- NANOG - lists.nanog.org

Welcome to nanog
by Majordomo＠merit.edu 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

-- Welcome to the nanog mailing list! Please save this message for future reference. Thank you. If you ever want to remove yourself from this mailing list, you can send mail to <Majordomo(a)merit.edu> with the following command in the body of your email message: unsubscribe nanog or from another account, besides nanog(a)merit.edu: unsubscribe nanog nanog(a)merit.edu If you ever need to get in contact with the owner of the list, (if you have trouble unsubscribing, or have questions about the list itself) send email to <owner-nanog(a)merit.edu> . This is the general rule for most mailing lists when you need to contact a human. Here's the general information for the list you've subscribed to, in case you don't already have it: North American Network Operators Group

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Re: unsubscribe
by marilyn-request＠mozart.lib.uchicago.edu 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

You have not been removed, I couldn't find your name on the list. If this wasn't your intention or you are having problems getting yourself unsubscribed, reply to this mail now (quoting it entirely (for diagnostic purposes), and of course adding any comments you see fit). Transcript of unsubscription request follows: -- >From nanog(a)merit.edu Mon Nov 17 19:30:56 1997 >Received: from fubar.cns.ksu.edu (fubar.cns.ksu.edu [129.130.8.12]) by mozart.lib.uchicago.edu (8.8.5/8.6.4) with SMTP id TAA21992 for <marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu>; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:28:17 -0600 >Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:28:17 -0600 >From: nanog(a)merit.edu >Message-Id: <199711180128.TAA21992(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu> >To: <marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu> >Subject: unsubscribe > >idiot mailing list software that doesn't require confirmation. >anyone for a Listserv based nanog? i'll host it at ksu.edu. >I'll make it so only subscribers can post. >

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None
by marilyn-request＠mozart.lib.uchicago.edu 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

32760 nanog(a)merit.edu nanog(a)merit.edu You have been removed from the list. If this wasn't your intention or you are having problems getting yourself unsubscribed, reply to this mail now (quoting it entirely (for diagnostic purposes), and of course adding any comments you see fit). Transcript of unsubscription request follows: -- >From nanog(a)merit.edu Mon Nov 17 19:19:53 1997 >Received: from adnc.com (hera.adnc.com [205.216.138.127]) by mozart.lib.uchicago.edu (8.8.5/8.6.4) with SMTP id TAA21919 for marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:19:25 -0600 >Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 19:19:25 -0600 >From: nanog(a)merit.edu >Message-Id: <199711180119.TAA21919(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu> > >unsub nanog(a)merit.edu >

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OWNED
by Bill Gates III 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

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archive retrieval: posting.guidelines
by marilyn-request＠mozart.lib.uchicago.edu 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

File: posting.guidelines BEGIN------------cut here------------- Marilyn Monroe Mailing List Posting Guidelines ============================================== NOTE: Failure to read and abide by the guidelines contained in this document can and will result in changes to your subscription status. The Marilyn Monroe Mailing List can be a very high traffic mailing list. In addition, many members of the list use commercial services or pay long-distance charges. As a result, toleration of wasteful and inconsiderate posting will be slightly lower than the usual mailing list, and *MUCH* lower than Usenet. This document outlines your responsibilities as a subscriber. Abiding by them will enhance everyone's enjoyment of the list. The list is a powerful tool for you as a Marilyn fan and/or collector. Be conscientious, and you'll learn everything you've ever wanted to know about Marilyn, and make some friends too. Failure to abide by these rules will result in the following: 1. A warning. If I'm really irritated I'll quote your message and cut and paste the offended rule. If I'm short on time, I may just email a copy of the Charter and this file. In either case, email me if you have a question. The goal of a warning is just to remind you or give a practical example of a rule. 2. Suspension. If you break the same rule twice, break two in quick succession, or do something otherwise idiotic, you may be suspended from the list for 1-4 weeks. 3. Rejected. If you still haven't gotten the point, you will be unsubbed and added to the list's reject file. However, even this is not permanent, as I purge the reject list every 6 months or so. DISCLAIMER: I reserve the right to delete you, suspend you without warning, or otherwise manipulate your subscription (except for undesired subscription) for any reason whatsoever. Meta-Rule: When in dount, send it in PRIVATE e-mail. Below are the rules listed in the list Charter, commentary on their function, and strategies to avoid breaking them: 1. Obey standard Internet rules of etiquette The best way to do this is just THINK before you post. What and how you post is the only impression people will get of you. Most importantly your post should be well constructed, relevant, and interesting. Reasonable .sig length This is usually between 4-6 lines. If you want to show off your 80 line logo made of *'s, post an announcement and let people request it. Don't post people's email without permission Clear enough. Violating this will earn you a quick #3. Don't mailbomb the list Ditto. Don't post anything illegal Ditto. If you don't know what's illegal, you don't belong on this list. Don't quote more than text than is needed. As a rule of thumb, the text you quote should NOT be more than what you write. You can and should assume that we've all read it. New subs who may have missed something can access an archive of the last thirty messages. If you intend to quote text just to make a wry comment about, well, then you're just out of line. Therefore, quote only what is absolutely necessary (if any at all) for your reply. "Me too" messages really, really bite. If you respond to a question and you think it's of interest to all, post it to the whole list. If you see a question asked that you think may not be answered publicly, email the enquirer and ask them to please forward any responses to you. If they get enough requests, they may summarize to the list. It's quick, it's easy, and it's very considerate. 2. NO BINARIES OR DISCUSSION ABOUT BINARIES! That means no jpeg/gif posts. It is copyright violation and the messages become too large for practical distribution. 3. DO NOT SEND UNSUBS TO THE LIST! Send a message to marilyn-request if you need help. Many people pay for their email by the msg. Be courteous. The is really really irritating. Since being unsubbed from the list is the goal, and not a deterrent, this will simply earn you a goodly amount of much deserved flame-mail. Use marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu. 3a. DO NOT "TEST" THE LIST. See 3. Post an intro about yourself. If you don't get it back, email mozart(a)uchicago.edu and I'll look into the problem. 4. Do not post ANYTHING unrelated to the topic of the list. This is true of any Internet mailing list. The topic is Marilyn Monroe. No one wants Internet junkmail (See 3). You'd think this would be easy to understand, but you'd be surprised how many people think discussing viruses, Clipper Chips, or Making Money Fast is relevant to Marilyn. OTOH, the people on the list and their lives ARE relevant to the list. If a long time listmember has a b-day, gets married, or otherwise has an exciting life event, we want to hear about. This list is not only about Marilyn, but the people who love Marilyn. 5. You agree to abide by these rules. If at any time you need this document, acess the list archives or contact me. This includes updates to these documents, which will be announced to the list. 6. Anything else a majority of people on the list complain about. :) I have to admit this is slightly misleading. It's more accurate to state that if enough regular and consistently contributive members complain about something, I will back them up. That's it. You may want to keep a copy of this as a reference, or make sure you know to how get it if you need it. And if you have any questions, send me email (mozart(a)uchicago.edu) Peggy Wilkins <mozart(a)uchicago.edu> Administrator, Marilyn Monroe Mailing List END--------------cut here-------------

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archive retrieval: list.info
by marilyn-request＠mozart.lib.uchicago.edu 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

File: list.info BEGIN------------cut here------------- Welcome to the Marilyn Monroe Mailing List! ADMINISTRIVIA ------------- Please keep this information for later use. The list owner is mozart(a)uchicago.edu (Peggy Wilkins). To post a message to the list, send your message to marilyn(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu Please DON'T send subscribe/unsubscribe requests to this address. Also, please DON'T post pictures to the list. Encoded pictures are large and hard for subscribers with disk quotas to handle. Consider posting to a Usenet binaries group instead, and announcing it to the list. To unsubscribe, send a message to marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu with Subject: unsubscribe To subscribe, send a message to marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu with Subject: subscribe This list is also available in Digest format. Individual messages accumulate in the Digest and are sent out to the digest list once every 1 or more days, depending on message volume. To subscribe to the digest, send mail to marilyn-d-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu with Subject: subscribe. This server maintains an archive of files (currently only this one!) and messages posted to the list. For information on using the archive server, send mail to marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu with Subject: archive help If you need to talk to me, the list maintainer, you can always reach me at mozart(a)uchicago.edu (Peggy Wilkins). You can also send mail to marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu as long as your Subject: header starts with Re: (if it says anything else, the server will try to process it automatically). LIST CHARTER ------------ I created this list as a forum for anyone with interest to discuss Marilyn Monroe. Marilyn collectors and fans are especially welcome, and discussion about your collection or your interest in MM is encouraged. If you're new to the list, please post an introduction about yourself. The list is happy to receive any messages about Marilyn. If you find out about movie/documentary broadcasts, new magazines, or whatever, please share it with the list! Chances are we'll all want to see it, too. But again, please no pictures posted to the list, as I mentioned above. Eventually, I'd like to get together a lot of MM information, and perhaps have it available on the web. A bibliography, filmography, maybe some scanned pictures, and anything else of interest. Let me know if you want to help on this. I have an MM page on the web, frequently revised, at: http://mozart.lib.uchicago.edu/Marilyn/ Welcome to the list, and I hope it will be interesting! Peggy Wilkins mozart(a)uchicago.edu List Administrator marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu MM fan since 1976 END--------------cut here-------------

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Re: subscribe
by marilyn-request＠mozart.lib.uchicago.edu 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

You have added to the subscriber list of: marilyn(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu the following mail address: nanog(a)merit.edu By default, copies of your own submissions will be returned. This is an automated subscription mechanism. For your verification, a transcript of the original subscription request is included below. If the wrong address has been subscribed and you seem to be unable to fix it yourself, reply to this message now (quoting it entirely (for diagnostic purposes), and of course adding any comments you see fit). -- >From nanog(a)merit.edu Mon Nov 17 18:30:54 1997 >Received: from www.RVC.CC.IL.US (www.RVC.CC.IL.US [207.142.145.2]) by mozart.lib.uchicago.edu (8.8.5/8.6.4) with SMTP id SAA21563 for <marilyn-request(a)mozart.lib.uchicago.edu>; Mon, 17 Nov 1997 18:30:54 -0600 >Received: from merit.edu (166.72.5.121) by www.RVC.CC.IL.US > (EMWAC SMTPRS 0.81) with SMTP id <B0000000018(a)www.RVC.CC.IL.US>; > Mon, 17 Nov 1997 18:44:02 -0600 >Date: Mon, 17 Nov 1997 18:44:02 -0600 >Message-ID: <B0000000018(a)www.RVC.CC.IL.US> >From: NANOG Mailing List <nanog(a)merit.edu> >Subject: subscribe > >subscribe marilyn >subscribe >

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Mail System Error - Returned Mail
by Mail Administrator 18 Nov '97

18 Nov '97

This Message was undeliverable due to the following reason: Your message was not delivered because the destination computer was not found. Carefully check that it was spelled correctly and try sending it again if there were any mistakes. It is also possible that a network problem caused this situation, so if you are sure the address is correct you might want to try to send it again. If the problem continues, contact your friendly system administrator. Host roadrunner.gateway2000.com not found The following recipients did not receive this message: <listserv(a)roadrunner.gateway2000.com> Please reply to Postmaster(a)newman.gateway2000.com if you feel this message to be in error.

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Talking about spam and stuff..
by Adrian Chadd 17 Nov '97

17 Nov '97

Hmmsies.. $ cat /tmp/nanoglist | wc -l 2883 $ Ever since I subscribed to the list, I started to get spam. Which is strange, this email accounts gets (a) staff email, (b) nanog email. So a bit of snooping showed me that anyone can send the "who nanog" (or "which nanog", I cant remember which one, I just sent both :-) command to nanog(a)merit.edu and lo and behold, the subscriber list came back. So I'm asking the list admins to please disable the command, so spammers can't just grab a user list.. and also, for people who run large email lists, to consider doing the same. Adrian

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Re: Geographic v. topological address allocation
by Sean Donelan 17 Nov '97

17 Nov '97

>You are confusing transport address (describing a location >in a topology) with an object name (a book, a computer, a >process running on a computer). > >An object name like an ISBN does not need to be >hierarchical because they do not describe discrete >locations. Introducing hierarchy improves managability >and efficiency of databasing. Many hierarchies can be >imposed on object names. If there isn't, there should be a theory in computer science with enough levels of indirection you can solve any problem, i.e. ISBN->Call Number->Shelf Location. Trick question: Does a LC Call number describe a location in a topology or an object name? Many hierarchies can also be imposed on an object's location, especially when that location is connected by a rich topological mesh. >Remember: at each level of naming there can be different >and completely disjoint hierarchies. There are >scalability implications in all of them, most notably when >the names used have size limits or are distributed >non-hierarchically (like ethernet addresses or the COM >domain). However, the important thing is that when a name >is used as a LOCATOR in a topology, in order to be >scalable that name must be related to that topology and in >large networks must lend itself to aggregation in order to >reduce the amount of information needed to have that >locator be used throughout the network. Another axis of the problem is the stability of the names used as locators. Otherwise you have just moved the problem up a level, translating the object name to its instantaneous location. Love that indirection. Propagating the change in object name->locator name when a route flaps, or every corporate merger or acquisition, doesn't scale well any better than the current system. Who is going to tell Bert or Bernie that all those MCI customers need to renumber when they merge their respective networks? Geographic addressing only has the advantages in that continental drift moves at a much slower pace than the changes in most network topologies. How you get to Cleveland might change, but Cleveland tends to remain in the same relative position. However, strict hierarchies have the disadvantage you can wipe out a subtree by simply targeting a higher level node. Being able to wipe out Cleveland by disrupting the Cleveland NAP is not a desirable feature of geographic hierarchical addressing. So you need some redundancy between the subtrees (i.e. a mesh), which means you have to keep track of that redundant information. Since that redundant information is likely based on the providers' facilities in and out of Cleveland, it looks like topological addressing. So do you name objects based on how you get to Cleveland, or based on their presence in Cleveland? But I think everyone has heard this argument before. Trade-offs, trade-offs. -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Affiliation given for identification not representation

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