June 2001 - Test - lists.nanog.org

RE: standards for giving out blocks of IP addresses
by Martin, Christian 16 Jun '01

16 Jun '01

> Of course bandwidth != subnet mask. He should give them > whatever IP's > they demonstrate a need for in the next three months. Determining and > justifying that > need has nothing to do with how over (or under) subscribed their > bandwidth is. Let us not forget what some salespersons will promise to potential large bandwidth customers. An OC-3 POS customer, for example, can expect many many /24s. One may say "They should go to ARIN", but alas, they would have to pay another $2500 on top of the $1 million+ they are paying for transit. <8{} It is surprising how much a salesperson will "sell" to get the commission on a 5 year OC-3 contract, forget about OC-12/48... So, in some cases, like it or not, bandwidth sold is proportional to IP addresses. chris > > If they are in fact only selling dialup (not leased lines, not web > hosting), > you might ask how many pops(locations) they plan to have right away, > modems/pop, space > reserved for internal devices (email/corporate lan) and links. You > could > easially justify a couple of /24's with a couple locations > and IP's for > all the new PC's in the marketing dept. > > KL >

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The Cidr Report
by Tony Bates 16 Jun '01

16 Jun '01

This is an auto-generated mail on Fri Jun 15 23:00:00 PDT 2001 It is not checked before it leaves my workstation. However, hopefully you will find this report interesting and will take the time to look through this to see if you can improve the amount of aggregation you perform. The report is split into sections: 0) General Status List the route table history for the last week, list any possibly bogus routes seen and give some status on ASes. 1) Gains by aggregating at the origin AS level This lists the "Top 30" players who if they decided to aggregate their announced classful prefixes at the origin AS level could make a significant difference in the reduction of the current size of the Internet routing table. This calculation does not take into account the inclusion of holes when forming an aggregate so it is possible even larger reduction should be possible. 2) Weekly Delta A summary of the last weeks changes in terms of withdrawn and added routes. Please note that this is only a snapshot but does give some indication of ASes participating in CIDR. Clearly, it is generally a good thing to see a large amont of withdrawls. 3) Interesting aggregates Interesting here means not an aggregate made as a set of classful routes. Thanks to GX Networks for giving me access to their routing tables once a day. Please send any comments about this report directly to me. Check http://www.employees.org/~tbates/cidr-report.html for a daily update of this report. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ CIDR REPORT for 15Jun01 0) General Status Table History ------------- Date Prefixes 080601 102522 090601 102942 100601 102382 110601 102484 120601 102300 130601 102055 140601 101900 150601 101429 Check http://www.employees.org/~tbates/cidr.plot.html for a plot of the table history. Possible Bogus Routes --------------------- AS Summary ---------- Number of ASes in routing system: 6880 Number of ASes announcing only one prefix: 2796 (0 cidr, 2796 classful) Largest number of cidr routes: 0 announced by Largest number of classful routes: 1403 announced by AS701 1) Gains by aggregating at the origin AS level --- 15Jun01 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS1221 1392 1032 360 25.9% UNKNOWN AS701 1403 1217 186 13.3% UNKNOWN AS4293 396 281 115 29.0% UNKNOWN AS4151 252 137 115 45.6% UNKNOWN AS4755 256 142 114 44.5% UNKNOWN AS6429 207 102 105 50.7% UNKNOWN AS6595 159 59 100 62.9% UNKNOWN AS705 251 155 96 38.2% UNKNOWN AS13999 103 11 92 89.3% UNKNOWN AS8013 300 222 78 26.0% UNKNOWN AS577 254 179 75 29.5% UNKNOWN AS7018 700 628 72 10.3% UNKNOWN AS724 223 159 64 28.7% UNKNOWN AS6471 114 50 64 56.1% UNKNOWN AS3464 152 90 62 40.8% UNKNOWN AS1 597 538 59 9.9% UNKNOWN AS16758 63 6 57 90.5% UNKNOWN AS2149 333 277 56 16.8% UNKNOWN AS1239 439 384 55 12.5% UNKNOWN AS3908 207 154 53 25.6% UNKNOWN AS226 143 90 53 37.1% UNKNOWN AS6413 66 14 52 78.8% UNKNOWN AS5106 95 43 52 54.7% UNKNOWN AS17561 112 61 51 45.5% UNKNOWN AS3602 229 179 50 21.8% UNKNOWN AS13544 69 19 50 72.5% UNKNOWN AS9842 54 5 49 90.7% UNKNOWN AS852 209 160 49 23.4% UNKNOWN AS855 144 98 46 31.9% UNKNOWN AS3749 94 48 46 48.9% UNKNOWN For the rest of the previous weeks gain information please see http://www.employees.org:80/~tbates/cidr-report.html 2) Weekly Delta Please see http://www.employees.org:80/~tbates/cidr-report.html for this part of the report 3) Interesting aggregates Please see http://www.employees.org:80/~tbates/cidr-report.html for this part of the report

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Multicast Traffic on Backbones
by Deepak Jain 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

Don't know why I came across this, but I found a document on Sprintlink's site that says their entire backbone is multicast enabled, and they also peer with the MBONE for multicast traffic. They charge no fee for dedicated customers to be multicast-enabled. Are any other major networks doing this? Or have I been living under a rock and _everyone_ is doing this now? Thanks, Deepak Jain AiNET

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Frame-Relay vs. ATM?
by Los, Ralph 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

Hello everyone, I apologize for putting this out to everyone, but I don't know the answer to this question and I feel it's best to go to the source. My company is forcing me to do a Frame vs. ATM cost-benefit comparison. The Frame-Relay connection would be PVC's connecting 3 sites, Chicago, West-Coast, East-cost (offices). I am attempting to do video-on-demand, voice-over-IP, and data over these pipes, and would like to ability to do Internet+private LAN connecting all 3 sites for file-sharing, email sharing, etc without having to do VPN over the Internet. My question? What is the benefit of Frame-Relay from say, Sprint or AT&T versus an ATM connection for all 3 sites from Savvis or Broadwing? I'm trying to find the technical details and merits behind both these methods/technologies. Any replies would be appreciated off-list, and I will send a aggregate report to anyone interested. Thank you much everyone for answers in advance, Ralph M. Los Asst. Vice-President, Internet Systems and Security EnvestNet Advisory Corp. rlos(a)envestnet.com (312) 827-3945 (direct) (312) 296-9003 (wireless w/voicemail)

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cogentco.com technical analysis?
by Murphy, Brennan 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

I was wondering if anyone had any experience with Cogent Inc. They are one of the companies offering high speed internet (fast ethernet/GigE) at rock bottom prices. :-) I know the adage "you get what you pay for" typically applies but I was looking for some concrete end user experiences. I'm not trying to break the charter of this mailing list by devoting a discussion to various emotion based opinions about a particular vendor. I am actually seeking technical opinions on whether what is being advertised is actually being delivered with reliability. More specific questions: do Cogent's peering arrangements seem adequate to the amount of bandwidth they are offering? Or are these major bottlenecks to an otherwise good network? Are any of Cogent's competitors worth taking a look at? Any non-obvious reason why? Does anyone have any statistics to provide that paints a picture about what you get from their products? I guess if enough people complained that this was too off topic, I could still request direct replies and I could put a summary together for any interested parties. But I reread the charter before putting this together and it seems fair game. When is Worldcom, et al going to start offering these products? ( maybe when companies like cogent start succeeding?) Thanks, -BM

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RE: Mae-East FDDI funeral
by Hire, Ejay 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

>P.S. Mae-East FDDI officially gets turned off tomorrow (June 15th) according >to the most recent update I've seen. Anybody know if they are going to be doing equipment disposal? I'd love to add FDDI to my home not-for-commercial-or-profitable-use-please-let-the-gods-of-networking-smile -on-me lab. I have a truck, and will haul. (and I'm not completely above dumpster diving either!) -Ejay

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Re: Multicast Traffic on Backbones
by Thomas R. Charron 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

>Essentially every major network operator has one network engineer >who can set up multicast for customers. The problem is very few >networks have figured out how to turn multicast into a commercial >product. So if you don't find that one engineer, you are out of >luck. >Unicast streaming may be less efficient, but most providers can figure >out how to charge for it and make it a supported product. Unfortunately >some folks have confused multimedia with multicast. While I've seen >many multimedia multicast applications, I haven't seen one which can't >have its essential elements replicated by unicast streams. Is there >a killer-ap for multicast? A South Korean company has developed an app that sets up multicast on a network automatically. No router config required. It does it with a small active-x that installs on a user's machine and gives a server on the ntwk all the info it needs to route the multicast stream. Pretty cool stuff. I'd call it a killer-ap for multicasting. Tom

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RE: Multicast Traffic on Backbones
by Thomas R. Charron 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

"Thomas R. Charron" <tomc(a)koreawisenut.com> writes: > A South Korean company has developed an app that sets up multicast on a > network automatically. No router config required. It does it with a small > active-x that installs on a user's machine and gives a server on the ntwk > all the info it needs to route the multicast stream. Pretty cool stuff. > I'd call it a killer-ap for multicasting. It sounds as if I'd probably call it "unicast". ---Rob No, it's multicasting. The active-x interacts with the server to determine which clients are viable for grouping into a virtual multicasting ntwk (independently of routers). These little active-x's interact with the server to register themselves in a multicast group, and they can repeat the signal for others in their group or even to other groups. It's P2P and IP Multicasting put together. Tom

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Re: Multicast Traffic on Backbones
by rs＠seastrom.com 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

"Thomas R. Charron" <tomc(a)koreawisenut.com> writes: > A South Korean company has developed an app that sets up multicast on a > network automatically. No router config required. It does it with a small > active-x that installs on a user's machine and gives a server on the ntwk > all the info it needs to route the multicast stream. Pretty cool stuff. > I'd call it a killer-ap for multicasting. It sounds as if I'd probably call it "unicast". ---Rob

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a.root-servers.net power issue (why there are 13)
by Sean Donelan 15 Jun '01

15 Jun '01

The NSI data center housing one of the root servers, a.root-servers.net, lost utility power today. Reportedly an outside utility transformer was damaged. Generators come on-line, and the servers remained up. NSI didn't show any loss of traffic, however a couple of ISP MRTG graphs of ping status did indicate a brief 15 minute network interruption. This may indicate an external issue, i.e. outside of NSI, such as a network re-route or flap. On the followup investigation, folks may want to check if there was a piece of equipment which wasn't plugged into where they thought it was. NSI has several different provider's networks into their building, so a proble with one network wouldn't affect the others. Matrix (average.miq.net) shows overall the combination of the dns-root servers stable, and relatively unchanged. In general, the root-server design is robust; and even if one root-server completely failed, the affect would be minor for several days.

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