- NANOG - lists.nanog.org

Re: FW: Photos of Palestinians celebrating World Trade Center attack
by Scott Gifford 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

Greg Mirsky <gmirsky(a)axiowave.com> writes: > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: Jeff Jacob <mailto:jeffj@mysticom.com> > To: Jeff Jacob <mailto:jeffj@mysticom.com> > Sent: Thursday, September 13, 2001 3:37 AM > Subject: Photos of Palestinians celebrating World Trade Center attack > > Notice that many of the Palestinians hold up their fingers in a gesture of > peace. > Is this the kind of cruel "peace" that they are advocating? > On NPR, one celebrating Palestinian was asked if he realized that over 50,000 people work in the World Trade Center. He replied, "No, no I didn't realize that" and stopped cheering. When you have a crowd celebrating, they don't always realize just what they're celebrating... ----ScottG.

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RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now.
by Roeland Meyer 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

|> From: Patrick Greenwell [mailto:patrick@cybernothing.org] |> Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 10:48 AM |> |> On Fri, 14 Sep 2001, David Klindt wrote: |> |> > > If you were one that infected the dog with rabies in the |> first place, you |> > > might consider ways to avoid doing so in the future to prevent |> > > reoccurances. |> > |> > Th dog has rabies... drop him....The USA can not and is |> not responsible |> > for every nuts problems. |> |> In the case of the U.S, they created the nut. The CIA |> trained and funded |> bin Laden. The U.S. also funded Hussein. |> |> I keep saying this over and over but it appears that it's |> not being heard. It's being heard. CIA and USAR trained me too, along with all the other Vietnam Era vets. I don't go around playing terrorist and neither do the rest of us. I've been a peacful engineer for 25 years. Ossama bin Ladin needs to become a peacful farmer, pushing up daisies. Those of us who fought terrorism in the '70's, learned more than we ever wanted to know about the subject. I have friends who still have nighmares (different response to DSS). Every one of them would go through it again, to safe-guard our civilization against terrorism. Talk about a dirty job, but it needs to be done, like whacking weeds. I'm sorry if this offends some sensibilities but, last Tuesday as a predictible result of letting the weeds grow too tall. Now, we have to go out there with a tractor and plow. BTW, those whom advocate indiscriminate killing, have no clue. With that point, I agree.

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Looking for a new ISP in London England
by Lee Watterworth 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

Hello, One of our current ISPs is already overpriced, and expects roughly $4000 for a simple BGP configuration, and an additional $350 monthly to maintain BGP. Our other ISPs handle BGP at no additional cost. Please email recommendations off-list. Thanks -Lee

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RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now.
by Greg Mirsky 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

And you add albanians-KLA to that list. Stupid foreign policy is not a topic of discussion right now. -----Original Message----- From: Patrick Greenwell [mailto:patrick@cybernothing.org] Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:48 PM To: David Klindt Cc: M. David Leonard; 'nanog(a)merit.edu' Subject: RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now. On Fri, 14 Sep 2001, David Klindt wrote: > > If you were one that infected the dog with rabies in the first place, you > > might consider ways to avoid doing so in the future to prevent > > reoccurances. > > Th dog has rabies... drop him....The USA can not and is not responsible > for every nuts problems. In the case of the U.S, they created the nut. The CIA trained and funded bin Laden. The U.S. also funded Hussein. I keep saying this over and over but it appears that it's not being heard.

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RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now.
by Borchers, Mark 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

I certainly agree that our country has an obligation to the victims and to the cause of justice to take some sort of action. However, I hope that in the event that more innocent lives are lost in the course of our response, that Americans will not revel and celebrate the way that we saw some Middle Easterners doing. I do not think the people we saw dancing in the streets on the news were typical Arab citizens. The typical observant Muslim is a monotheist with a high sense of ethics and considers terrorists to be.....terrorists. The better classes of Muslims are remarkably similar to the better classes of Americans. Unfortunately, we too have our share of bums who will be cheering on their barstools and consider it to be entertainment should the conflict spill over to impact innocents....as the terrorists very likely hope that it does. Ralph Los wrote: > > Ladies and gentlemen, I've been lurking around reading all > these 'love the > planet' emails, and I have to agree...killing is surely not > the answer - but > if you gave me an unlimited supply of rockets, and a lot of > killing power, > I'd point it at Afganistan and say....'Kill 'em all, let God > sort 'em out > later".......just my two cents...I had a friend who left his > wife a message > seconds before he died up there in south tower..."Honey, I'm > on the 92nd > floor and am not going to make it back to your arms alive - > remember I will > always love you" -then the line went dead....those words ring > through my > head over and over and over - I could have been there, so could you. > > True, there is no taking back what happened, but if GW > issued an act > of war, and did some re-arranging of the middle-east and the like, and > places like Afganistan, Iraq, and the Palestinian militant states > DISAPPEARED forever - no one, especially this blue-blooded > American would > shed a tear...and I as one...would see all the > psycho-terrorists to hell. > > Otherwise known as, > Dr. Blackfelt

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anybody know what's going on with att cable modems in MA?
by Miles Fidelman 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

A whole slew of ATT Broadband cable modems in the Greater Boston area have been off the air since midnight Tues. The folks at ATT have been less than useless in giving out any information. Does anybody know what's going on? Thanks much, Miles Fidelman ************************************************************************** The Center for Civic Networking PO Box 600618 Miles R. Fidelman, President & Newtonville, MA 02460-0006 Director, Municipal Telecommunications Strategies Program 617-558-3698 fax: 617-630-8946 mfidelman(a)civicnet.org http://civic.net/ccn.html Information Infrastructure: Public Spaces for the 21st Century Let's Start With: Internet Wall-Plugs Everywhere Say It Often, Say It Loud: "I Want My Internet!" **************************************************************************

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[OT] NTK now, 2001-09-14 (excerpt)
by J.D. Falk 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

http://www.ntk.net In these terrible times, it's good to watch the tech community put its problems aside, and supply what we were all so desperately short of: plenty of wild unsolicited opinions. After those first few hours of awful shocked silence - what a relief to be interrupted by the CEO of CoffeeCup Software, producers of an innocuous Windows HTML editor, e-mailing his 1.2 million customer base to "call for [the responsible] country's complete destruction and annihilation". And at the end of that fateful day, noted hacker Eric S. Raymond rained his thoughts like fresh water, revealing that those who "disarmed all the non-terrorists on those airplanes ... bear some moral responsibility". Thanks too to BYTE's Jerry Pournelle, who slowly toughened his demands from an early request that /usr/bin/laden be handed over "bound and chained", to Thursday's demand that Nablus, Gaza, Baghdad *and* Damascus be razed to the ground; to the Evening Standard infowar expert who warned that "inflamed young men" could escalate the conflict by releasing "cyber viruses, crashing our computers ... from council houses in Bradford"; and kindly John Keegan in the Telegraph, who wrote that ISPs should ban encryption among their users, and those who refused must be "destroyed with cruise missiles". And on through the lonely nights, as net.folk on chat traded credulous rumours and confused geopolitics, and Nostradamus buffs mulled seriously over a quatrain that, sadly, was probably invented by a skeptic to show how *any* random phrase could end up a doomladen prophecy. But be assured that the crisis is not yet over. Please help: opinions are still desperately needed - and bloggers, columnists and sleep-deprived newsreaders are running short of ideas. So: do you have some minority you'd like to haphazardly blame? Some half-arsed genocidal theory you'd like to insist become global policy? Some simplistic demonisation of a country's recent history that needs to be waved in the faces of everyone you know? Mail it to our hotline on devnull(a)spesh.com, and we'll pass it on to those who must fill the useless silence which would otherwise be wasted on slow, methodical grief. http://www.coffeecup.com/attack/ - "many e-mails thanking me for removing the word 'annihilation'" http://www.adequacy.org/?op=displaystory;sid=2001/9/12/102423/271 - Why the Bombings Mean That We Must Support My Politics http://www.jerrypournelle.com/war/whattodo.html - "There may be other places." http://www.dailytelegraph.co.uk/dt?pg=/01/9/14/do01.html - also, if their contention ratio goes above twenty, nuke 'em http://www.thisislondon.co.uk/dynamic/news/top_story.html?in_review_id=4569… - no hidden meaning in using Bradford as an example http://www.google.com/search?q=cache:www.ed.brocku.ca/~nmarshal/nostradamus… - search for "abstract" ----- End forwarded message ----- And, for the record, I agree that political stuff should be moved off of NANOG -- though I greatly appreciate the efforts of Sean Donelan and others to keep us all informed on how the disaster affects the Internet. -- J.D. Falk all good dreams return in time <jdfalk(a)cybernothing.org>

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RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now.
by Greg Mirsky 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

RE: celebrations BACKGROUND ---------- According to the AP, the Palestinians have been threatening news organizations and their workers in an effort to stop the broadcast of video and the publishing of photographs showing large crowds of Palestinians in Nablus and Ramallah joyfully celebrating the deadly terrorist attacks against Americans. Photographers and stringers (mostly Palestinians themselves) were forced by Palestinian gunmen to stop filming the celebrations (see the Agence France Press report below), and they were threatened with death if their video were broadcast. The news organizations they work for were told that everyone from their news organization would lose their access to PA officials and be unable to cover events in PA territory if they broadcast any video or photos of the large celebrations. (See reports below for more details). An AP photographer was specifically threatened with death if his photos were published. Here is the real news: THE AP HAS PUBLISHED A REPORT OF THE THREAT BUT HAS CAVED IN TO THE PA'S REQUEST not to publish these photos. So far we have only seen videos and photos of small crowds celebrating in eastern Jerusalem and Lebanon. At this moment, it looks like the Palestinian intimidation tactics are working to keep the most damning scenes from Ramallah and Nablus off American (and worldwide) television screens and out of the newspapers. Please urge AP and other news organizations to broadcast any video and/or photos they have of celebrations by Palestinian crowds in Nablus and Ramallah. Only by exposing and standing up to intimidation can it be stopped. Thank AP for publishing the story about the death threat to their videographer, but urge them to publish the photos. By appeasing those who threaten them, they are only encouraging further censorship and violence against their staff. * PA NEWSPAPER PRAISES SUICIDE BOMBERS: On a similar note, it is odd indeed that when Arafat's words of condolence were so widely broadcast by many in the media, so few in the press made note that on the very day of the attacks, the PA-controlled daily newspaper published an article praising suicide bombers as "the engines of history... the most honorable among us." See below for articles from AP, Agence France Press, IMRA, the Jerusalem Post, and PMW.

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RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now.
by Greg Mirsky 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

This is a LIE!!! I''ll forward pictures that are not from that tape. -----Original Message----- From: Patrick Greenwell [mailto:patrick@cybernothing.org] Sent: Friday, September 14, 2001 1:23 PM To: Borchers, Mark Cc: 'Los, Ralph'; 'Dmitri Krioukov'; 'Arman Khalili'; 'nanog(a)merit.edu' Subject: RE: Yes it's off topic but who cares right now. On Fri, 14 Sep 2001, Borchers, Mark wrote: > doing. I do not think the people we saw dancing in the streets > on the news were typical Arab citizens. You might find this very interesting: From: "Marcio A. V. de Carvalho" <marcio.carv(a)UOL.COM.BR> Subject: Fourth Power All around the world we are subjected to 3 or 4 huge news distributors, and one of them - as you well know - is CNN. Very well, I guess all of you have been seeing (just as I've been) images from this company. In particular, one set of images called my attencion: the Palestinians celebrating the bombing, out on the streets, eating some cake and making funny faces for the camera. Well, THOSE IMAGES WERE SHOT BACK IN 1991!!! Those are images of Palestinians celebrating the invasion of Kuwait! It's simply unacceptable that a super-power of cumminications as CNN uses images which do not correspond to the reality in talking about so serious an issue. A teacher of mine, here in Brazil, has videotapes recorded in 1991, with the very same images; he's been sending emails to CNN, Globo (the major TV network in Brazil) and newspapers, denouncing what I myself classify as a crime against the public opinion. If anyone of you has access to this kind of files, search for it. In the meanwhile, I'll try to 'put my hands' on a copy of this tape. But now, think for a moment about the impact of such images. Your people is hurt, emotionally fragile, and this kind broadcast have very high possibility of causing waves of anger and rage against Palestinians. It's simply irresponsible to show images such as those. ____________ ------- End of forwarded message ------- De Balie Kleine gartmanplantsoen 10 1017 RR Amsterdam t 020 55 35 151 f 020 55 35 155 e lucas.evers(a)balie.nl ______________________________________________________ * Verspreid via nettime-nl. Commercieel gebruik niet * toegestaan zonder toestemming. <nettime-nl> is een * open en ongemodereerde mailinglist over net-kritiek. * Meer info, archief & anderstalige edities: * http://www.nettime.org/. * Contact: Menno Grootveld (rabotnik(a)xs4all.nl) ==============End of original message text===========

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new mailing list: nanog-offtopic
by Nathan J . Mehl 14 Sep '01

14 Sep '01

I have created a mailing list, nanog-offtopic(a)lists.blank.org. It's only natural that, as a community of people as well as a gathering of professional peers, we would feel the need to discuss the non-operational aspects of events like the WTC bombing (and even ones of far lesser magnitude) with the same people who's opinions we value on technical topics. Unfortunatly, there's no escaping that it swamps the signal-to-noise ratio on the main list. I would like to extend an invitation to any and all nanog(a)merit.edu members to subscribe, and continue the various fascinating (seriously) side-discussions we've been having there. Agreement with my personal views is not a criterion for membership -- I expect to be as largely an invisible administrator there as Susan is here. To subscribe, send email to nanog-offtopic-subscribe(a)lists.blank.org from the account you wish to receive the mail at. My thanks to you all, -Nathan J. Mehl p.s. my apologies if this has already been done elsewhere; a cursory seach of my own nanog archives did not turn it up. ------------------------------------------------------------<memory(a)blank.org> "The beauty you like is precisely that which escapes you." (--Issey Miyake) <http://blank.org/memory/>----------------------------------------------------

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