December 2009 - Test - lists.nanog.org

Re: [NANOG] Roport on internet business
by Scott Weeks 23 Dec '09

23 Dec '09

------- scott(a)doc.net.au wrote: ---------- From: Scott Howard <scott(a)doc.net.au> On Wed, Dec 23, 2009 at 3:01 PM, Scott Weeks <surfer(a)mauigateway.com> wrote: > It must be purchased: Only if you want the dead-tree edition. The others are linked below the text you've quoted. ---------------------------------------------- DOH! I blame it on Christmasits. It's a bad disease I recently caught... ;-) Apologies for the confusion. Have a great Christmas! scott

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IGMP and PIM protection
by Glen Kent 23 Dec '09

23 Dec '09

Hi, Any idea if folks use AH or ESP to protect IGMP/PIM packets? Wondering that if they do, then how would snooping switches work? Affably, Kent

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looking for a contact at Orange
by andrew young 23 Dec '09

23 Dec '09

if anyone has a contact at Orange or is from Orange, can you contact me off list. need help with some issues originating from the EU. -- ---------------------------------------- Andrew Young Webair Internet Development, Inc. Phone: 1 866 WEBAIR 1 x143 http://www.webair.com Shift hours: Tues-Friday 12PM-8PM, Sat 9AM-5PM

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FYI, new USG Cybersecurity Coordinator ...
by Jorge Amodio 23 Dec '09

23 Dec '09

FYI, http://www.whitehouse.gov/blog/2009/12/22/introducing-new-cybersecurity-coo…

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Re: IGMP and PIM protection
by David Barak 23 Dec '09

23 Dec '09

Multicast encryption using GDOI works well, although I haven't seen that implemented on a LAN. If you're trying to provide encryption for LAN listeners (more accurately to exclude some LAN listeners) you'll probably find more bang for the buck in implementing this on a per-application basis. That leaves the IGMP request subject to eavesdropping, but the data itself flows over a secure channel. If instead you want the IGMP itself to be encrypted, then you'll need all of the switches to participate in the security protocol, and I would imagine that there are far easier ways to provide secure connections. I believe GDOI is esp-only. Cisco's term for GDOI is GETVPN. -David Barak On Wed Dec 23rd, 2009 7:26 AM EST Peter Hicks wrote: >Glen Kent wrote: >> Any idea if folks use AH or ESP to protect IGMP/PIM packets? Wondering >> that if they do, then how would snooping switches work? >> >Would encrypting multicast not fundamentally break the concept of multicast itself, unless you're encrypting multicast traffic over a backbone? > > >Peter > > >

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[NANOG] Roport on internet business
by Takashi Tome 23 Dec '09

23 Dec '09

Hi All Morgan Stanley has released a very interesting report on internet business with some tips to net operators: http://www.morganstanley.com/institutional/techresearch/mobile_internet_rep… Regards Takashi Tome CPqD www.cpqd.com.br

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Re: news from Google
by Scott Weeks 22 Dec '09

22 Dec '09

--- math(a)sizone.org wrote: From: Ken Chase <math(a)sizone.org> topically related, it's actually news from Mozilla: http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9142106/Mozilla_exec_suggests_Firefo… from the horse's mouth, as it were. So, how bout that DNS. -------------------------------------------- Um, yeah. Them there micro$loth folks is WAAAAYYYY more privacy oriented than them google rascals. DBS scott

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please help - survey on network operations costs
by Nick Feamster 22 Dec '09

22 Dec '09

Hello, We are developing a tool that helps ISPs optimize for cost when making decisions about both internal routing and interconnection for planning and traffic management. To develop the underlying algorithms, we need a better sense of how various factors contribute to an ISP's overall operational costs. Our objective is not to obtain specific numbers---we understand that individual ISPs may have very confidential information about pricing, and that you may not want to share that with us. Rather, we are seeking to build a model that any operator could use by plugging in specific numbers. Constructing this model still requires some understanding of the relative costs of various factors. We would appreciate any help you can provide. In return, we will (1) share the results of the survey with you (after anonymizing appropriately); (2) work with you to apply our optimization technique to your network to see if it can help reduce your overall costs. Thank you very much for any help you can provide, Nick and Murtaza ------------------------------------- 1. Are you a: * access ISP network * transit provider * content distribution network * other (please specify) 2. How do you account for recurring costs incurred in carrying IP traffic on your backbone? Do you incorporate both backhaul and interconnect costs? Which one of these factors tends to be more dominant? Are there other factors that are significant enough to consider explicitly? (If you have a template cost model, that would be very helpful.) 3. What are the relative costs of each of the following for interconnection? (If you feel comfortable doing so, please rank them.) * port/interface costs (e.g., 1G, 10G, etc.) * type of transmission (e.g., IP, WDM, SONET, etc.) * transit costs * others (please specify) 4. What factors affect internal network costs for carrying traffic? * port/interface costs * distance travelled (e.g., # of hops, geography - local, regional, backbone, trans-continental) * real estate costs (e.g., carrier hotel, fiber leasing...) * traffic demand or congestion in a region (e.g., is northeast corridor more expensive than other parts of the network?) * other (please specify) 5. When pricing your own IP connectivity services, do you use average cost models? Do you use the same cost structure for each customer, regardless of how much of your backbone and interconnect infrastructure they use?

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Re: NANOG Digest, Vol 23, Issue 82
by Rodriguez, Mauricio 22 Dec '09

22 Dec '09

Any time mobile. Regards, Mauricio Rodriguez Manager of IP/Data Engineering, FPL FiberNet Email: Mauricio.Rodriguez(a)fpl.com Office: 305-552-3418 Mobile: 786-236-2665 Pager: 786-236-2665 Sent using BlackBerry ----- Original Message ----- From: nanog-request(a)nanog.org <nanog-request(a)nanog.org> To: nanog(a)nanog.org <nanog(a)nanog.org> Sent: Tue Dec 22 08:33:01 2009 Subject: NANOG Digest, Vol 23, Issue 82 Send NANOG mailing list submissions to nanog(a)nanog.org To subscribe or unsubscribe via the World Wide Web, visit http://mailman.nanog.org/mailman/listinfo/nanog or, via email, send a message with subject or body 'help' to nanog-request(a)nanog.org You can reach the person managing the list at nanog-owner(a)nanog.org When replying, please edit your Subject line so it is more specific than "Re: Contents of NANOG digest..." Today's Topics: 1. Re: how it routes and network question (Deric Kwok) 2. Re: how it routes and network question (Truman Boyes) 3. RE: how it routes and network question (Bruce Forster) 4. RE: how it routes and network question (Bruce Forster) 5. Re: Article on spammers and their infrastructure (Tony Finch) 6. Re: how it routes and network question (Kieran Murphy) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Message: 1 Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 07:31:58 -0500 From: Deric Kwok <deric.kwok2000(a)gmail.com> Subject: Re: how it routes and network question To: Bruce Forster <bruce(a)tubes.net.au> Cc: nanog(a)nanog.org Message-ID: <40d8a95a0912220431p7232025bx338affded04c8bd0(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Hi Bruce Thank you so much to explain me in detail. I would like to know about this it in case i can get another hosting company Yes. I think the netmask should be 255.255.255.255 1/ but why they are using this netmask setting? save ip address? then does the router handle many routes in this setting? 2/ What is this advantage for the hosting company? 3/ If I need more ip in the same server, how it works? 4/ Why you said the hosting company is cheap to use this configuration? Thank you again. > > <SNIP> > 2/ lf ?the network card in server has problem and need change another > one, will my ip address change to another ip address also? > </SNIP> > Yeah well thats how dhcp works, via ma caddy, i guess you can always spoof > your old mac address. > > <SNIP> > 3/ why hosting company is using /32 and dhcp? what is advantage? ls it > easy for administration? > </SNIP> > Im guessing because the users are to stupid to understand what a subnet > mask/gateway is its just easier to get the mac address and assign it to a > user then let the user assign a ip. > > > Normally in a co-location setup its not like this, inless its very cheap > hosting. > > My co-location has the following setup, and this is how MOST networks should > be run. > > Core router using BGP to transit providers, and other local peers. > Switched network useing ospf to handle the routes and also VLAN's for the > customers subnets. > > So customer should get a vlan assigned to them (which they have no need to > know what the number is, they are handed a access mode port. > Customers also issued a /30 (at least) in most cases a customer will get a > /29 or /28 depending on what they need. > In this case of a /30 its a total of 3 address's > 1, GATEWAY (put on the ISP/HOST switch > 2, IP ADDRESS FOR SERVER TO USE > 3, BROADCAST ADDRESS. > > Heres an eg of a /30: > > Address: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 > Netmask: ? 255.255.255.252 = 30 11111111.11111111.11111111.111111 00 > Wildcard: ?0.0.0.3 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?00000000.00000000.00000000.000000 11 > => > Network: ? 192.168.1.0/30 ? ? ? 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 00 > HostMin: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 > HostMax: ? 192.168.1.2 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 10 > Broadcast: 192.168.1.3 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 11 > Hosts/Net: 2 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Class C, Private Internet > > > Heres an eg of a /29: > > the % ipcalc 192.168.1.1/29 > Address: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 > Netmask: ? 255.255.255.248 = 29 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111 000 > Wildcard: ?0.0.0.7 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?00000000.00000000.00000000.00000 111 > => > Network: ? 192.168.1.0/29 ? ? ? 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 000 > HostMin: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 > HostMax: ? 192.168.1.6 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 110 > Broadcast: 192.168.1.7 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 111 > Hosts/Net: 6 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Class C, Private Internet > > Hope this makes sence. > > Regards, > > Bruce > > > ------------------------------ Message: 2 Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 23:47:11 +1100 From: Truman Boyes <truman(a)suspicious.org> Subject: Re: how it routes and network question To: Deric Kwok <deric.kwok2000(a)gmail.com> Cc: nanog(a)nanog.org Message-ID: <AEFCAD09-B29B-4349-A57C-E6AC3E860DAF(a)suspicious.org> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=us-ascii Hi, your "hosting company" is likely NAT'ing or using load balancers on the front end. You are obviously not "reaching" those machines by ssh'ing into 192.168.x.x... Additionally, assuming that DHCP is handing out that address on the server that mask would likely not be all ones. Even Amazon EC2 instances use private addresses now on the backend ... Kind regards, Truman On 22/12/2009, at 11:31 PM, Deric Kwok wrote: > Hi Bruce > > Thank you so much to explain me in detail. I would like to know about > this it in case i can get another hosting company > > Yes. I think the netmask should be 255.255.255.255 > 1/ but why they are using this netmask setting? save ip address? > then does the router handle many routes in this setting? > 2/ What is this advantage for the hosting company? > 3/ If I need more ip in the same server, how it works? > 4/ Why you said the hosting company is cheap to use this configuration? > > Thank you again. > > > > > >> >> <SNIP> >> 2/ lf the network card in server has problem and need change another >> one, will my ip address change to another ip address also? >> </SNIP> >> Yeah well thats how dhcp works, via ma caddy, i guess you can always spoof >> your old mac address. >> >> <SNIP> >> 3/ why hosting company is using /32 and dhcp? what is advantage? ls it >> easy for administration? >> </SNIP> >> Im guessing because the users are to stupid to understand what a subnet >> mask/gateway is its just easier to get the mac address and assign it to a >> user then let the user assign a ip. >> >> >> Normally in a co-location setup its not like this, inless its very cheap >> hosting. >> >> My co-location has the following setup, and this is how MOST networks should >> be run. >> >> Core router using BGP to transit providers, and other local peers. >> Switched network useing ospf to handle the routes and also VLAN's for the >> customers subnets. >> >> So customer should get a vlan assigned to them (which they have no need to >> know what the number is, they are handed a access mode port. >> Customers also issued a /30 (at least) in most cases a customer will get a >> /29 or /28 depending on what they need. >> In this case of a /30 its a total of 3 address's >> 1, GATEWAY (put on the ISP/HOST switch >> 2, IP ADDRESS FOR SERVER TO USE >> 3, BROADCAST ADDRESS. >> >> Heres an eg of a /30: >> >> Address: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 >> Netmask: 255.255.255.252 = 30 11111111.11111111.11111111.111111 00 >> Wildcard: 0.0.0.3 00000000.00000000.00000000.000000 11 >> => >> Network: 192.168.1.0/30 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 00 >> HostMin: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 >> HostMax: 192.168.1.2 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 10 >> Broadcast: 192.168.1.3 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 11 >> Hosts/Net: 2 Class C, Private Internet >> >> >> Heres an eg of a /29: >> >> the % ipcalc 192.168.1.1/29 >> Address: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 >> Netmask: 255.255.255.248 = 29 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111 000 >> Wildcard: 0.0.0.7 00000000.00000000.00000000.00000 111 >> => >> Network: 192.168.1.0/29 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 000 >> HostMin: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 >> HostMax: 192.168.1.6 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 110 >> Broadcast: 192.168.1.7 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 111 >> Hosts/Net: 6 Class C, Private Internet >> >> Hope this makes sence. >> >> Regards, >> >> Bruce >> >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 3 Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 22:48:04 +1000 From: "Bruce Forster" <bruce(a)tubes.net.au> Subject: RE: how it routes and network question To: "'Deric Kwok'" <deric.kwok2000(a)gmail.com> Cc: nanog(a)nanog.org Message-ID: <001701ca8305$0c8a3620$259ea260$(a)net.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="iso-8859-1" <SNIP> Yes. I think the netmask should be 255.255.255.255 1/ but why they are using this netmask setting? save ip address? then does the router handle many routes in this setting? </SNIP> I have no idea the only way you can have a /32 is with a ppp that doesn?t use arps to talk to each end of the tunnel. I would assume they have /24's and are giving out /32 via dhcp to customers and the customers should see 255.255.255.0 with a gateway of eg, .1 etc.. <SNIP> 2/ What is this advantage for the hosting company? </SNIP> If the company is setup the way i think it is the only reason for this is: 1, they have no clue what they are doing 2, they offer a very cheap hosting service and have no managed switches, and don?t understand how to subnet and use vlan's. <SNIP> 3/ If I need more ip in the same server, how it works? </SNIP> I would of thought if you have 2 x servers you wanted to co-locate the hosting company would offer you a /29 with 1 gateway 1 broadcast and 4 useable on a vlan, so local traffic only sits on the vlan and the servers can talk to each other via the local vlan. I guess if the machines have more then 1 nic you can connect the 2 machines via a local 'backnet' network it can be useful if you have a cross-over cable between the 2 x machines and its a 1GB port. This also saves using the switches, in some cases hosting companies may count all traffic that goes over the interface (if they don?t use net flow) and you could end up paying for traffic which you really shouldn?t have to pay for. If you are using the additional ports for high amounts of data eg, backup's images etc, you can really tweak tcp settings so you can send JUMBO frames and squeeze some speed out of it. <SNIP> 4/ Why you said the hosting company is cheap to use this configuration? </SNIP> Yes its alot cheaper to have say a common-gateway that all traffic will route over and then connect a bunch of switches to this common router and manage it via dhcp, its very messy and also very noisy i can only imagine after you connect a few servers that over time you will see arp storms and all traffic on the network will cease to flow. As mentioned in my other posts how it should be done, clearly you need to buy layer 3 switches and layer 2 switches and a nice core router to deal with your bgp, you also need to make sure your using devices that can handle high packets per second. As i am writing this i feel as if im doing someone homework for them... ;P Thank you again. > > <SNIP> > 2/ lf ?the network card in server has problem and need change another > one, will my ip address change to another ip address also? > </SNIP> > Yeah well thats how dhcp works, via ma caddy, i guess you can always spoof > your old mac address. > > <SNIP> > 3/ why hosting company is using /32 and dhcp? what is advantage? ls it > easy for administration? > </SNIP> > Im guessing because the users are to stupid to understand what a subnet > mask/gateway is its just easier to get the mac address and assign it to a > user then let the user assign a ip. > > > Normally in a co-location setup its not like this, inless its very cheap > hosting. > > My co-location has the following setup, and this is how MOST networks should > be run. > > Core router using BGP to transit providers, and other local peers. > Switched network useing ospf to handle the routes and also VLAN's for the > customers subnets. > > So customer should get a vlan assigned to them (which they have no need to > know what the number is, they are handed a access mode port. > Customers also issued a /30 (at least) in most cases a customer will get a > /29 or /28 depending on what they need. > In this case of a /30 its a total of 3 address's > 1, GATEWAY (put on the ISP/HOST switch > 2, IP ADDRESS FOR SERVER TO USE > 3, BROADCAST ADDRESS. > > Heres an eg of a /30: > > Address: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 > Netmask: ? 255.255.255.252 = 30 11111111.11111111.11111111.111111 00 > Wildcard: ?0.0.0.3 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?00000000.00000000.00000000.000000 11 > => > Network: ? 192.168.1.0/30 ? ? ? 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 00 > HostMin: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 > HostMax: ? 192.168.1.2 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 10 > Broadcast: 192.168.1.3 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 11 > Hosts/Net: 2 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Class C, Private Internet > > > Heres an eg of a /29: > > the % ipcalc 192.168.1.1/29 > Address: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 > Netmask: ? 255.255.255.248 = 29 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111 000 > Wildcard: ?0.0.0.7 ? ? ? ? ? ? ?00000000.00000000.00000000.00000 111 > => > Network: ? 192.168.1.0/29 ? ? ? 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 000 > HostMin: ? 192.168.1.1 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 > HostMax: ? 192.168.1.6 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 110 > Broadcast: 192.168.1.7 ? ? ? ? ?11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 111 > Hosts/Net: 6 ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? ? Class C, Private Internet > > Hope this makes sence. > > Regards, > > Bruce > > > ------------------------------ Message: 4 Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 22:51:20 +1000 From: "Bruce Forster" <bruce(a)tubes.net.au> Subject: RE: how it routes and network question To: "'Truman Boyes'" <truman(a)suspicious.org>, "'Deric Kwok'" <deric.kwok2000(a)gmail.com> Cc: nanog(a)nanog.org Message-ID: <001801ca8305$7d2f56d0$778e0470$(a)net.au> Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" I should add; i guess i made some assumption that you were co-locating your own servers with someone, if this isn't the case, please ignore everything i'v said ;) -bruce -----Original Message----- From: Truman Boyes [mailto:truman@suspicious.org] Sent: Tuesday, 22 December 2009 10:47 PM To: Deric Kwok Cc: Bruce Forster; nanog(a)nanog.org Subject: Re: how it routes and network question Hi, your "hosting company" is likely NAT'ing or using load balancers on the front end. You are obviously not "reaching" those machines by ssh'ing into 192.168.x.x... Additionally, assuming that DHCP is handing out that address on the server that mask would likely not be all ones. Even Amazon EC2 instances use private addresses now on the backend ... Kind regards, Truman On 22/12/2009, at 11:31 PM, Deric Kwok wrote: > Hi Bruce > > Thank you so much to explain me in detail. I would like to know about > this it in case i can get another hosting company > > Yes. I think the netmask should be 255.255.255.255 > 1/ but why they are using this netmask setting? save ip address? > then does the router handle many routes in this setting? > 2/ What is this advantage for the hosting company? > 3/ If I need more ip in the same server, how it works? > 4/ Why you said the hosting company is cheap to use this configuration? > > Thank you again. > > > > > >> >> <SNIP> >> 2/ lf the network card in server has problem and need change another >> one, will my ip address change to another ip address also? >> </SNIP> >> Yeah well thats how dhcp works, via ma caddy, i guess you can always spoof >> your old mac address. >> >> <SNIP> >> 3/ why hosting company is using /32 and dhcp? what is advantage? ls it >> easy for administration? >> </SNIP> >> Im guessing because the users are to stupid to understand what a subnet >> mask/gateway is its just easier to get the mac address and assign it to a >> user then let the user assign a ip. >> >> >> Normally in a co-location setup its not like this, inless its very cheap >> hosting. >> >> My co-location has the following setup, and this is how MOST networks should >> be run. >> >> Core router using BGP to transit providers, and other local peers. >> Switched network useing ospf to handle the routes and also VLAN's for the >> customers subnets. >> >> So customer should get a vlan assigned to them (which they have no need to >> know what the number is, they are handed a access mode port. >> Customers also issued a /30 (at least) in most cases a customer will get a >> /29 or /28 depending on what they need. >> In this case of a /30 its a total of 3 address's >> 1, GATEWAY (put on the ISP/HOST switch >> 2, IP ADDRESS FOR SERVER TO USE >> 3, BROADCAST ADDRESS. >> >> Heres an eg of a /30: >> >> Address: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 >> Netmask: 255.255.255.252 = 30 11111111.11111111.11111111.111111 00 >> Wildcard: 0.0.0.3 00000000.00000000.00000000.000000 11 >> => >> Network: 192.168.1.0/30 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 00 >> HostMin: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 >> HostMax: 192.168.1.2 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 10 >> Broadcast: 192.168.1.3 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 11 >> Hosts/Net: 2 Class C, Private Internet >> >> >> Heres an eg of a /29: >> >> the % ipcalc 192.168.1.1/29 >> Address: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 >> Netmask: 255.255.255.248 = 29 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111 000 >> Wildcard: 0.0.0.7 00000000.00000000.00000000.00000 111 >> => >> Network: 192.168.1.0/29 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 000 >> HostMin: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 >> HostMax: 192.168.1.6 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 110 >> Broadcast: 192.168.1.7 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 111 >> Hosts/Net: 6 Class C, Private Internet >> >> Hope this makes sence. >> >> Regards, >> >> Bruce >> >> >> > ------------------------------ Message: 5 Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 13:08:18 +0000 From: Tony Finch <dot(a)dotat.at> Subject: Re: Article on spammers and their infrastructure To: Phil Regnauld <regnauld(a)nsrc.org> Cc: nanog(a)nanog.org Message-ID: <alpine.LSU.2.00.0912221308040.3461(a)hermes-1.csi.cam.ac.uk> Content-Type: TEXT/PLAIN; charset=US-ASCII On Tue, 22 Dec 2009, Phil Regnauld wrote: > http://threatpost.com/en_us/blogs/attackers-buying-own-data-centers-botnets… > > It this something new ? The article seems to mix various issues together. > And this would seem highly inefficient to me compared to traditional > botnets (renting your own rack for a botnet doesn't really make sense :) > > Comments ? Sounds like a snowshoe setup to me. Tony. -- f.anthony.n.finch <dot(a)dotat.at> http://dotat.at/ GERMAN BIGHT HUMBER: SOUTHWEST 5 TO 7. MODERATE OR ROUGH. SQUALLY SHOWERS. MODERATE OR GOOD. ------------------------------ Message: 6 Date: Tue, 22 Dec 2009 13:32:58 +0000 From: Kieran Murphy <daffy(a)daffy.za.net> Subject: Re: how it routes and network question To: Bruce Forster <bruce(a)tubes.net.au> Cc: nanog(a)nanog.org Message-ID: <ae774e0c0912220532g4d0928e4r4f4cfc6606324b75(a)mail.gmail.com> Content-Type: text/plain; charset=ISO-8859-1 Or these are VPS', and not physical Servers. >From my brief encounters with various VPS technologies, this makes more sense. Regards, Kieran. On Tue, Dec 22, 2009 at 12:51 PM, Bruce Forster <bruce(a)tubes.net.au> wrote: > I should add; i guess i made some assumption that you were co-locating your > own servers with someone, if this isn't the case, please ignore everything > i'v said ;) > > > -bruce > > -----Original Message----- > From: Truman Boyes [mailto:truman@suspicious.org] > Sent: Tuesday, 22 December 2009 10:47 PM > To: Deric Kwok > Cc: Bruce Forster; nanog(a)nanog.org > Subject: Re: how it routes and network question > > Hi, your "hosting company" is likely NAT'ing or using load balancers on the > front end. You are obviously not "reaching" those machines by ssh'ing into > 192.168.x.x... Additionally, assuming that DHCP is handing out that address > on the server that mask would likely not be all ones. > > Even Amazon EC2 instances use private addresses now on the backend ... > > Kind regards, > Truman > > > On 22/12/2009, at 11:31 PM, Deric Kwok wrote: > > > Hi Bruce > > > > Thank you so much to explain me in detail. I would like to know about > > this it in case i can get another hosting company > > > > Yes. I think the netmask should be 255.255.255.255 > > 1/ but why they are using this netmask setting? save ip address? > > then does the router handle many routes in this setting? > > 2/ What is this advantage for the hosting company? > > 3/ If I need more ip in the same server, how it works? > > 4/ Why you said the hosting company is cheap to use this configuration? > > > > Thank you again. > > > > > > > > > > > >> > >> <SNIP> > >> 2/ lf the network card in server has problem and need change another > >> one, will my ip address change to another ip address also? > >> </SNIP> > >> Yeah well thats how dhcp works, via ma caddy, i guess you can always > spoof > >> your old mac address. > >> > >> <SNIP> > >> 3/ why hosting company is using /32 and dhcp? what is advantage? ls it > >> easy for administration? > >> </SNIP> > >> Im guessing because the users are to stupid to understand what a subnet > >> mask/gateway is its just easier to get the mac address and assign it to > a > >> user then let the user assign a ip. > >> > >> > >> Normally in a co-location setup its not like this, inless its very cheap > >> hosting. > >> > >> My co-location has the following setup, and this is how MOST networks > should > >> be run. > >> > >> Core router using BGP to transit providers, and other local peers. > >> Switched network useing ospf to handle the routes and also VLAN's for > the > >> customers subnets. > >> > >> So customer should get a vlan assigned to them (which they have no need > to > >> know what the number is, they are handed a access mode port. > >> Customers also issued a /30 (at least) in most cases a customer will get > a > >> /29 or /28 depending on what they need. > >> In this case of a /30 its a total of 3 address's > >> 1, GATEWAY (put on the ISP/HOST switch > >> 2, IP ADDRESS FOR SERVER TO USE > >> 3, BROADCAST ADDRESS. > >> > >> Heres an eg of a /30: > >> > >> Address: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 > >> Netmask: 255.255.255.252 = 30 11111111.11111111.11111111.111111 00 > >> Wildcard: 0.0.0.3 00000000.00000000.00000000.000000 11 > >> => > >> Network: 192.168.1.0/30 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 00 > >> HostMin: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 01 > >> HostMax: 192.168.1.2 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 10 > >> Broadcast: 192.168.1.3 11000000.10101000.00000001.000000 11 > >> Hosts/Net: 2 Class C, Private Internet > >> > >> > >> Heres an eg of a /29: > >> > >> the % ipcalc 192.168.1.1/29 > >> Address: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 > >> Netmask: 255.255.255.248 = 29 11111111.11111111.11111111.11111 000 > >> Wildcard: 0.0.0.7 00000000.00000000.00000000.00000 111 > >> => > >> Network: 192.168.1.0/29 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 000 > >> HostMin: 192.168.1.1 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 001 > >> HostMax: 192.168.1.6 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 110 > >> Broadcast: 192.168.1.7 11000000.10101000.00000001.00000 111 > >> Hosts/Net: 6 Class C, Private Internet > >> > >> Hope this makes sence. > >> > >> Regards, > >> > >> Bruce > >> > >> > >> > > > > > > ------------------------------ _______________________________________________ NANOG mailing list NANOG(a)nanog.org http://mailman.nanog.org/mailman/listinfo/nanog End of NANOG Digest, Vol 23, Issue 82 *************************************

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how it routes and network question
by Deric Kwok 22 Dec '09

22 Dec '09

Hi I recently get two dedicated servers in hosting company the ip address of the server is eg: 192.168.32.4/32 and 192.168.57.2/32 I try to check the gateway but it seems no any trace command in the server. hosting company is using dhcp in those servers network configuration. I have concern and questions 1/ How can I know those servers are same network as those net mask is /32 if not the same network, I have problem when two servers are slowing in transferring files 2/ lf the network card in server has problem and need change another one, will my ip address change to another ip address also? 3/ why hosting company is using /32 and dhcp? what is advantage? ls it easy for administration? Thank you for your help

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