July 2004 - Test - lists.nanog.org

Scholarships available to International Spam Law & Policies conference
by Anne P. Mitchell, Esq. 17 Jul '04

17 Jul '04

All, We have had two more 'scholarships' donated to allow two people who could not otherwise do so to attend our "International Spam Law & Policies: The Global Case" conference (http://www.isipp.com/events.php) Topics include: "Issues and Solutions in Dealing with Borderless Activities in a Bordered World" "Doing the Right Thing: Email Compliance and Spam Enforcement Across Borders" "International Perspectives on the Growth of Spam and the Effectiveness of Laws vs. Technology" "Current and Future Trends in European Anti-Spam Policy and Efforts" "International Concerns Regarding Spam: A View from the U.N. WSIS Meeting, and What Identity Means in an International Online World" ..and a few more which I can't mention until the speakers providing them have cleared us to do so. If you'd like to apply for one of these to spots, please send email to conference(a)isipp.com, explaining how this conference is professionally relevant to you, why you personally want to attend, and anything else which you think is relevant. These scholarships cover the cost of attendance ($475.00 before any discount), but not travel, lodging or other expenses. Hotel rooms are available for about $90/night and up under our discount. Anne Anne P. Mitchell, Esq. President/CEO Institute for Spam and Internet Public Policy Professor of Law, Lincoln Law School of SJ Committee Member, Asilomar Microcomputer Workshop

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RE: Regional differences in P2P
by Michel Py 17 Jul '04

17 Jul '04

> Hank Nussbacher wrote: > For June 2004 (AS378 - Israel): > top 10 receiving ports > Rank Port Bytes in Gigabytes Packets > 1 smtp (25/tcp) 344 GB 759247104 > 2 edonkey (4662/tcp) 186 GB 442992500 > 3 5662/tcp 154 GB 252829581 Note that 5662/tcp is edonkey as well. It is used by popular mods: 1. http://download.yacapa.com/download/782.html eChanblard is a French modification of eMule (the leading eDonkey client) that allows to ignore users with LowID (the ones that don't share any files) 2. http://lists.gnu.org/archive/html/mldonkey-users/2003-05/msg00118.html 3. DNAT (don't know much about it) Michel.

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Controls are ineffective without user cooperation
by Sean Donelan 17 Jul '04

17 Jul '04

Donn S. Parker pointed out controls are ineffective without user cooperation. According to an AT&T sponsored survey, 78% of executives admitted to opening attachments from unknown senders in the last year, 29% used their own name or birthday as a "secure" password, 17% accessed the company network in a public place and didn't log out, 9% informally shared a network password with someone outside of the company. http://www.att.com/news/item/0,1847,13137,00.html The survey included relatively few people, 254 executives from Europe, North America ans Asia-Pacific regions.

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Re: Regional differences in P2P
by Mikael Abrahamsson 17 Jul '04

17 Jul '04

On Fri, 16 Jul 2004, Florian Weimer wrote: > Private FTP sites seem to be more common among those who trade > unlicensed, copyrighted material for profit. This is clearly > criminal. Certainly this isn't what your average P2P user is doing. Has anyone ever done a money trail investigation regarding this? The only people I ever thought was making money off of copyrighted material was the people selling "warez CDs" in the small ads in the paper, and that was 5-8 ago. Back then it was quite common for people to pay to get a CDR with stuff, I haven't heard about that in a long time now. I would believe that most of the money now being made is from counterfit software where people put up basically a whole organisation with printing presses for manuals, real CD/DVD pressing equipment and perhaps even the holographic mark, and shrinkwrap it all and sell it as the real thing. That has very little to do with p2p, though. I am not aware of any money changing hands in p2p. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike(a)swm.pp.se

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RE: Looking for recommendations for Datacenter off CA Faultline
by Michel Py 16 Jul '04

16 Jul '04

> Jonathan Nichols > www.ragingwire.com > Their data center is not near any fault lines. In fact, > it's not near much of anything... except Sacramento. :) Yep. Keep in mind that W.Tasman to Sacramento is a 2 hour drive at any given time and 3 1/2 hours on a Friday afternoon. Also, if you enjoy night life, Sacramento is not the best location on earth. However, the seismic data is good and there's plenty of fiber, lots of companies have moved their data here because they don't want to be caught by "the big one" when it comes to the bay. Ragingwire has good reputation, but here are some other alternatives: http://www.level3.com/558.html http://www.heraklesdata.com/ http://www.icgcomm.com/products/corporate/colo.asp (heard some bad) http://www.datanoc.net/default.htm (heard some bad) http://www.o1.com/ (avoid at any cost) Michel.

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RE: Spyware becomes increasingly malicious
by Michel Py 16 Jul '04

16 Jul '04

> Paul Vixie wrote: > or, to put it in terms you can all understand: > "why does that provider's upstream still have bgp peers?" Maybe said upstream does not want to deal with TROs and legal issues? CWS is not illegal as of today. > if you give people the means to hurt you, and they do it, > and you take no action except to continue giving them the > means to hurt you, and they take no action except to keep > hurting you, then one of the ways you can describe the > situation is "it isn't scaling well." Could not agree more. Michel.

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RE: Regional differences in P2P
by Michel Py 16 Jul '04

16 Jul '04

> Steinar Haug wrote: > Telenor, the largest Norwegian service provider, capped their > ADSL customers at a ridiculously low 1 Gbyte/month for a > while. Presumably they lost sufficient business to other > (uncapped) providers that they noticed - the cap has now been > removed. Ridiculous is the word here. Download two service packs and you're done for the month? I can understand this happening in Brazil or India, where caps are a tool to attract enough customers so they bring revenue that in turn will be re-injected in much needed backbone upgrades, but in Norway or the US it does not make a lot of sense to me. >> Michel Py wrote: >> I agree, but see above: a 40GB/mo cap is not something that >> I care about. Granted, I'm not a hardcore file swapper but >> 40GB/mo are more > Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: > I don't know of any capped service over here, nobody dares > take the first step. The largest 10meg provider here launched > a new 100 meg full duplex service for their approx 200.000 > household reach at USD$110 a month with a 300G cap (their 10 > meg service for $45 a month is uncapped) and there has been > a fair amount of users complaining about 300G not being nearly > enough. When you start swapping DVDRs it just isn't. There is a need for capping 10 and 100 meg residential though; if you want to run your 100 Mb/s pipe full all the time it represents 26TB per month in each direction; you can't give 2/3rds of an OC-3 to a customer for $110/mo. A 300GB/mo cap means that the customer is using their line an average of 1.15%, which brings the interesting question of what a reasonable speed/cap ration should be. 1.5 Mb/s = 389 GB/mo 10 Mb/s = 2.6 TB/mo 100 Mb/s = 26 TB/mo Speed/cap ratios: 1.5 Mb/s capped at 1 GB/mo = 0.25% ridiculous IMHO 10 Mb/s capped at 40 GB/mo = 1.54% 100 Mb/s capped at 300 GB/mo = 1.15% Thoughts, anyone? Michel.

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OT? experience with time warner telecom?
by Matt Hess 16 Jul '04

16 Jul '04

Apologies if this is off topic but we are looking at time warner telecom for an upstream connection and I would like to get some info as to people's experience with this group.. good or bad. Off-list is fine.. especially if this is indeed OT.

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as path filtering -- cisco implementation
by Philip Lavine 16 Jul '04

16 Jul '04

Is inbound as-path filtering an efficient way of preventing routes from entering your bgp table? How come the filtered routes still show up in the bgp table and not in the routing table? What is hit on the CPU? __________________________________ Do you Yahoo!? New and Improved Yahoo! Mail - Send 10MB messages! http://promotions.yahoo.com/new_mail

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RE: Regional differences in P2P
by Michel Py 16 Jul '04

16 Jul '04

> Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: > I would also like to add that over here Direct Connect is > quite common among the more organized and hard-core file > swappers, while the really-hardcore guys of course are > still using private ftp servers. There is some private FTP server use in the US as well; it is difficult to measure the bandwidth it uses, as it often involves encryption and therefore is inventoried as miscellaneous traffic by probes. I am not a hardcore file swapper, but like everyone else I granted access to my FTP to a few buddies. However, it works only over VPN: no static IP and no encryption, no FTP (there also is an unwritten clause about red wine). I believe that Europeans tend to underestimate American private FTP usage (and vice-versa) because it is more difficult for someone from the other side of the pond to penetrate the relatively private circles of private FTP file sharing. > With proliferation of 10 meg ethernet (full duplex) connections > for residential use in (especially) northern europe and in asia, > users are more likely to serve content to other users around the > world. Note that 10meg Ethernet full-duplex is becoming available in the US as well. Where I live (Sacramento, California) we have this: http://personal.surewest.com/internet/highspeed10mb.php Note that they cap the service at 40 GB/mo, which still is ~40 movies, more than I can watch :-) > My interpretation of this is that p2p networks are quite > intelligent in using the available bandwidth, and that > Copyright holders only solution is a "content crunch" due > to providers limiting their users upload potential due to > heavy usage, such as capping the amount of bandwidth > allowed per month or alike. I agree, but see above: a 40GB/mo cap is not something that I care about. Granted, I'm not a hardcore file swapper but 40GB/mo are more than enough for most including myself. As shown here: http://arneill-py.sacramento.ca.us/mrtg/192.168.222.1_et0_0.html My usage last month was 2 GB and the average over the last 20 months was 8GB/mo. And I do share some files. > Petri Helenius wrote: > If you leave BitTorrent out, which is probably the fastest > growing protocol out there, the statistics are missing about > one third of the bits moved. BitTorrent is a third of p2p traffic in Sweden? Wow. In the US it is a small blip on the radar. My reading about the big five is as follows: +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! Protocol ! Typical client ! Comments ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! FastTrack ! Kazaa ! Declines everywhere. Privacy concerns ! ! ! ! are killing it in the US. ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! WinMX ! Winmx ! Stable client, stable market share. ! ! ! ! Fit for MP3s, not for warez or movies ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! Gnutella ! various, a mess ! Doomed to disappear sooner or later. ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! eDonkey ! mostly eMule ! Fastest rising in the US (at the ! ! ! now ! expense of FastTrack, mostly). There ! ! ! ! are more than one client but it's not ! ! ! ! a mess like Gnutella. Fit for large ! ! ! ! files, for MP3s initial queing has ! ! ! ! pushed lots of users back to WinMX ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! BitTorrent ! BitTorrent ! New; reported fit both for large ! ! ! ! files and MP3s however privacy ! ! ! ! concerns are as high as Kazaa and the ! ! ! ! interface is not nearly as polished ! ! ! ! as WinMX or eMule. Too early to call. ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ Crystal ball reading: Gnutella will disappear. WinMX and eDonkey will eventually eat FastTrack (numerous swappers use both WinMX and eMule); BitTorrent is an outsider. Regional differences between Western Europe and North America will blend; Asia/Pacific too early to make predictions. Michel.

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