April 2003 - Test - lists.nanog.org

Re: Large tanks of pressurized hydrogen
by Herb Leong 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

Um, hydrogen fuel cell != pressurized tank of hydrogen Most sources of hydrogen for fuel cells will probably be from breaking down a hydrocarbon hootch of some sort, stealing the hydrogen and (hopefully) storing the rest for recycling... http://auto.howstuffworks.com/fuel-cell.htm If they are trying to make it safe for use in cars, then it probably going to be safe enough to use in a backup generator situation. /herb > -----Original Message----- > From: Eric Kuhnke [mailto:eric@fnordsystems.com] > Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 5:11 PM > To: nanog(a)merit.edu > Subject: Large tanks of pressurized hydrogen > > > > Greetings list, > > I recently ran across this company: > > http://www.hydrogenics.com/hyups.htm > > They're marketing a hydrogen fuel cell generator to the > telecom market. I > know they have a few competitors (Ballard Power Systems?), with more > companies in the R&D phase of product development. Would you > store a large > tank of pressurized hydrogen in a downtown Manhattan office > building? Should people legally be allowed to? Does anyone > think fuel > cell technology is a viable replacement for Diesel generators yet? > > NY Times article, 11/19/02 for those who haven't seen it yet: > http://ufalocal94.org/news_stories/nytimes/nytimes_11_19_02.html > >

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Large tanks of pressurized hydrogen
by Eric Kuhnke 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

Greetings list, I recently ran across this company: http://www.hydrogenics.com/hyups.htm They're marketing a hydrogen fuel cell generator to the telecom market. I know they have a few competitors (Ballard Power Systems?), with more companies in the R&D phase of product development. Would you store a large tank of pressurized hydrogen in a downtown Manhattan office building? Should people legally be allowed to? Does anyone think fuel cell technology is a viable replacement for Diesel generators yet? NY Times article, 11/19/02 for those who haven't seen it yet: http://ufalocal94.org/news_stories/nytimes/nytimes_11_19_02.html

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Re: Looking for advice on datacenter electrical/generator
by Vinny Abello 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

Just to give a working example, we currently have 2 redundant UPS's that typically will have over an hour runtime each (at current load) and an estimated 10 minute runtime each under a full load. Our generator and genset have us up on alternate power in approximately 10 seconds barring any odd problems with the generator, but a weekly exercise would typically identify a problem like this which can hopefully be corrected prior to needing the generator. A manual override of the transfer switch is possible if a failure should ever occur in that as well. HVAC is powered by the generator when it's running but not by UPS because of the tremendous draw it would have on the UPS's shortening battery runtime. 4 HVAC units usually keep it pretty cool, around or 60 degrees Fahrenheit so 10 seconds of all of them being off is not a problem. Even 10 minutes wouldn't raise the temperature all that much where it couldn't be cooled down rapidly when power is back online. Our currently fuel capacity (at current load) will allow us to run off generator for a few weeks without refueling. I'm sure this is all pretty standard for most people with similar setups. Hope this helps! At 03:37 PM 4/2/2003 -0800, you wrote: >Everyone, > >My organization is in a growth phase right now and within the next year >will find ourselves having outgrown our current 16KVa Symmetra. We have >comissioned an electrical engineer to make a recommendation as to what is >required to install a new 130Kva Liebert nPower UPS along with a generator. > >Our current plan is to purchase the UPS with a minimal amount of battery, >approximately 15min worth; just enough to get the generator running. Is >this the better way to go? Or should we consider more battery? What is >everyone's experience with the Liebert line of products? Any kudos or >gripes? Our electrical engineer also recommended that we purchase a >Generac generator and transfer switch. Any experiences with that company? > >He also is strongly opposed to us purchasing a natural gas generator which >seemed like a shoe-in for us. We have natual gas facilities and didn't >want to hassel with the diesel maintenance problems. Is a natual gas >generator something that we should consider? > >Additionally he recommneded that we place the HVAC and lighting upstream >from the UPS and use some sort of junction box to supply both the UPS load >and the HVAC. How do you "big guys" do it? Here is a link to the diagram >that he gave us today. Your thoughts are appreciated! > ><http://www.shastalink.k12.ca.us/nanog/nanog.jpg>http://www.shastalink.k12.ca.us/nanog/nanog.jpg > >Dan Lockwood >Microsoft Certified Professional >CompTIA Network+ Certified >Cisco Certified Network Associate > Vinny Abello Network Engineer Server Management vinny(a)tellurian.com (973)300-9211 x 125 (973)940-6125 (Direct) PGP Key Fingerprint: 3BC5 9A48 FC78 03D3 82E0 E935 5325 FBCB 0100 977A Tellurian Networks - The Ultimate Internet Connection http://www.tellurian.com (888)TELLURIAN There are 10 kinds of people in the world. Those who understand binary and those that don't.

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NANOG Splinter List (Was: State Super-DMCA Too True)
by Jack Bates 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

todd glassey wrote: > Actually I proposed that NANOG also consider several > splinter lists. Including one concerned with the Legal > Issues with operating network services, and since there are > jail terms being talked about I suggest that these are now > sub-organizations who's time as come. > I completely agree, Todd. I think that the legal aspects are relevant to NANOG, but there are some who feel that it is excess in their mailbox and deters them from the technical aspects of networking. -Jack

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sFLOW collector?
by Darrell Carley 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

I am trying to implement sflow in my network, and looking for a free sflow collector, that I can use to better see my peer to peer, and route utilization. Right now I have the problem of not knowing how much of my traffic is coming/going to what ASs. I have installed ntop so far, but don't see the tools/benefits that I am looking for to help me specifically with the BGP. Is there a plug-in that I am missing or something. If someone could point me in the right direction, or recommend another free collector that could help me out, I would greatly appreciate it. TIA, Darrell

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Router too busy???
by Mark J. Scheller 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

This last Saturday (29 Mar 2003), about 4pm Eastern time my router -- for lack of a better term -- wigged out. I was able to ping to & through it, however any attempt to get a TCP connection (specifically ssh and http) was almost immediately terminated. I think DNS was working fine, which would hint that UDP was getting through as well, but I won't swear to that in court. After convincing someone to drive to its location and do a power cycle, it rebooted happily and has run fine since. My mrtg graphs show that the CPU was pegged at 100% during the time it was acting up; memory was fine; traffic was (not surprisingly) very low -- and no spike prior to the CPU getting pegged. I've been running this version of IOS since it was released as a response to the flaw found in SNMP.... and the router has been rock solid! CPU is normally 15-20% with occasional spikes, but never for long. Memory erodes slowly, but never dropping below 20MB. Has anyone seen anything like this before? Basically, I'm wondering whether this may be an IOS bug or whether I may have hardware on its way out or whether this was some kind of new crafty DoS attack. TIA! Mark J. Scheller (scheller(a)u1.net)

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RE: AOL---
by McBurnett, Jim 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

Thanks to those that responded off-list I believe the issue has been handled... Jim -----Original Message----- From: McBurnett, Jim Sent: Wednesday, April 02, 2003 8:24 AM To: nanog(a)merit.edu Subject: AOL--- Is there anyone lurking out there from the AOL NOC? I have an issue I need to discuss with you without the voice mail roulette or number extension jeopardy.. Please respond off-list. Jim

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Re: [Re: Semi-OT: solicitations to nanog]
by Joshua Smith 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

i seem to remember other similar 'solicitations' by nanog members seeking to join up with fellow networkers in their local community, at the next arin/nanog/sushi/etc meeting...i don't think that this is really that much different. granted, i don't know how 'tasteful' it was, but i am sure that jeff has been sufficiently spammed^W informed about the situation. (maybe he was trying to pull some of the noise from the list to a social organization, thereby increasing the signal level for us to discuss more valid things like the comparing pe^H^Hego^H^H^Hrouter size) now is shall step back to let the next nanoger forth to desperately flail the pulpy carcass or this thing that used to be a fine equine Jack Bates <jbates(a)brightok.net> wrote: > > Joe wrote: > > So as not to cluter up the list, I've posted the response/thread > > of email I received regarding this, complete with the "explaination" > > so to speak. I don't buy it, but perhaps I'm missing something. > > http://www.rocknyou.com/nanogspam.html > > I was surprised to get a response none the less. > > > > In this particular case, reguardless of the Friendster TOS (which I > don't believe supported the action), it is (if I'm not mistaken) the > list maintainer's call concerning whether it was appropriate or not and > what action (if any) is needed. > > My personal opinion is that the list is designed to "bring people > together" and its membership is, I'm sure, aware that there are other > ways of communications which are often handled on a case by case basis > off-list (or perhaps the off-topic list depending on it's charter?). > > > -Jack > > "Walk with me through the Universe, And along the way see how all of us are Connected. Feast the eyes of your Soul, On the Love that abounds. In all places at once, seemingly endless, Like your own existence." - Stephen Hawking -

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Semi-OT: solicitations to nanog
by Dan Hollis 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

Just curious if anyone feels that jeff wheeler's friendster solicitation[1] was appropriate content for the nanog ml? -Dan -- [1]http://www.merit.edu/mail.archives/nanog/msg08799.html

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AOL---
by McBurnett, Jim 02 Apr '03

02 Apr '03

Is there anyone lurking out there from the AOL NOC? I have an issue I need to discuss with you without the voice mail roulette or number extension jeopardy.. Please respond off-list. Jim

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