May 2005 - Test - lists.nanog.org

Exchange points for Southeastern Michigan
by John Ferriby 12 May '05

12 May '05

Aside from the Switch & Data in Southfield and the nearby Level 3 location, has anyone encountered good locations for private peering in the metro Detroit area?

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re: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years?
by Fred Heutte 12 May '05

12 May '05

(1) There will be a market for independent ISPs as long CLECs continue to let their customers enjoy poor service and unnecessary restrictions. Bandwidth is a "commodity" and scales appropriately; service is "service" and does not scale without a great deal of management commitment, resources, money, attention and abandonment of the cut-costs/low-bid mentality. (2) This discussion is more appropriate to the ISP-CLEC list. Wish I could be with you all in Seattle next week but work is piling up so . . . back to work/lurk mode . . . phred ------ mail forwarded, original message follows ------ To: nanog(a)nanog.org From: Mbazan(a)onelegal.com <Matt Bazan> Subject: FW: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years? Date: Wed, 11 May 2005 12:13:23 -0700 yep, bryan brings up a good point too. looks like the private dsl reseller ship will soon be taking on more water and floundering yet further. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Battle [mailto:brian@confluence.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 11:32 AM To: Matt Bazan Subject: RE: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years? You forgot to mention Verizon's Fios (fiber to the house) which will definitely put smaller dsl resellers out of business, unless Verizon gives them access to resell that as well. 15Mbs/2Mbs for $49.95 is going to make even the cable operators scramble to increase bandwidth to maintain customers. -----Original Message----- From: Matt Bazan [mailto:Mbazan@onelegal.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 2:09 PM To: nanog(a)nanog.org Subject: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years? why in the world would anyone want to purchase dsl from a private reseller when i can get 4mb down 384 up from comcast for $25? think you dsl resellers out there are doomed. in fact, just a matter of time before most of you isps are down the toilet. im reminded of the mom and pop grocery store phenomenon that has now been replaced by the kohls, a&p, whole foods etc. of course there will always be niche markets but this is less applicable for a pure commodity like bandwidth. yeah, i suppose you'll say something about value added services and such and you may have a point but i doubt that will keep the ship afloat for long.

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Re: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years?
by David Lesher 11 May '05

11 May '05

A few years...? http://biz.verizon.net/pands/fios/features.asp Verizontal is NOW offering this over PON glass: Max Speeds (down/up) Contract Term Dynamic IP Static IP* Up to 15 Mbps/2 Mbps 1 Year $59.95/month $99.95/month Up to 5 Mbps/5 Mbps 1 Year $169.95/month $209.95/month Up to 30 Mbps/5 Mbps 1 Year $349.95/month $389.95/month And the best part; they cut down the copper drop when they install the glass. No more copper EVER, and no resale, no UNE, no COVAD, etc -- you and future owners are stuck with Ma, period. -- A host is a host from coast to coast.................wb8foz(a)nrk.com & no one will talk to a host that's close........[v].(301) 56-LINUX Unless the host (that isn't close).........................pob 1433 is busy, hung or dead....................................20915-1433

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Re: Blocking port udp/tcp 1433/1434
by MARLON BORBA 11 May '05

11 May '05

<evil grin> if you are sure there are no more infected machines out there... </evil grin> best regards, marlon borba, cissp >>> Joe Maimon <jmaimon(a)ttec.com> 11/5/2005 12:51:15 >>> Is there still justification for denying transit for ms-sql slammer ports? Thanks, Joe

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competitive network overbuilds
by David Barak 11 May '05

11 May '05

--- "Sam Hayes Merritt, III" <sam(a)themerritts.org> wrote: > You are always free to obtain a franchise and run > your own coax. Just > because the incumbent cable company does not allow > every tom dick and > harry ISP to use their copper doesn't mean you can't > provide the same > service. It should be noted that the same statement applies to DSL, FTTH, or RFC-1419 service as well: anyone who wants to CAN do an overbuild, and in fact that would probably be the best for customers in the long-run. David Barak Need Geek Rock? Try The Franchise: http://www.listentothefranchise.com __________________________________ Yahoo! Mail Mobile Take Yahoo! Mail with you! Check email on your mobile phone. http://mobile.yahoo.com/learn/mail

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RE: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years?
by Dave Hilton 11 May '05

11 May '05

Folks, I'm going to butt in here. Correct me if I'm wrong. Several years ago, here in California, the word was spread that a cable company has the right to the data and to the information which can be derived from it: rational was that cable is PRIVATE whereas things like POTS lines, DSL, T1, etc. were PUBLIC CARRIER. I, personally, was told, during a job interview in the San Jose area, for a position as a Forth programmer, that the desired outcome of the project was for the cable company to derive access information and purchasing information from the streams of electrons coursing through their cable medium. Maybe I have been mislead, maybe things have changed, but, just to be on the safe side - my household is sticking to analog cable, and several DSL lines, much to Comcast's disgust. Dave Hilton

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GLBX security department contact
by Drew Weaver 11 May '05

11 May '05

Contact me offlist please.

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RE: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years?
by Matt Bazan 11 May '05

11 May '05

well i doubt that ma and pa smith and their herd of pigs will keep many isps in business. and a few years down the road technical innovations will allow those without access to readily have broadband for todays dial up prices. (no offense all you hog farmers - my grandparents were hog farmers. and true - cant say they had much use for a fat pipe.) > -----Original Message----- > From: owner-nanog(a)merit.edu [mailto:owner-nanog@merit.edu] On > Behalf Of Bob Martin > Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 12:08 PM > To: nanog(a)nanog.org > Subject: Re: what will all you who work for private isp's be > doing in a few years? > > > > It won't be long before the telco's respond by offering DSL > at the same > speed/price. I've heard (but don't *know*) that SBC is selling 6 down > and 1 up in Houston and Dallas for $35. > > We're doing a fair business selling accelerated dial up for $15. Its > surprising how many folks don't want broadband. You don't > need 4mb down > to read your email. And once you get outside of the city > limits there's > a good sized market that can't get any type of broadband, > especially cable. > > We may decline some, but I don't think that ISP's are going > away anytime > soon. > > Bob Martin >

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RE: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a fe w years?
by Gyorfy, Shawn 11 May '05

11 May '05

That's where I was going.. Residential fine.. have fun with a shared medium - but look at the offering cable companies have for their commercial clients (only can speak about NY). Monthly Fee $109.95 Downstream up to 3Mbps Upstream up to 384Kbps Monthly Fee $299.95 Downstream up to 3Mbps Upstream up to 512Kbps Monthly Fee $209.95 Downstream up to 768Kbps Upstream up to 768Kbps shawn. -----Original Message----- From: owner-nanog(a)merit.edu [mailto:owner-nanog@merit.edu] On Behalf Of Bruce Pinsky Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 3:30 PM To: Adam Jacob Muller Cc: Matt Bazan; nanog(a)nanog.org Subject: Re: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years? -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Adam Jacob Muller wrote: | | It's simple, | A DSL provider like speakeasy offers much more to a technical user like | myself than Comcast does, plus they have an incentive to keep me happy, | if i'm not i can leave and go with a competitor, comcast does, and has | on many occasions, simply told me to go f*ck myself when i have service | issues. (Sorry your modem died sir, the next we can get a tech out to | your place is 2 weeks, when i don't need a tech I know what it means | when a modem has a failure code). | | The fact is, DSL is a competitive market, Cable is not, competitive | markets keep customers happy, monopolies anger people. | And more than the technical user is the benefit to corporations and businesses that DSL providers offer. We see many companies using DSL as a cost effective replacement for backup services formerly run over dialup, ISDN, and other on-demand technologies. The AUPs, filtering policies, routing policies, etc of cable operators are simply not geared to meet the needs of even the most simplistic of corporate requirements. - -- ========= bep -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (MingW32) iD8DBQFCgl0nE1XcgMgrtyYRAnKBAJ9kPK2/CQ9A+bqMIe4S/9oEZOEFjwCgw/bY k1AnnyyKLRIsNMZby0KBa/8= =dsjN -----END PGP SIGNATURE-----

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FW: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years?
by Matt Bazan 11 May '05

11 May '05

yep, bryan brings up a good point too. looks like the private dsl reseller ship will soon be taking on more water and floundering yet further. -----Original Message----- From: Brian Battle [mailto:brian@confluence.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 11:32 AM To: Matt Bazan Subject: RE: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years? You forgot to mention Verizon's Fios (fiber to the house) which will definitely put smaller dsl resellers out of business, unless Verizon gives them access to resell that as well. 15Mbs/2Mbs for $49.95 is going to make even the cable operators scramble to increase bandwidth to maintain customers. -----Original Message----- From: Matt Bazan [mailto:Mbazan@onelegal.com] Sent: Wednesday, May 11, 2005 2:09 PM To: nanog(a)nanog.org Subject: what will all you who work for private isp's be doing in a few years? why in the world would anyone want to purchase dsl from a private reseller when i can get 4mb down 384 up from comcast for $25? think you dsl resellers out there are doomed. in fact, just a matter of time before most of you isps are down the toilet. im reminded of the mom and pop grocery store phenomenon that has now been replaced by the kohls, a&p, whole foods etc. of course there will always be niche markets but this is less applicable for a pure commodity like bandwidth. yeah, i suppose you'll say something about value added services and such and you may have a point but i doubt that will keep the ship afloat for long.

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