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RE: ARIN allocating /20 netblocks?
by Jamie Scheinblum 17 May '98

17 May '98

Karl makes a real good point, renumbering places an un-needed burdon on the customer; one they never asked for, and probably never expected. I imagine stuff like this will just cause more and more customers to move into environments with NAT, or encourage them to join the bigger networks where renumbering would be less likely. -Jamie (speaking only for myself) -----Original Message----- From: Karl Denninger [mailto:karl@mcs.net] Sent: Saturday, May 16, 1998 10:35 PM To: Michael Shields Cc: Jon Lewis; jamie(a)ais.net; Jeremiah Kristal; nanog(a)merit.edu Subject: Re: ARIN allocating /20 netblocks? [snip] We have some customers right now which encompass multiple downline connected parties over large geographic areas, and some of their equipment is incapable of doing things like DHCP (one comes to mind that happens to be a state agency). Renumbering THEM would be a job out of the depths of Hades itself; even broaching the subject would likely cost us the account. Any significant ISP has customers like this; there is no reason to impose these costs on you because you're smaller than someone else - no technical reason that is. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl(a)MCS.Net)| MCSNet - Serving Chicagoland and Wisconsin http://www.mcs.net/ | T1's from $600 monthly / All Lines K56Flex/DOV | NEW! Corporate ISDN Prices dropped by up to 50%! Voice: [+1 312 803-MCS1 x219]| EXCLUSIVE NEW FEATURE ON ALL PERSONAL ACCOUNTS Fax: [+1 312 803-4929] | *SPAMBLOCK* Technology now included at no cost

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Re: Wired Q: Embedded NT
by Ehab Hadi 17 May '98

17 May '98

I admit it if the perspective is to build all or a part of the WIN NT suites in a kind of a hardware or ASIC is not clear for me, the questions that I would like to raise: What version of WIN NT? is it 4.0 or beyond..? How do we expect customers will be confident enough to make this step?, Is WIN NT reliable, stable in a customized ASIC hence WIN NT would be more suitable than the general purpose hardware architecture?. Implementing standard IPv4 services on the ASIC and optimizing that still on its early stages; i.e., mostly for inter LAN routing. So, do how that will work for WIN NT?. Let's do it for multi-routed protocols in the ASIC switches and think further for the high-level embedded applications. I agree it might be a good idea if embedded NT is doing a single task such as Web caching, but not a "full fledge" switch/router. Ehab H. Hadi Northern Telecom, LTD. Voice: (613) 763-2762 Fax: (613) 763-5199 E-Mail: ehabh(a)nortel.ca >From owner-nanog(a)merit.edu Thu May 14 07:44:09 1998 >Received: from localhost (daemon@localhost) > by merit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.5) with SMTP id KAA00208; > Thu, 14 May 1998 10:31:17 -0400 (EDT) >Received: by merit.edu (bulk_mailer v1.5); Thu, 14 May 1998 10:25:33 -0400 >Received: (from majordom@localhost) > by merit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.5) id KAA29922 > for nanog-outgoing; Thu, 14 May 1998 10:25:33 -0400 (EDT) >Received: from home.merit.edu (home.merit.edu [198.108.60.42]) > by merit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id KAA29916 > for <nanog(a)merit.edu>; Thu, 14 May 1998 10:25:29 -0400 (EDT) >Received: (from ljb@localhost) by home.merit.edu (8.8.8/merit-2.0) id KAA11610 for nanog(a)merit.edu; Thu, 14 May 1998 10:25:29 -0400 (EDT) >Received: from wired.com (get.wired.com [204.62.131.5]) > by merit.edu (8.8.7/8.8.5) with ESMTP id SAA16509 > for <nanog(a)merit.edu>; Wed, 13 May 1998 18:20:25 -0400 (EDT) >Received: from glave.hotwired.com (roaming-194-239.hotwired.com [206.221.194.239]) > by wired.com (8.8.7/8.8.7) with SMTP id PAA09202 > for <nanog(a)merit.edu>; Wed, 13 May 1998 15:19:43 -0700 >Message-Id: <199805132219.PAA09202(a)wired.com> >X-Sender: james(a)pophost.wired.com >X-Mailer: QUALCOMM Windows Eudora Pro Version 4.0 >Date: Wed, 13 May 1998 15:19:26 -0700 >To: nanog(a)merit.edu >From: James Glave <james(a)wired.com> >Subject: Wired Q: Embedded NT >Mime-Version: 1.0 >Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii" >Sender: owner-nanog(a)merit.edu > >Hi all, > >James Glave at Wired News again. This time around I am seeking opinions on >behalf of a friend up at Wired (the print magazine) -- concerning embedded >NT. I couldn't find any discussion in the nanog archive, so I'm wondering >if anoyne here has any experience with, or knowledge of, embedding NT in >networking hardware - if that even makes any sense....? > >>From: Jesse Freund <freund(a)wired.com> >>i'm working on a piece about nt-embedded and i have a couple of questions. >>i'm hoping you might be able to hook me up with a smart network operator or >>someone else in the know or perhaps you know. basically, i'm curious why >>the hell someone would want a version of nt embedded in a switch or router? >>and who provides the custom solutions nt-embedded is meant to replace? > >Thanks, all! > >jtg > >James Glave, Senior Technology Writer >Wired News http://www.wired.com (415) 276-8430 > >Unstoppable Force of the Week: "Gettin' jiggy wit' it!" > ______________________________________________________ Get Your Private, Free Email at http://www.hotmail.com

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Re: ARIN allocating /20 netblocks?
by owen＠DeLong.SJ.CA.US 17 May '98

17 May '98

> > Ok, so I only lose 16 T1 customers instead of 1024. > > If you lose 16 T1 customers during a renumbering of a /20, either you > don't know how to renumber, or they were already unhappy for some > other reason. > > If you tell your customers "You need to renumber because evil forces > are colluding against us," they won't be very amenable... try > explaining that they'll get better connectivity. > > The social and technical problems of renumbering a /20 are nonzero but > not large. > > I've done it. > -- > Shields, CrossLink. > Not always. I know of at least one case where a customer cannot (will not) renumber out of a /24 because they (without commenting on the intellectual prowess of this particular act) shipped a million CD's with the .128 IP address in that class C hard coded into their game. Sure, it's only one IP, one machine to renumber, but... Owen

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Re: Spring (not t) 1998 NOC Contact Test Results
by Sean Donelan 17 May '98

17 May '98

Ignore the typo in the subject line. -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Affiliation given for identification not representation

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Re: secure router access
by Tony Li 16 May '98

16 May '98

stevesk(a)sweden.hp.com (Kevin Steves) writes: > > SSH is officially on the Cisco "project list" AFAIK; I believe someone > > just has to take the project and actually /do/ it. > > There was a post recently to the SSH mailing list that stated that as > well; see http://www.cs.hut.fi/ssh-archive/messages/980515-083235-3456. ssh was on the Cisco wish list two years ago. Tony

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Re: Wired Q: Embedded NT
by Lehrer, Neil 16 May '98

16 May '98

i saw something about a switch maker embedding nt. about layer 4 switches understanding application level info. it was recent, maybe network world, but i can't be sure. ``````` To: nanog(a)merit.edu From: James Glave <james(a)wired.com> Hi all, James Glave at Wired News again. This time around I am seeking opinions on behalf of a friend up at Wired (the print magazine) -- concerning embedded NT. I couldn't find any discussion in the nanog archive, so I'm wondering if anoyne here has any experience with, or knowledge of, embedding NT in networking hardware - if that even makes any sense....? >From: Jesse Freund <freund(a)wired.com> >i'm working on a piece about nt-embedded and i have a couple of questions. >i'm hoping you might be able to hook me up with a smart network operator or >someone else in the know or perhaps you know. basically, i'm curious why >the hell someone would want a version of nt embedded in a switch or router? >and who provides the custom solutions nt-embedded is meant to replace? Thanks, all! jtg James Glave, Senior Technology Writer Wired News http://www.wired.com (415) 276-8430 Unstoppable Force of the Week: "Gettin' jiggy wit' it!" Regards +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++ + Neil Lehrer + U.S. Information Agency + Networks and Systems Support Division + + voice 202 619-0903 + fax 202 619-3883 + internet nlehrer(a)usia.gov + + "oh what a tangled net we weave + when we seek to retrieve." + +++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

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Re: Zone file access
by Manar Hussain 16 May '98

16 May '98

At 15:24 15/05/98 -0700, Ben Kirkpatrick wrote: > I believe this is why they cut off public access. The NIC was >flooded with requests for domains that had just been deleted. >People were hoping to make a buck. If you have a _legitimate_ need >for zone file access, you will get it. I certainly had no problem >after the NIC figured out their internal policy for granting access. Hmm: (a) *If* this is considered undesirable - draw up a charter and say so to avoid anyone from using it for these purposes (why should someone else be allowed to do this because they claimed/had a "legitimate" reasons "as well"). (b) We don't intend to register for ourselves any domains that we don't want to use, though I admit that we have considered having some form of public interface to the info that may allow people to look through the list of recently de-activated domains and then register them. But even if we were interested in registering lots of recently de-activated domains - what's the problem with this - they are available and moreover they are domains that people have let the payments on drop. At least we'd be intending to pay for these domain (I know someone with "legitimate" access to the info who uses it to notice when domains eh never had any intention of paying for drop out of DNS so that he can look to re-register it - I should say that this is an induhvidual and that the "company" may have not idea about this). (c) At least part of our interest was purely statistical - we thought it useful to have a stateful track of things so we could do stats on it (and if it was useful make it publically available). I'll re-phrase myself a little - there are several things I'd like to do and I object to not being able to do any one of those when others are perfectly at liberty to do so. I'm reasonably happy to be told that nobody can do x,y or z as long as it's reasonably fairly imposed/upheld etc. Manar >--Ben Kirkpatrick, ELI Data Products Enginneering > > >On Fri, 15 May 1998, Manar Hussain wrote: >)We want to use it to create an in house db of domains so we can track which >)domains are being released and do some stats stuff on it as well as do some >)degree of local domain querying without having to rely on internic's ropey >)whois) ... no desire to farm email addresses or anything. > > >

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Re: 1.1.1.0/24
by Sean Donelan 16 May '98

16 May '98

>One item that is currently before the ARIN Advisory Council is a >suggestion that we publish a map of all currently allocated IP space and >keep that map up to date. If we do this then I think it solves this >problem if people keep verifying their filters against the map or if they >generate their filters based on the map. You mean like ftp://ftp.isi.edu/in-notes/iana/assignments/ipv4-address-space ???? One which may be usefull is registering the 'unassigned' IANA blocks in the IRR with a special AS number (e.g. AS0 or AS65535) so people can use the RtConfig tools to create filters by exception (e.g. NOT AS0) But there is already so much junk like 0.0.0.0/1 in there already, I hesitate doing it. -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Affiliation given for identification not representation

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Sprint 1998 NOC Contact Test Results
by Sean Donelan 16 May '98

16 May '98

The Spring 1998 NOC contact test is over. Here are the results. 69 U.S. network contacts 'worked,' with an extremely liberal definition of worked 2 infrastructure (RSNG, InterNIC) contacts 'worked,' with an extremely liberal definition of worked 11 e-mail addresses changed 28 phone numbers changed 4 phone numbers disconnected, not in service, no answer or busy for 5 days 2 automated call system timeout 3 contacts unable or unwilling to confirm contact information 1 (maybe more) contact information missing from my records http://dranet.dra.com/verify-contact.html corrections may be sent to sean(a)dra.com -- Sean Donelan, Data Research Associates, Inc, St. Louis, MO Affiliation given for identification not representation

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Re: Zone file access
by Paul Vixie 15 May '98

15 May '98

> > Dear Customer, > > > > Thank you for contacting Network Solutions, Inc., InterNIC > > Registration Services. > > > > We cannot give you access to our database for all records, other than > > what is in our whois database, is confidential and not available to the > > public. > > > > Best Regards, > > II > > Network Solutions, Inc. Network Solutions has never actually asked me to stop allowing full outbound zone transfers of all InterNIC TLD's from F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. According to my logs, "dig @192.5.5.241 xxx axfr > xxx.zone" is a rather popular command: [dns1.pa:alpha] wc -l xfer.log* 1702 xfer.log 306 xfer.log.0 5560 xfer.log.1 3219 xfer.log.2 16859 xfer.log.3 12066 xfer.log.4 39712 total [dns1.pa:alpha] ls -l xfer.log* -rw-r--r-- 1 root system 162968 May 15 00:22 xfer.log -rw-r--r-- 1 root system 29856 May 7 17:00 xfer.log.0 -rw-r--r-- 1 root system 546016 May 6 22:01 xfer.log.1 -rw-r--r-- 1 root system 325942 Apr 15 21:05 xfer.log.2 -rw-r--r-- 1 root system 1724302 Apr 6 19:08 xfer.log.3 -rw-r--r-- 1 root system 1194194 Feb 28 11:35 xfer.log.4 If NSI should ask me to restrict outbound zone transfers, then I would of course immediately ask the IANA whether to comply with that request. And so now you all know why BIND-8's first development priority was to stop forking for outbound zone transfers -- I can export the COM zone 50 times in parallel (and I sometimes do) without changing the runtime profile of F.ROOT-SERVERS.NET. -- Paul Vixie La Honda, CA <paul(a)vix.com> "Many NANOG members have been around pacbell!vixie!paul longer than most." --Jim Fleming

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