat Oct 10 21:21:30 1998 Received: from merit.edu (merit.edu [198.108.1.42]) by home.merit.edu (8.8.8/merit-2.0) with ESMTP id VAA11665 for <pam(a)home.merit.edu>; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 21:21:29 -0400 (EDT) Received: from vielle.datasys.net (mark(a)vielle.datasys.net [204.252.164.2]) by merit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id VAA23208 for <pam(a)merit.edu>; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 21:21:27 -0400 (EDT) Received: (from mark@localhost) by vielle.datasys.net (8.9.1/8.9.1) id VAA16968 for pam(a)merit.edu; Sat, 10 Oct 1998 21:21:47 -0400 Message-Id: <199810110121.VAA16968(a)vielle.datasys.net> From: mark(a)vielle.datasys.net (Mark R. Lindsey) Date: Sat, 10 Oct 1998 21:21:46 -0400 Reply-To: mark(a)vielle.datasys.net (Mark R. Lindsey) X-Pgp-Fingerprint: DB 6B 9E 9F B5 F2 9B 6D A0 BE D8 10 6B 22 8F 06 Precedence: Special-Delivery X-Tom-Swiftie: Pretend we were in the days before railways, Tom coached. X-Mailer: Mail User's Shell (7.2.6 1995-03-03) To: pam(a)merit.edu Subject: Thank you! Status: R I really, really appreciate the effort and expense that everyone went to to broadcast NANOG 13 and subsequently make it available for later listening. I wasn't able to watch it in June, and I'm very glad to be able to view it now. Thank you! :-) Mark Lindsey

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Re: Internet 1, Backhoe 0
by John R. Cox 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

http://www.bizarroland.com/images/shotfromspace4.jpg -----Original Message----- From: scott w <scott(a)digisle.net> To: George Broadfoot <george(a)laserlink.net> Cc: 'Roeland M.J. Meyer' <rmeyer(a)mhsc.com>; 'Dan Foster' <dsf(a)frontiernet.net>; 'Jeff Weisberg' <jaw(a)Op.Net>; 'nanog(a)merit.edu' <nanog(a)merit.edu>; 'john(a)bestconnect.net' <john(a)bestconnect.net> Date: Friday, October 09, 1998 2:10 PM Subject: RE: Internet 1, Backhoe 0 > > >It doesn't say nanog and the picture is super-geeky and on the front... >How about a sillouetted back-hoe? Point the cross-hairs at the machinery, >not the person. Maybe don't even put a person on the thing. > > >Also, please make sure they are thick, good quality t-shirts. > >scott > > > >On Fri, 9 Oct 1998, George Broadfoot wrote: > >> Be sure to check out the fiber cutting Gopher backhoe shirt >> at www.bizarroland.com > >

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Sprint's filtering
by Sean M. Doran 12 Oct '98

12 Oct '98

Michael Dillon wrote: | The policies that once were technical policies instituted | by Sean Doran are no longer technical policies but a crass manipulation of | the marketplace to Sprint's advantage as the archives of this list prove | quite amply. Hello, my name is Sean Doran. The reality you seem to forget is that Sprint's holding the line on filtering has been holding the number of prefixes being seen globally to a conveniently small number. Just as the several networks who refuse to listen to announcements of address space not delegated by the IP registries -- or recorded in routing registries as associated with the origin AS -- Sprint's filtering has done some public good as a side-effect of intelligent self-defensive design. A denial of that is merely petty politicking, rather than anything actually rooted in technical issues. Finally, unlike a number of people reading this message, Sprint was largely unaffected by the unfortunate leak of several thousand prefixes by another large provider in the not-too-distant past. On that note, should someone go mad and decide to deaggregate a /8 to the /32 level just for fun, how many of you honestly wouldn't notice because you have *some* sort of prefix-length filtering in place? I'm curious to know in your particular case, Michael, whether you have a concern about the actual act of self-defensive filtering, or whether you are merely arguing that the potential number of prefixes Sprint may see is too low. Oh, wait, you wave the spectre of "clear violation of antitrust" around, so therefore any claim that you are making a _technical_ argument is clearly false. So, I am sure you are unimpressed that I actually hope Sprint undertakes to do *more* filtering, namely to ensure that prefixes can only be originated by ASes to whom the registries have delegated the address space, using a scheme proposed by Tony Li, Yakov Rekhter and Randy Bush, as presented at NANOG and RIPE and in other venues. That they protect themselves and their customers from unintentional routing-table explosions and redistributions into and out of IGPs does some public good is a useful side-effect, but the primary goal is and ought to be self-protection. | But I want to know | why ARIN cannot simply issue an appropriately sized portable block of | addresses to anyone who is legitimately multihomed? Appropriately sized: one /32, please. Legitimately multihomed: I have accounts at two ISPs in Toronto, one ISP in Copenhagen, and two ISPs in Stockholm. I also travel to IETFs and other places with terminal rooms, and would dearly like my laptop never to have to renumber when it changes its location in the topology. My laptop's *users* moreover would really hate to have to adapt to changing IP addresses every time a new provider gets selected. Please campaign for *MY* rights, too, you guys! I feel left out by you big boy regional ISPs who are trying to strangle my enterprise out of existence with your antitrust policies favouring the large and medium-sized over the very small! Sean.

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Backhoes: Solution?
by Adam Rothschild 11 Oct '98

11 Oct '98

http://www.millburn.net/backhoe2.jpg Sounds like a plan to me. Hopefully, many telco's will catch on, and fast...

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