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Am I crazy!?
by Jason Lixfeld 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

Good thing this router isn't in production yet, but unless I'm crazy, Telus is having a bad day: *>i0.0.0.0 64.201.161.218 100 0 20161 852 i Can anyone who's directly connected to AS852 verify before I call them and.. uhm.. recommend my consulting services? BTW: Just going to mention that is router is pre-production so I haven't put my bogon filters in yet, incase anyone wants to harp on me for not filtering this nonsense. BBTW: If anyone from TeraGo reads this... uhm... well, you know the drill...

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FWD: New IANA IPv4 allocation for APNIC (124/8, 125/8, 126/8)
by Fergie (Paul Ferguson) 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

....so please adjust your bogon filters. :-) - ferg -- Doug Barton <barton(a)iana.org> wrote: -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 Greetings, This is to inform you that the IANA has allocated the following three (3) IPv4 /8 blocks to APNIC: 124/8 APNIC 125/8 APNIC 126/8 APNIC For a full list of IANA IPv4 allocations please see: <http://www.iana.org/assignments/ipv4-address-space> - -- Doug Barton General Manager, The Internet Assigned Numbers Authority -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.0 (FreeBSD) iD8DBQFB+UfKwtDPyTesBYwRAiFLAJwPunYfqYEZzru+Zhpo3Tzf0kF75QCgoN14 OXCHaZBmTrtvRdSRjxt9VZQ= =KaeV -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- "Fergie", a.k.a. Paul Ferguson Engineering Architecture for the Internet fergdawg(a)netzero.net or fergdawg(a)sbcglobal.net

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Resilience: faults, causes, statistics, open issues
by András Császár (IJ/ETH) 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

Hi people! I've begun research on (carrier-grade, aka telecom-grade) resiliency in IP transport networks. The first step would be to collect possible failure events, their causes and consequences, statistics about downtimes (mean time to repair) and mean times between failures, and I would like to identify which of the problems are most typical (HW bug, SW bug, cable cut through, plugged out (link going down), severe misconfiguration). I think this is the perfect forum to get some feedback from real network-operational experience. Is anyone out there who has some statistics/documents that would help me in any way? Also, do you have any suggestions on open research issues to be solved in the area? Any thoughts on your mind or comments would be most welcome! Thanks! András

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High Density Multimode Runs BCP?
by Deepak Jain 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

I have a situation where I want to run Nx24 pairs of GE across a datacenter to several different customers. Runs are about 200meters max. When running say 24-pairs of multi-mode across a datacenter, I have considered a few solutions, but am not sure what is common/best practice. a) Find/adapt a 24/48 thread inside-plant cable (either multimode, or condition single mode) and connectorize the ends. Adv: Clean, Single, high density cable runs, Dis: Not sure if such a beast exists in multimode, and the whole cable has to be replaced/made redundant if one fiber dies and you need a critical restore, may need a break out shelf. b) Run 24 duplex MM cables of the proper lengths. Adv: Easy to trace, color code, understand. Easy to replace/repair one cable should something untoward occur. Can buy/stock pre-terminated cables of the proper length for easy restore. Dis: Lots of cables, more riser space. c) ?? ---- So... is there an option C? Does a multimode beastie like A exist commonly? Is it generally more cost effective to terminate your own MM cables or buy them pre-terminated? Assume that each of these pairs is going to be used for something like 1000B-SX full duplex, and that these are all aggregated trunk links so you can't take a single pair of 1000B-SX and break it out to 24xGE at the end points with a switch. I priced up one of these runs at 100m, and I was seeing a list price in the ballpark of $2500-$3000 plenum. So I figured it was worth asking if there is a better way when we're talking about N times that number. :) Thanks in advance, I'm sure I just haven't had enough caffeine today. DJ

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RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP?
by Hannigan, Martin 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

> -----Original Message----- > From: Scott McGrath [mailto:mcgrath@fas.harvard.edu] > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 10:44 PM > To: Hannigan, Martin > Cc: nanog(a)merit.edu > Subject: RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP? > > > > Hi, Martin > > Yes indeed the ribbon cable. Tho' due to the damage factor I probably > would not specify it again unless I could use innerduct to > protect it as > we had some machine room renovations done and the construction workers > managed to kink the underfloor runs as well as setting off the Halon > system several times... > > > The ribbon cables work well if they are adequately protected. If the > people in the machine room environment are skilled at handling fiber > there should be no problems. If however J. Random Laborer > has access I > would go with conventional armored runs. Armored runs are for outside plant, or, inside plant that doesn't have adequate cable management. I've seen armored indoors as a "security" measure, but if you don't control your data center, you may as well save the money since armored cable is like locks, it keeps good people out. It may keep slack electricians from damaging it, but considering they are usually heavy industry, I wouldn't rely on it for that reason alone. :-) As I said earlier, ribbon isn't designed for data centers, nor is innerduct designed for ribbon. I'd love to see some photos of people using innerduct+ribbon cable. :-) YMMV. -M<

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RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP?
by Hannigan, Martin 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

Just in case some folks are wondering what we are talking about, here's a decent URL covering it: http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.tpub.com/neets/tm/30NVM053 .GIF&imgrefurl=http://www.tpub.com/neets/tm/107-8.htm&h=387&w=397&sz=13&tbni d=gGUI7fKu6OwJ:&tbnh=116&tbnw=119&start=16&prev=/images%3Fq%3Dfiber%2Bribbon %2Bcable%26hl%3Den%26lr%3D%26c2coff%3D1 -- Martin Hannigan (c) 617-388-2663 VeriSign, Inc. (w) 703-948-7018 Network Engineer IV Operations & Infrastructure hannigan(a)verisign.com > -----Original Message----- > From: Scott McGrath [mailto:mcgrath@fas.harvard.edu] > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 10:44 PM > To: Hannigan, Martin > Cc: nanog(a)merit.edu > Subject: RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP? > > > > Hi, Martin > > Yes indeed the ribbon cable. Tho' due to the damage factor I probably > would not specify it again unless I could use innerduct to > protect it as > we had some machine room renovations done and the construction workers > managed to kink the underfloor runs as well as setting off the Halon > system several times... > > > The ribbon cables work well if they are adequately protected. If the > people in the machine room environment are skilled at handling fiber > there should be no problems. If however J. Random Laborer > has access I > would go with conventional armored runs. > > > Scott C. McGrath > > On Wed, 26 Jan 2005, Hannigan, Martin wrote: > > > > > The ribbon cable? > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Martin Hannigan (c) 617-388-2663 > > VeriSign, Inc. (w) 703-948-7018 > > Network Engineer IV Operations & > Infrastructure > > hannigan(a)verisign.com > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > From: Scott McGrath [mailto:mcgrath@fas.harvard.edu] > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 6:44 PM > > > To: Hannigan, Martin > > > Cc: Thor Lancelot Simon; nanog(a)merit.edu > > > Subject: RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP? > > > > > > > > > > > > Hi, Thor > > > > > > We used it to create zone distribution points throughout our > > > datacenter's > > > which ran back to a central distribution point. This > > > solution has been > > > in place for almost 4 years. We have 10Gb SM ethernet links > > > traversing > > > the datacenter which link to the campus distribution center. > > > > > > The only downsides we have experienced are > > > > > > 1 - Lead time in getting the component parts > > > > > > 2 - easiliy damaged by careless contractors > > > > > > 3 - somewhat higher than normal back reflection > > > on poor terminations > > > > > > Scott C. McGrath > > > > > > On Wed, 26 Jan 2005, Hannigan, Martin wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > > From: Thor Lancelot Simon [mailto:tls@netbsd.org] > > > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 3:17 PM > > > > > To: Hannigan, Martin; nanog(a)merit.edu > > > > > Subject: Re: High Density Multimode Runs BCP? > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 26, 2005 at 02:49:29PM -0500, Hannigan, > Martin wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When running say 24-pairs of multi-mode across a > > > > > datacenter, I have > > > > > > > > considered a few solutions, but am not sure what is > > > > > > > common/best practice. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > I assume multiplexing up to 10Gb (possibly two links > > > > > thereof) and then > > > > > > > back down is cost-prohibitive? That's probably the > > > > > "best" practice. > > > > > > > > > > > > I think he's talking physical plant. 200m should be > > > fine. Consult > > > > > > your equipment for power levels and support distance. > > > > > > > > > > Sure -- but given the cost of the new physical plant > > > installation he's > > > > > talking about, the fact that he seems to know the present > > > maximum data > > > > > rate for each physical link, and so forth, I think it does > > > > > make sense to > > > > > ask the question "is the right solution to simply be more > > > economical > > > > > with physical plant by multiplexing to a higher data rate"? > > > > > > > > > > I've never used fibre ribbon, as advocated by someone else in > > > > > this thread, > > > > > and that does sound like a very clever space- and > > > possibly cost-saving > > > > > solution to the puzzle. But even so, spending tens of > > > thousands of > > > > > dollars to carry 24 discrete physical links hundreds of > > > > > meters across a > > > > > > > > Tens of thousands? 24 strand x 100' @ $5 = $500. Fusion splice > > > > is $25 per splice per strand including termination. The 100m > > > > patch chords are $100.00. It's cheaper to bundle and splice. > > > > > > > > How much does the mux cost? > > > > > > > > > > > > > datacenter, each at what is, these days, not a > > > particularly high data > > > > > rate, may not be the best choice. There may well be some > > > > > question about > > > > > at which layer it makes sense to aggregate the links -- > > > but to me, the > > > > > question "is it really the best choice of design > > > constraints to take > > > > > aggregation/multiplexing off the table" is a very > > > substantial one here > > > > > and not profitably avoided. > > > > > > > > Fiber ribbon doesn't "fit" in any long distance (+7') > distribution > > > > system, rich or poor, that I'm aware of. Racks, > cabinets, et. al. > > > > are not very conducive to it. The only application I've seen was > > > > IBM fiber channel. > > > > > > > > Datacenters are sometimes permanent facilities and it's better, > > > > IMHO, to make things more permanent with cross connect than > > > > aggregation. It enables you to make your cabinet cabling and > > > > your termination area cabling almost permanent and maintenance > > > > free - as well as giving you test,add, move, and drop. It's more > > > > cable, but less equipment to maintain, support, and reduces > > > > failure points. It enhances security as well. You can't open > > > > the cabinet and just jack something in. You have to provision > > > > behind the locked term area. > > > > > > > > I'd love to hear about a positive experience using ribbon cable > > > > inside a datacenter. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > > > > > > > > > >

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'Whois protection service'
by Mark Foster 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

Hi folks. Don't post a lot here but i'm figuring you folks will know more about this than my local NOG... When investigating a host that spammed me today, I noted that when I whois'd the domain that the mailserver involved has forward/reverse dns pair for, the domain whois information comes up as follows: Found crsnic referral to whois.enom.com. Registration Service Provided By: Registerfly.com Contact: support(a)registerflysupport.com Visit: http://www.RegisterFly.com Domain name: xmux.com Registrant Contact: RegisterFly.com - Ref# 14155933 Whois Protection Service - ProtectFly.com (14155933.fly(a)spamfly.com) I'm unsure how appropriate it is to post anything more specific in the open forum, but i've never seen this before. Whats the deal with hiding a domain name owners true identity? Is this not simply yet another protect-the-spammers mechanism? I followed up the chain - the authoritive DNS servers for the domain in question are hosts within a different domain, and this also has the same protection engaged.... Is this old hat or something new? Is this still conformant to standard .com/net registrant rules and regs? (here in .nz, the registry information is required to be current and valid, and i've never seen a Registrar pass itself off as the owner of a domain before (at least in any legitimate situation)) Thanks in advance, Mark.

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RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP?
by Scott McGrath 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

Hi, Martin Yes indeed the ribbon cable. Tho' due to the damage factor I probably would not specify it again unless I could use innerduct to protect it as we had some machine room renovations done and the construction workers managed to kink the underfloor runs as well as setting off the Halon system several times... The ribbon cables work well if they are adequately protected. If the people in the machine room environment are skilled at handling fiber there should be no problems. If however J. Random Laborer has access I would go with conventional armored runs. Scott C. McGrath On Wed, 26 Jan 2005, Hannigan, Martin wrote: > > The ribbon cable? > > > > > -- > Martin Hannigan (c) 617-388-2663 > VeriSign, Inc. (w) 703-948-7018 > Network Engineer IV Operations & Infrastructure > hannigan(a)verisign.com > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > From: Scott McGrath [mailto:mcgrath@fas.harvard.edu] > > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 6:44 PM > > To: Hannigan, Martin > > Cc: Thor Lancelot Simon; nanog(a)merit.edu > > Subject: RE: High Density Multimode Runs BCP? > > > > > > > > Hi, Thor > > > > We used it to create zone distribution points throughout our > > datacenter's > > which ran back to a central distribution point. This > > solution has been > > in place for almost 4 years. We have 10Gb SM ethernet links > > traversing > > the datacenter which link to the campus distribution center. > > > > The only downsides we have experienced are > > > > 1 - Lead time in getting the component parts > > > > 2 - easiliy damaged by careless contractors > > > > 3 - somewhat higher than normal back reflection > > on poor terminations > > > > Scott C. McGrath > > > > On Wed, 26 Jan 2005, Hannigan, Martin wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > From: Thor Lancelot Simon [mailto:tls@netbsd.org] > > > > Sent: Wednesday, January 26, 2005 3:17 PM > > > > To: Hannigan, Martin; nanog(a)merit.edu > > > > Subject: Re: High Density Multimode Runs BCP? > > > > > > > > > > > > On Wed, Jan 26, 2005 at 02:49:29PM -0500, Hannigan, Martin wrote: > > > > > > > > > > > > > > When running say 24-pairs of multi-mode across a > > > > datacenter, I have > > > > > > > considered a few solutions, but am not sure what is > > > > > > common/best practice. > > > > > > > > > > > > I assume multiplexing up to 10Gb (possibly two links > > > > thereof) and then > > > > > > back down is cost-prohibitive? That's probably the > > > > "best" practice. > > > > > > > > > > I think he's talking physical plant. 200m should be > > fine. Consult > > > > > your equipment for power levels and support distance. > > > > > > > > Sure -- but given the cost of the new physical plant > > installation he's > > > > talking about, the fact that he seems to know the present > > maximum data > > > > rate for each physical link, and so forth, I think it does > > > > make sense to > > > > ask the question "is the right solution to simply be more > > economical > > > > with physical plant by multiplexing to a higher data rate"? > > > > > > > > I've never used fibre ribbon, as advocated by someone else in > > > > this thread, > > > > and that does sound like a very clever space- and > > possibly cost-saving > > > > solution to the puzzle. But even so, spending tens of > > thousands of > > > > dollars to carry 24 discrete physical links hundreds of > > > > meters across a > > > > > > Tens of thousands? 24 strand x 100' @ $5 = $500. Fusion splice > > > is $25 per splice per strand including termination. The 100m > > > patch chords are $100.00. It's cheaper to bundle and splice. > > > > > > How much does the mux cost? > > > > > > > > > > datacenter, each at what is, these days, not a > > particularly high data > > > > rate, may not be the best choice. There may well be some > > > > question about > > > > at which layer it makes sense to aggregate the links -- > > but to me, the > > > > question "is it really the best choice of design > > constraints to take > > > > aggregation/multiplexing off the table" is a very > > substantial one here > > > > and not profitably avoided. > > > > > > Fiber ribbon doesn't "fit" in any long distance (+7') distribution > > > system, rich or poor, that I'm aware of. Racks, cabinets, et. al. > > > are not very conducive to it. The only application I've seen was > > > IBM fiber channel. > > > > > > Datacenters are sometimes permanent facilities and it's better, > > > IMHO, to make things more permanent with cross connect than > > > aggregation. It enables you to make your cabinet cabling and > > > your termination area cabling almost permanent and maintenance > > > free - as well as giving you test,add, move, and drop. It's more > > > cable, but less equipment to maintain, support, and reduces > > > failure points. It enhances security as well. You can't open > > > the cabinet and just jack something in. You have to provision > > > behind the locked term area. > > > > > > I'd love to hear about a positive experience using ribbon cable > > > inside a datacenter. > > > > > > > > > > > > > > Thor > > > > > > > > > >

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again: how to get an IP from EP.net
by Fredy Kuenzler 27 Jan '05

27 Jan '05

I'm a bit puzzled. Last week I filled in the form http://www.ep.net/ipadd-req.html to get an IP for PAIX-NYC. Received an automated response that the request has been submitted. No response yet after 4 or 5 days, but at http://www.e-gerbil.net/ras/ep all of a sudden our IP is listed. Is this really the official way to apply for an exchange IPv4 address (don't consider to apply ever for a IPv6 address). Or am I just too dumb to find the right track? Fredy Künzler Init Seven AG / AS13030

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Re: An open letter to Mike Delany, mdelany@databasecity.com
by Mark Andrews 26 Jan '05

26 Jan '05

Mike has claimed this was a hostest mistake. I'll take him at his word and apologise for this. Mark > To: "Mike Delany" <mdelany(a)databasecity.com> > > Thank you for spaming me. You have just been reported to > federal authorities (reportingspam(a)aca.gov.au) that may or > may not persue the matter further. You are in clear violation > of Australian law, "Spam Act 2003", > http://scaleplus.law.gov.au/html/comact/11/6735/top.htm. > > I should also report you to the US authorities because you > were also in violation of the US CAN-SPAM act. > > Received: from mail.databasecity.com (mail.databasecity.com [208.2.76.101]) > by sf1.isc.org (Postfix) with ESMTP id C8D4C2862F > for <Mark_Andrews(a)isc.org>; Wed, 26 Jan 2005 15:15:28 +0000 (UTC) > (envelope-from mdelany(a)databasecity.com) > > I posted this here because you clearly harvested by address from > a nanog mailing (including the entire contents of my last mailing > to the list was a sure give away). > > Mark > > -- > Mark Andrews, ISC > 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia > PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: Mark_Andrews(a)isc.org -- Mark Andrews, ISC 1 Seymour St., Dundas Valley, NSW 2117, Australia PHONE: +61 2 9871 4742 INTERNET: Mark_Andrews(a)isc.org

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