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IS-IS questions
by Bradley Dunn 24 Nov '96

24 Nov '96

Hi. I asked on comp.dcom.sys.cisco a few days ago about the advantages of IS-IS over OSPF. Dave Katz replied that IS-IS has proven to be very extensible while still allowing for backward compatibility. IS-IS was also overhauled around the same time that a lot of ISPs were building their networks. My questions are these. When is a good time to use IS-IS? Should an ISP that wants to build a scalable network go with IS-IS right now? Or is there a certain point where IS-IS becomes desirable over OSPF? Is there ever such a point? I would think it is better to pick an IGP and stick with it. Thanks for any comments. -BD

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Sorry :)
by jamie＠dilbert.multiverse.com 24 Nov '96

24 Nov '96

Sorry for the "colorful metaphors" on the list I sent out earlier. They could have been toned down a bit.. (s/could have/should have). You just get to the "break point" sometimes.. ya know? My apologies. -jamie -- jamie g.k. rishaw | work: jamie(a)multiverse.com | home: jamie(a)arpa.com url-free sig file | multiverse corporate support| work tel: 216 771 0002 "I'm a doctor, not a doorstop!" -EMH, "Star Trek: First Contact"

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Re: First? TRUE Root Name Server On Line
by jamie＠dilbert.multiverse.com 23 Nov '96

23 Nov '96

The server sucks. Who the fuck runs a "root nameserver" with open things like this? Open telnet, SMAIL on mail, and small-tcp (ATTACKABLE) services like chargen, echo, discard, Please. www3% telnet 199.5.157.5 Trying 199.5.157.5... Connected to 199.5.157.5. Escape character is '^]'. BSDI BSD/386 1.1 (NS2.NIC.EARTH) (ttyp1) login: ^DConnection closed by foreign host. www3% telnet 199.5.157.5 25 Trying 199.5.157.5... Connected to 199.5.157.5. Escape character is '^]'. 220 NS2.NIC.EARTH Smail3.1.28.1 #17 ready at Sat, 23 Nov 96 16:48 WET quit 221 NS2.NIC.EARTH closing connection ^PConnection closed by foreign host. www3% telnet 199.5.157.5 chargen Trying 199.5.157.5... Connected to 199.5.157.5. Escape character is '^]'. !"#$%&'()*+,-./0123456789:;<=>?@ABCDEFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXYZ[\]^_`abcdefg ^] telnet> q Connection closed. www3% telnet 199.5.157.5 echo Trying 199.5.157.5... Connected to 199.5.157.5. Escape character is '^]'. ^] telnet> q Connection closed. www3% telnet 199.5.157.5 discard Trying 199.5.157.5... Connected to 199.5.157.5. Escape character is '^]'. ^] telnet> q Connection closed. > When history is made on the Internet, it is important to briefly pause > to recognize the event, and then move forward. Yes, that event will be celebrated world wide: The Day that Jim Fleming Left the Internet. We'll call it Ex-Jim Day. > 1. First and foremost, this appears to be the first, public > access, Root Name Server which operates as > a TRUE NON-RECURSIVE Root Server [2]. This is a > requirement which is part of the new root name server > guidelines which are being discussed by the IETF and > other engineering groups. The 9 "popular" root name > servers use by many ISPs do NOT meet these > guidelines and resolve second level names.[3] It's their JOBS to resolve second level names, idiot. What do you think would happen if every time you queried for "unety.net NS" it just returned *.root-servers.net nameservers? Wouldn't get you very far. > True root name servers should do nothing but return > references to TLD Name Servers [2], to reduce the > scope of their control and their overall load. .. and increase the amount of DNS traffic. > 2. The official name of this root name server is...NS2.NIC.EARTH. > Because of the growing availability of access to the > new Top Level Domains, such as .EARTH, it seems > appropriate to begin naming the new Root Name Servers > with the newly available names. "growing availability to new TLDs" or "the growing number of people who think they own a TLD when it's nothing more than vapor?" > 3. This Root Name Server can be added to the growing collection > of Root 64 Name Servers which can be freely used > by ISPs in their "root.cache" files. Because this Root > Name Server is supported by a commercial enterprise, > and not a hodge podge of volunteers (or the U.S. > Government), ISPs can use this Root Name Server to > help bring added stability and performance to their > systems. [4] [5] Nah. I'll stick with mine. Thanks. > As has been proven over and over during the past year, new commercial > Top Level Domains are a reality along with new commercial Root Name > Servers. The business community is rising to the challenge of building > a better, more complete, and better engineered Internet now that the > research and development is largely over. Even if you get 10,000 sysadmins to change their root.cache file, you will still be unreachable to 90% of the Internet unless you get the *.root-servers.net servers to officially recognize you. > More commercial Root Name Servers are being installed and tested. Apparently AGN's wasn't one of them. It's a security hole waiting to happen. The last thing I want is some moron hacking into a server that I refer to as a root nameserver, changing the data, and giving my customers false information. Too much risk. > @@@@@@ [1] @@@@@@@@@ > > Result of: whois 199.5.156 Oh boy, i can 'whois' > The American Global Network, Inc. (NETBLK-RABBIT2) IT'S R@BB1T.N3T!!@#!@#&!@#%!@&#% > @@@@@@ [3] @@@@@@@@@ > > Result of: dig @a.root-servers.net mcs.com any > > ; <<>> DiG 2.1 <<>> @a.root-servers.net mcs.com any > ; (1 server found) > ;; res options: init recurs defnam dnsrch > ;; got answer: > ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 10 > ;; flags: qr rd; Ques: 1, Ans: 2, Auth: 2, Addit: 2 > ;; QUESTIONS: > ;; mcs.com, type = ANY, class = IN > > ;; ANSWERS: > mcs.com. 172800 NS CEREBUS.mcs.com. > mcs.com. 172800 NS KITTEN.mcs.com. You don't understand the recursion flag, do you? Tell me, Jim, what would happen if you were right: What would happen if the root servers did not have an 'options no-recursion' option in the bootfile? (or, as your limited knowledge thinks, "named -r"?) Think, Jim. Think really hard. *.root-servers-net are "primary" nameservers for SLD's in the .COM zone. If you queried a root-servers.net nameserver for "mcs.com any" and got back a list of nameservers, you'd theoretically NEVER be able to get MCS.COM records. Here is how you test recursion: dig @a.root-servers.net some-hostname.xyz.com where 'some-hostname.xyz.com' is NOT a listed host for any domains. Here's proof. (aroot is a nickname for a.root-servers.net btw) ns1% dig @aroot news.multiverse.com. any ; <<>> DiG 2.2 <<>> @aroot news.multiverse.com. any ; (1 server found) ;; res options: init recurs defnam dnsrch ;; got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 10 ;; flags: qr rd; Ques: 1, Ans: 0, Auth: 5, Addit: 5 ;; QUESTIONS: ;; news.multiverse.com, type = ANY, class = IN ;; AUTHORITY RECORDS: MULTIVERSE.COM. 172800 NS A.DNS.MULTIVERSE.COM. MULTIVERSE.COM. 172800 NS NS2.OAR.NET. MULTIVERSE.COM. 172800 NS NS1.AMERICA.COM. MULTIVERSE.COM. 172800 NS STORM.LIGHTNING.NET. MULTIVERSE.COM. 172800 NS IN-ADDR.ARPA.COM. ;; ADDITIONAL RECORDS: A.DNS.MULTIVERSE.COM. 172800 A 207.170.128.10 NS2.OAR.NET. 172800 A 192.88.195.10 NS1.AMERICA.COM. 172800 A 206.125.236.11 STORM.LIGHTNING.NET. 172800 A 206.148.240.3 IN-ADDR.ARPA.COM. 172800 A 207.170.140.2 ;; Total query time: 76 msec ;; FROM: ns1 to SERVER: aroot 198.41.0.4 ;; WHEN: Sat Nov 23 16:52:44 1996 ;; MSG SIZE sent: 37 rcvd: 259 --- If this nameserver were recursive, it would have given me the "A" record for news.multiverse.com. But it didn't. Again proving that you don't know what you're talking about. Here's a server with recursion on: ns1% dig @ns.unety.net. news.multiverse.com a |more ; <<>> DiG 2.2 <<>> @ns.unety.net. news.multiverse.com a ; (1 server found) ;; res options: init recurs defnam dnsrch ;; got answer: ;; ->>HEADER<<- opcode: QUERY, status: NOERROR, id: 10 ;; flags: qr rd ra; Ques: 1, Ans: 1, Auth: 7, Addit: 7 ;; QUESTIONS: ;; news.multiverse.com, type = A, class = IN ;; ANSWERS: news.multiverse.com. 3597 A 207.170.128.13 ;; AUTHORITY RECORDS: MULTIVERSE.COM. 110501 NS A.DNS.MULTIVERSE.COM. MULTIVERSE.COM. 110501 NS NS2.OAR.NET. MULTIVERSE.COM. 110501 NS NS1.AMERICA.COM. MULTIVERSE.COM. 110501 NS STORM.LIGHTNING.NET. MULTIVERSE.COM. 110501 NS IN-ADDR.ARPA.COM. MULTIVERSE.COM. 3597 NS b.DNS.MULTIVERSE.COM. MULTIVERSE.COM. 3597 NS ns1.OAR.NET. ;; ADDITIONAL RECORDS: A.DNS.MULTIVERSE.COM. 156753 A 207.170.128.10 NS2.OAR.NET. 167647 A 192.88.195.10 NS1.AMERICA.COM. 110507 A 206.125.236.11 STORM.LIGHTNING.NET. 110507 A 206.148.240.3 IN-ADDR.ARPA.COM. 110507 A 207.170.140.2 b.DNS.MULTIVERSE.COM. 156753 A 207.170.128.11 ns1.OAR.NET. 167647 A 192.88.193.144 ;; Total query time: 26 msec ;; FROM: ns1 to SERVER: ns.unety.net. 207.32.128.1 ;; WHEN: Sat Nov 23 16:54:33 1996 ;; MSG SIZE sent: 37 rcvd: 341 Your nameserver! Please read up on how DNS works and then come back. Until then, go back to your playpen. -- jamie g.k. rishaw | work: jamie(a)multiverse.com | home: jamie(a)arpa.com url-free sig file | multiverse corporate support| work tel: 216 771 0002 "I'm a doctor, not a doorstop!" -EMH, "Star Trek: First Contact"

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The Cidr Report
by Tony Bates 23 Nov '96

23 Nov '96

This is an auto-generated mail on Fri Nov 22 12:00:00 PST 1996 It is not checked before it leaves my workstation. However, hopefully you will find this report interesting and will take the time to look through this to see if you can improve the amount of aggregation you perform. The report is split into sections: 0) General Status List the route table history for the last week, list any possibly bogus routes seen and give some status on ASes. 1) Gains by aggregating at the origin AS level This lists the "Top 30" players who if they decided to aggregate their announced classful prefixes at the origin AS level could make a significant difference in the reduction of the current size of the Internet routing table. This calculation does not take into account the inclusion of holes when forming an aggregate so it is possible even larger reduction should be possible. 2) Weekly Delta A summary of the last weeks changes in terms of withdrawn and added routes. Please note that this is only a snapshot but does give some indication of ASes participating in CIDR. Clearly, it is generally a good thing to see a large amont of withdrawls. 3) Interesting aggregates Interesting here means not an aggregate made as a set of classful routes. Thanks to xara.net for giving me access to their routing tables once a day. Please send any comments about this report directly to me. Check http://www.employees.org/~tbates/cidr-report.html for a daily update of this report. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------ CIDR REPORT for 22Nov96 0) General Status Table History ------------- Date Prefixes 171196 40844 171196 40868 181196 40933 191196 42076 201196 40674 211196 40583 221196 40525 Possible Bogus Routes --------------------- AS Summary ---------- Number of ASes in routing system: 1813 Number of ASes announcing only one prefix: 741 (384 cidr, 357 classful) Largest number of cidr routes: 463 announced by AS3561 Largest number of classful routes: 1259 announced by AS174 1) Gains by aggregating at the origin AS level --- 22Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS174 1259 912 347 27.6% Performance Systems International AS3602 649 349 300 46.2% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 807 513 294 36.4% i*internet AS1 632 395 237 37.5% BBN Planet backbone AS3397 319 102 217 68.0% EMI-AS AS3804 381 236 145 38.1% Bell Blobal Solutions AS2048 256 119 137 53.5% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS1691 288 151 137 47.6% BCTEL AS5769 190 76 114 60.0% Le Groupe Videotron Ltee AS86 256 148 108 42.2% SURAnet Northern AS AS560 422 326 96 22.7% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 223 134 89 39.9% INS-AS AS813 309 225 84 27.2% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS568 253 175 78 30.8% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS2871 162 87 75 46.3% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 266 196 70 26.3% HOOKUP-NET-A AS855 132 67 65 49.2% NBTel AS3566 118 54 64 54.2% JRIVER-LINK AS225 110 49 61 55.5% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS7195 95 37 58 61.1% INTERRED AS2711 110 53 57 51.8% SUNBELT-AS AS4175 477 427 50 10.5% CONNECT-NCM AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS4454 65 18 47 72.3% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS549 203 160 43 21.2% ONet Backbone AS721 284 242 42 14.8% DLA-ASNBLOCK-AS AS3799 69 27 42 60.9% IDS AS3561 903 861 42 4.7% MCI AS3824 63 23 40 63.5% WLN --- 21Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS174 1265 914 351 27.7% Performance Systems International AS3602 651 347 304 46.7% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 807 512 295 36.6% i*internet AS1 630 392 238 37.8% BBN Planet backbone AS3397 318 103 215 67.6% EMI-AS AS3804 386 239 147 38.1% Bell Blobal Solutions AS2048 256 119 137 53.5% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS1691 288 151 137 47.6% BCTEL AS86 256 148 108 42.2% SURAnet Northern AS AS560 416 322 94 22.6% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 224 135 89 39.7% INS-AS AS813 306 223 83 27.1% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS568 253 175 78 30.8% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS2871 162 87 75 46.3% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 268 194 74 27.6% HOOKUP-NET-A AS855 133 67 66 49.6% NBTel AS7195 102 38 64 62.7% INTERRED AS3566 117 56 61 52.1% JRIVER-LINK AS225 111 50 61 55.0% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS2711 110 53 57 51.8% SUNBELT-AS AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS4454 68 20 48 70.6% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS4175 473 425 48 10.1% CONNECT-NCM AS701 782 735 47 6.0% Alternet AS3799 69 27 42 60.9% IDS AS3561 902 860 42 4.7% MCI AS3132 78 37 41 52.6% Red Cientifica Peruana (ASN-RCP) AS549 197 157 40 20.3% ONet Backbone AS271 96 56 40 41.7% BCnet Backbone --- 20Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS174 1254 907 347 27.7% Performance Systems International AS3602 645 347 298 46.2% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 808 513 295 36.5% i*internet AS1 627 389 238 38.0% BBN Planet backbone AS3397 318 103 215 67.6% EMI-AS AS3804 387 240 147 38.0% Bell Blobal Solutions AS2048 256 119 137 53.5% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS1691 287 150 137 47.7% BCTEL AS5769 190 72 118 62.1% Le Groupe Videotron Ltee AS86 256 148 108 42.2% SURAnet Northern AS AS560 416 322 94 22.6% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 224 135 89 39.7% INS-AS AS813 307 224 83 27.0% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS568 252 176 76 30.2% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS2871 161 86 75 46.6% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 264 194 70 26.5% HOOKUP-NET-A AS7195 103 39 64 62.1% INTERRED AS855 130 67 63 48.5% NBTel AS225 112 51 61 54.5% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS3566 116 57 59 50.9% JRIVER-LINK AS2711 109 52 57 52.3% SUNBELT-AS AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS4175 473 425 48 10.1% CONNECT-NCM AS701 779 732 47 6.0% Alternet AS4454 66 19 47 71.2% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS3799 69 27 42 60.9% IDS AS3561 905 863 42 4.6% MCI AS549 197 156 41 20.8% ONet Backbone AS3132 76 35 41 53.9% Red Cientifica Peruana (ASN-RCP) --- 19Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS174 1563 1088 475 30.4% Performance Systems International AS1262 554 176 378 68.2% NSN-NCAR-AS-AS AS1 789 450 339 43.0% BBN Planet backbone AS3602 646 348 298 46.1% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 807 513 294 36.4% i*internet AS3397 318 100 218 68.6% EMI-AS AS3804 387 240 147 38.0% Bell Blobal Solutions AS2048 256 119 137 53.5% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS1691 289 152 137 47.4% BCTEL AS5769 189 71 118 62.4% Le Groupe Videotron Ltee AS86 287 173 114 39.7% SURAnet Northern AS AS560 412 318 94 22.8% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 225 133 92 40.9% INS-AS AS813 307 222 85 27.7% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS2871 162 87 75 46.3% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 265 193 72 27.2% HOOKUP-NET-A AS568 244 175 69 28.3% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS7195 102 38 64 62.7% INTERRED AS855 129 66 63 48.8% NBTel AS3566 117 56 61 52.1% JRIVER-LINK AS225 113 52 61 54.0% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS2711 111 54 57 51.4% SUNBELT-AS AS3749 91 36 55 60.4% Tennessee Board of Regents AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS4175 474 426 48 10.1% CONNECT-NCM AS701 778 731 47 6.0% Alternet AS4454 64 17 47 73.4% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS3799 69 27 42 60.9% IDS AS549 196 155 41 20.9% ONet Backbone --- 18Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS1 834 484 350 42.0% BBN Planet backbone AS174 1222 882 340 27.8% Performance Systems International AS3602 650 351 299 46.0% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 807 513 294 36.4% i*internet AS3397 313 107 206 65.8% EMI-AS AS3804 380 236 144 37.9% Bell Blobal Solutions AS2048 256 119 137 53.5% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS1691 288 151 137 47.6% BCTEL AS5769 188 70 118 62.8% Le Groupe Videotron Ltee AS86 293 177 116 39.6% SURAnet Northern AS AS560 415 321 94 22.7% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 226 132 94 41.6% INS-AS AS813 303 215 88 29.0% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS568 254 176 78 30.7% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS2871 162 87 75 46.3% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 260 192 68 26.2% HOOKUP-NET-A AS855 130 66 64 49.2% NBTel AS7195 98 37 61 62.2% INTERRED AS225 113 52 61 54.0% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS3566 116 56 60 51.7% JRIVER-LINK AS3749 99 40 59 59.6% Tennessee Board of Regents AS2711 110 53 57 51.8% SUNBELT-AS AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS701 795 748 47 5.9% Alternet AS4454 64 17 47 73.4% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS4175 465 420 45 9.7% CONNECT-NCM AS279 241 197 44 18.3% SURAnet Southern AS AS3799 69 27 42 60.9% IDS AS549 194 153 41 21.1% ONet Backbone --- 17Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS1 837 485 352 42.1% BBN Planet backbone AS174 1247 911 336 26.9% Performance Systems International AS3602 650 351 299 46.0% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 807 513 294 36.4% i*internet AS3397 313 107 206 65.8% EMI-AS AS3804 379 235 144 38.0% Bell Blobal Solutions AS2048 256 119 137 53.5% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS1691 288 151 137 47.6% BCTEL AS5769 188 70 118 62.8% Le Groupe Videotron Ltee AS86 294 178 116 39.5% SURAnet Northern AS AS560 418 324 94 22.5% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 226 132 94 41.6% INS-AS AS813 299 216 83 27.8% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS2871 162 87 75 46.3% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 264 193 71 26.9% HOOKUP-NET-A AS568 238 168 70 29.4% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS3566 117 51 66 56.4% JRIVER-LINK AS855 128 65 63 49.2% NBTel AS225 112 51 61 54.5% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS7195 96 37 59 61.5% INTERRED AS3749 99 40 59 59.6% Tennessee Board of Regents AS2711 109 52 57 52.3% SUNBELT-AS AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS701 802 755 47 5.9% Alternet AS4454 64 17 47 73.4% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS4175 465 420 45 9.7% CONNECT-NCM AS279 241 197 44 18.3% SURAnet Southern AS AS3799 69 27 42 60.9% IDS AS3561 908 866 42 4.6% MCI --- 16Nov96 --- --- 15Nov96 --- ASnum NetsNow NetsCIDR NetGain % Gain Description AS174 1266 925 341 26.9% Performance Systems International AS1 837 511 326 38.9% BBN Planet backbone AS3602 652 344 308 47.2% Intergrated Network Services Inc. AS2493 803 510 293 36.5% i*internet AS3397 317 104 213 67.2% EMI-AS AS2048 357 156 201 56.3% State of Louisiana/Office of Tele AS3749 257 66 191 74.3% Tennessee Board of Regents AS279 494 325 169 34.2% SURAnet Southern AS AS3804 380 236 144 37.9% Bell Blobal Solutions AS86 341 205 136 39.9% SURAnet Northern AS AS1691 287 152 135 47.0% BCTEL AS5769 187 74 113 60.4% Le Groupe Videotron Ltee AS560 425 331 94 22.1% BBN Planet, New England Region (N AS2386 228 134 94 41.2% INS-AS AS813 308 219 89 28.9% UUNET Canada (ASN-UUNETCA-AS1) AS3819 106 24 82 77.4% SIGNET AS568 252 175 77 30.6% JIS (Joint Interconnection Servic AS2871 162 87 75 46.3% Internet Services GmbH & Co AS2704 258 192 66 25.6% HOOKUP-NET-A AS855 128 65 63 49.2% NBTel AS7195 100 37 63 63.0% INTERRED AS3450 109 46 63 57.8% UTK AS3566 118 57 61 51.7% JRIVER-LINK AS225 113 52 61 54.0% University of Virginia (VIRnet) AS2711 109 52 57 52.3% SUNBELT-AS AS4454 75 21 54 72.0% OIR Telecommunications, State of AS839 87 39 48 55.2% North West Territories Regional N AS701 785 738 47 6.0% Alternet AS3132 79 35 44 55.7% Red Cientifica Peruana (ASN-RCP) AS3799 68 26 42 61.8% IDS 2) Weekly Delta This a daily snapshot of changes in classful routes being withdrawn and added. the deltas are calculated over a rolling 7 day period. Please bear in mind this is purely a "snapshot" and a large flucuation could be caused by a connectivity problem for example. However, this does give some indication of service providers that are moving to classless routing. Top 20 Withdrawn Routes from 15Nov96 to 22Nov96 -307 AS279 SURAnet Southern AS -205 AS1 BBN Planet backbone -199 AS3749 Tennessee Board of Regents -101 AS2048 State of Louisiana/Office of Tele -85 AS3450 UTK -63 AS2907 SINET -36 AS6203 ISDN-Net Inc. -28 AS3301 TeliaNet Sweden -26 AS701 Alternet -25 AS2714 General Services Administration -23 AS3836 THAISARN -17 AS6536 MOUNTAINNET -13 AS34 UDELNET -12 AS35 MICATON -11 AS2637 Georgia Institute of Technology -10 AS2592 E.U. BAUM, Izmir, TURKIYE -9 AS6059 UMS2-ASN -7 AS1733 CENTAF-SWA -6 AS3527 National Institutes of Health -5 AS5672 PBI (Pacific Bell Internet) Top 20 Added Routes from 15Nov96 to 22Nov96 126 AS1221 AARNET-AS 77 AS1759 Telecom Finland iNET 64 AS4175 CONNECT-NCM 33 AS1899 Fnet, EUnet-France 31 AS681 KAWAIHIKO-1 26 AS1324 ANS New York City - DNSS 35 24 AS5768 ICANECT 19 AS3111 Internet Direct Inc. (ASN-DIRECT) 18 AS6402 OneCall Communications Inc. 15 AS1785 NYSERNet Backbone 14 AS721 DLA-ASNBLOCK-AS 13 AS3491 CAIS-ASN 12 AS1263 NSN-TEST-AS 11 AS549 ONet Backbone 10 AS3464 ASC-NET 8 AS611 University of New Brunswick 7 AS3739 NEWNET 6 AS6136 NW RAIN.net, Inc. 5 AS2563 KoRea Education Network 4 AS1241 FORTHnet 3) Interesting aggregates List of possibly interesting aggregates --------------------------------------- aggregate origin-AS AS Description 5.1.1.0/24 AS701 Alternet 5.1.2.0/24 AS701 Alternet 5.1.3.0/24 AS701 Alternet 9.2.0.0/16 AS1747 IBM Watson, Yorktown Heights, 9.20.0.0/17 AS2686 Autonomous System number for I 9.67.0.0/19 AS3561 MCI 12.0.0.0/9 AS7018 AT&T worldnet network 12.0.96.0/19 AS6269 AT&T NWCS backbone network 12.1.96.0/19 AS6269 AT&T NWCS backbone network 12.5.96.0/19 AS6269 AT&T NWCS backbone network 12.8.96.0/19 AS6269 AT&T NWCS backbone network 12.9.96.0/19 AS6269 AT&T NWCS backbone network 57.12.0.0/16 AS5384 Etisalat Emirates Internet 128.111.30.0/23 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.32.0/23 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.65.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.78.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.83.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.85.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.91.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.120.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.227.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.243.0/24 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.111.244.0/23 AS131 University of California, Sant 128.145.228.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 128.188.1.0/24 AS560 BBN Planet, New England Region 129.181.208.0/21 AS517 Xlink 129.181.216.0/22 AS517 Xlink 130.168.105.0/24 AS1270 EUnet Germany 130.168.115.0/24 AS1270 EUnet Germany 130.168.125.0/24 AS1270 EUnet Germany 131.114.192.0/18 AS2598 Consiglio Nazionale delle Rice 131.117.0.0/17 AS559 SWITCH, Swiss Academic and Res 132.83.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.87.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.88.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.101.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.111.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.115.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.118.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.118.200.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.119.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.128.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.131.5.0/24 AS306 NGNET-AS 132.235.204.0/24 AS3561 MCI 134.6.160.0/22 AS2706 HKSUPER 134.6.180.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 134.33.100.0/24 AS701 Alternet 134.129.64.0/18 AS6263 NDIN 134.133.184.0/24 AS2548 DIGEX-AS 134.198.8.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.16.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.24.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.32.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.40.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.48.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.56.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.64.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.72.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.96.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.168.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.176.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.192.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.232.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.198.240.0/21 AS3593 Eastern Pennsylvania Internet 134.204.14.0/24 AS3561 MCI 134.204.176.0/24 AS3561 MCI 134.241.109.0/24 AS560 BBN Planet, New England Region 135.14.65.0/24 AS3111 Internet Direct Inc. (ASN-DIRE 135.16.150.0/24 AS560 BBN Planet, New England Region 135.37.2.0/24 AS3561 MCI 135.37.4.0/24 AS3561 MCI 135.37.10.0/24 AS3561 MCI 135.40.66.0/24 AS3561 MCI 136.140.9.0/24 AS3561 MCI 137.15.34.0/24 AS2493 i*internet 137.15.39.0/24 AS2493 i*internet 137.15.41.0/24 AS2493 i*internet 137.15.44.0/24 AS2493 i*internet 137.15.52.0/24 AS2493 i*internet 137.15.54.0/24 AS2493 i*internet 138.108.100.0/24 AS3561 MCI 138.182.252.0/24 AS5855 Secretary of the Navy 138.182.254.0/24 AS5855 Secretary of the Navy 139.46.35.0/24 AS560 BBN Planet, New England Region 139.61.102.0/24 AS3111 Internet Direct Inc. (ASN-DIRE 139.61.103.0/24 AS3111 Internet Direct Inc. (ASN-DIRE 139.162.128.0/17 AS1136 Unisource Internet Service NL 140.188.33.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.64.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.86.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.129.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.148.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.198.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.246.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.188.248.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 140.231.44.0/24 AS3561 MCI 141.227.111.0/24 AS2529 Demon Internet Ltd 142.218.120.0/24 AS2551 NETCOM On-line Communication S 143.93.32.0/19 AS517 Xlink 143.222.116.0/24 AS3407 Interpath 143.252.80.0/24 AS2856 BTnet UK Regional network 144.127.110.0/23 AS2707 WEC 144.127.112.0/20 AS2707 WEC 144.127.128.0/19 AS2707 WEC 144.127.160.0/21 AS2707 WEC 144.127.168.0/23 AS2707 WEC 144.199.161.0/24 AS1238 ICM Malaysia (MIMOS) connectee 145.17.100.0/24 AS2856 BTnet UK Regional network 145.72.32.0/19 AS5484 BT Netherlands Regional Servic 145.72.64.0/19 AS5484 BT Netherlands Regional Servic 145.248.112.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 145.248.155.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 145.248.157.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 145.248.159.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 145.248.161.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 145.248.165.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 146.75.251.0/24 AS3301 TeliaNet Sweden 146.75.254.0/24 AS3301 TeliaNet Sweden 146.192.0.0/17 AS2119 TelePost Internet 146.193.60.0/22 AS2860 IP Global, Informatica e Telec 147.85.21.0/24 AS3951 ICONNET 147.85.25.0/24 AS3951 ICONNET 147.85.39.0/24 AS3951 ICONNET 147.85.44.0/24 AS3951 ICONNET 147.85.51.0/24 AS3951 ICONNET 147.85.115.0/24 AS3951 ICONNET 147.116.63.0/24 AS3561 MCI 147.116.64.0/23 AS3561 MCI 147.116.160.0/21 AS3561 MCI 147.116.168.0/22 AS3561 MCI 147.160.0.0/17 AS3561 MCI 147.160.128.0/18 AS3561 MCI 147.160.192.0/20 AS3561 MCI 147.160.200.0/21 AS3561 MCI 147.160.208.0/20 AS3561 MCI 147.160.224.0/20 AS3561 MCI 147.160.224.0/19 AS3561 MCI 147.206.20.0/24 AS3561 MCI 148.59.2.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.4.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.14.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.15.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.16.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.18.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.19.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.222.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.224.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.225.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.228.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.231.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.234.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.237.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.238.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.241.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.246.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.250.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.59.252.0/24 AS2015 Msen, Inc. 148.94.210.0/24 AS5714 EDS-WEBS 148.185.45.0/24 AS1849 PIPEX, Public IP EXchange 149.212.0.0/18 AS3292 Tele Danmark Internet Exchange 149.212.64.0/20 AS1759 Telecom Finland iNET 149.236.92.0/24 AS6292 FCI 150.61.5.1/32 AS2500 WIDE Internet AS 150.207.2.0/24 AS1221 AARNET-AS 150.207.128.0/24 AS2764 CONNECT-NET 152.129.186.0/24 AS4478 PNET-STL 152.163.234.0/23 AS2056 AOL-AS 152.175.128.0/17 AS1667 ANS-BLK1 152.179.0.0/17 AS1321 ANS San Francisco - DNSS 11 152.181.128.0/17 AS-set UNKNOWN 152.181.184.0/22 AS1667 ANS-BLK1 152.187.0.0/17 AS1321 ANS San Francisco - DNSS 11 152.189.128.0/17 AS-set UNKNOWN 152.189.184.0/22 AS1667 ANS-BLK1 153.96.10.0/24 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.96.80.0/21 AS517 Xlink 153.96.92.0/24 AS517 Xlink 153.96.108.0/24 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.96.132.0/24 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.96.150.0/24 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.96.188.0/22 AS517 Xlink 153.96.192.0/24 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.96.230.0/24 AS517 Xlink 153.96.244.0/22 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.97.64.0/18 AS5501 Fraunhofer Gesellschaft 153.110.50.0/24 AS2120 DAXnet (Tele 3) 154.11.1.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.2.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.8.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.16.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.24.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.25.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.32.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.36.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.37.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.48.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.64.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.96.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.97.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.98.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.99.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.108.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.109.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.110.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.126.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 154.11.127.0/24 AS8013 PSINET-CA 155.39.191.0/24 AS2685 IBM Global Network - US 155.39.230.0/24 AS2685 IBM Global Network - US 155.134.60.0/24 AS701 Alternet 155.140.124.0/24 AS1849 PIPEX, Public IP EXchange 155.203.254.0/24 AS3561 MCI 155.229.30.0/24 AS7330 UNKNOWN 155.229.120.0/21 AS4565 HLC Internet 155.229.176.0/21 AS7045 WEATHER 156.5.252.0/23 AS4004 Global IP 156.51.204.0/24 AS3301 TeliaNet Sweden 156.114.200.0/24 AS2529 Demon Internet Ltd 157.184.150.0/24 AS1330 ANS St. Louis - DNSS 83 157.232.100.0/24 AS3561 MCI 158.118.51.0/24 AS701 Alternet 158.155.24.0/22 AS4740 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 158.174.254.0/24 AS2856 BTnet UK Regional network 159.24.7.0/24 AS4286 IMCI 159.87.34.0/24 AS200 BBN Planet Western Region 159.179.0.0/24 AS3561 MCI 159.197.158.0/23 AS2529 Demon Internet Ltd 159.245.84.0/22 AS1849 PIPEX, Public IP EXchange 159.245.104.0/22 AS1849 PIPEX, Public IP EXchange 160.92.129.0/24 AS2917 OLEANE - PIPEX International 160.104.0.0/17 AS701 Alternet 160.104.128.0/17 AS1290 PSINet UK Ltd. 161.6.0.0/17 AS3561 MCI 161.6.128.0/17 AS3561 MCI 161.51.224.0/20 AS1849 PIPEX, Public IP EXchange 161.120.6.0/24 AS3561 MCI 161.173.243.0/24 AS2386 INS-AS 161.223.220.0/22 AS1 BBN Planet backbone 161.223.224.0/24 AS1 BBN Planet backbone 162.17.253.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 162.81.141.0/24 AS3561 MCI 163.12.0.0/23 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.5.0/24 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.6.0/23 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.8.0/21 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.16.0/22 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.21.0/24 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.22.0/24 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.22.0/23 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.23.0/24 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.24.0/21 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.32.0/19 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.64.0/20 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.64.0/18 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.81.0/24 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.82.0/23 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.84.0/22 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.88.0/21 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.96.0/19 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.128.0/21 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.136.0/22 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.144.0/20 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.160.0/19 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.192.0/21 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.12.240.0/20 AS3576 PREPnet-EAST 163.44.224.0/21 AS4853 Justsystem Corporation 163.44.240.0/21 AS4853 Justsystem Corporation 163.49.131.0/24 AS3561 MCI 163.49.132.0/22 AS3561 MCI 163.49.136.0/22 AS3561 MCI 163.49.140.0/23 AS3561 MCI 163.49.142.0/24 AS3561 MCI 163.249.43.0/24 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.53.0/24 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.54.0/24 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.57.0/24 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.140.0/22 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.160.0/21 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.168.0/24 AS3739 NEWNET 163.249.170.0/24 AS3739 NEWNET 164.52.249.0/24 AS1982 Northwest Nexus, Inc. 164.53.55.0/24 AS2706 HKSUPER 164.100.64.0/20 AS3561 MCI 164.100.80.0/24 AS4755 Videsh Sanchar Nigam Ltd. Indi 164.100.81.0/24 AS3561 MCI 164.100.82.0/23 AS3561 MCI 164.100.84.0/22 AS3561 MCI 164.100.88.0/21 AS3561 MCI 164.100.96.0/19 AS3561 MCI 164.100.167.0/24 AS3561 MCI 164.100.199.0/24 AS4755 Videsh Sanchar Nigam Ltd. Indi 164.103.3.0/24 AS3561 MCI 164.224.208.0/20 AS5855 Secretary of the Navy 165.108.130.0/24 AS3561 MCI 165.108.130.0/23 AS3561 MCI 165.108.132.0/22 AS3561 MCI 165.108.136.0/21 AS3561 MCI 165.108.144.0/22 AS3561 MCI 165.108.148.0/23 AS3561 MCI 165.113.197.0/24 AS6006 UNKNOWN 165.113.198.0/24 AS6006 UNKNOWN 165.113.199.0/24 AS6006 UNKNOWN 165.113.211.0/24 AS6006 UNKNOWN 165.113.219.0/24 AS6006 UNKNOWN 165.166.123.0/24 AS3561 MCI 165.215.64.0/18 AS4183 CompuServe, Incorporated 165.215.191.0/24 AS5090 CWI-NYD 165.247.33.0/24 AS5696 Primary AS for GoodNet 165.247.47.0/24 AS5696 Primary AS for GoodNet 165.247.77.0/24 AS5696 Primary AS for GoodNet 166.38.40.0/24 AS3561 MCI 166.147.0.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.147.64.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.147.128.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.147.192.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.150.0.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.150.64.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.150.128.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.150.192.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.151.0.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.151.64.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.151.128.0/18 AS3561 MCI 166.151.192.0/18 AS3561 MCI 167.77.32.0/24 AS3561 MCI 167.105.232.0/24 AS3561 MCI 167.170.6.0/23 AS3313 I.Net S.p.A. 167.170.32.0/23 AS3313 I.Net S.p.A. 167.208.125.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.14.1.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.14.2.0/23 AS3561 MCI 168.14.4.0/22 AS3561 MCI 168.14.8.0/21 AS3561 MCI 168.14.16.0/20 AS3561 MCI 168.29.0.0/17 AS3492 ATLANTA 168.86.1.0/24 AS701 Alternet 168.97.37.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.160.128.0/18 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.192.0/19 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.225.0/24 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.226.0/24 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.227.0/24 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.228.0/23 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.231.0/24 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.160.233.0/24 AS4808 APNIC-AS-BLOCK 168.175.70.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.175.170.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.175.171.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.175.172.0/24 AS3561 MCI 168.224.128.0/24 AS2856 BTnet UK Regional network 168.234.128.0/24 AS6458 EMPRESSA GUATEMALTECA DE TELEC 168.234.135.0/24 AS6458 EMPRESSA GUATEMALTECA DE TELEC 168.234.136.0/22 AS6458 EMPRESSA GUATEMALTECA DE TELEC 168.247.253.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 168.247.254.0/24 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 169.24.186.0/24 AS2019 JP MORGAN 169.137.170.0/24 AS3407 Interpath 169.200.1.0/24 AS3561 MCI 170.119.27.0/24 AS6335 NTRNET 170.119.229.0/24 AS6335 NTRNET 170.194.51.0/24 AS1849 PIPEX, Public IP EXchange 171.18.1.0/24 AS3215 RAIN 171.25.128.0/19 AS3301 TeliaNet Sweden 171.30.170.0/24 AS2856 BTnet UK Regional network 194.142.136.8/30 AS3238 AALNet 198.200.138.0/28 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 199.99.247.32/27 AS174 Performance Systems Internatio 199.233.98.0/25 AS6082 MAI Network Services 199.233.98.128/25 AS6082 MAI Network Services 202.50.137.64/27 AS2687 IBM Global Network - AP 204.148.62.0/26 AS1673 ANS-BLK1 206.250.27.0/26 AS4200 AGIS (Apex Global Information 206.250.40.0/25 AS4200 AGIS (Apex Global Information 206.250.202.0/26 AS4200 AGIS (Apex Global Information 206.250.203.0/26 AS4200 AGIS (Apex Global Information 206.250.204.0/26 AS4200 AGIS (Apex Global Information

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ATM text
by Vadim Antonov 23 Nov '96

23 Nov '96

I placed a PostScript copy of the text (unfortunately, hi-res pictures come in separate files) at Pluris homepage, http://www.pluris.com If you won't see new links, reload the page, or clear the browser's cache. Thanks to everybody for comments and suggestions! --vadim

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Re: the promised text
by Mike Trest 22 Nov '96

22 Nov '96

Dima, Good observation. However, I did not miss Vadim's point. It is well stated. But I would like to see a clearer path to deterministic behaviour in routing technology before we use it for integrated voice service, as an example. "No worse than ATM" is not a good enough starting point. Indeed, today we use ATM to transport IP traffic and also multiple technologies including some non-ATM stuff like broadcast video/voice, laser disk playback, Video Conferencing, and ordinary T1 AMI/D4 PSTN voice service. I wonder, however, if an IP address (even at terabit speeds) will help to sort out which DS0 is going to which IXC. Likewise, we should never think that IP traffic will ever be limited to any specific L1/L2 technology. Because I can do these things with ATM today does not mean that better IP routing engines are not needed! I mean no disrespect to Vadim. I think is work is good. I actually hope we do see better IP routing technology. If the resultant product is deterministic at L3, ATMnet would probably be one of the first to sign up to give it a try. ..mike.. At 11:37 AM 11/22/96 -0500, Dima Volodin wrote: >Mike Trest writes: >> >> Even though ATMnet has been delivering IP-over-ATM to commercial users >> longer than any other provider, we never claim that the Internet should >> exist *EXCLUSVELY* as ATM technology. Quite the contrary, we (and our >> customers) see the technical and economic power of ATM technology in the >> ability to support fully integrated services. > >It's either you missed another point or I invented this another point in my >mind - a large chunk of Vadim's paper is devoted to the topic of pure IP's >being no worse that ATM for "integrated" services. > >> Mike Trest, ATMNET Voice: 619 643-1805 > >Dima > > Mike Trest, ATMNET Voice: 619 643-1805 5440 Morehouse Drive Fax: 619 643-1801 San Diego, CA USA 92121 EMAIL: trest(a)ATMnet.net

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Re: the promised text
by Mike Trest 22 Nov '96

22 Nov '96

>To: Vadim Antonov <avg(a)pluris.com> >I loaded the text on merits of ATM vs native IP routing >to the Pluris Inc's web server. >I'll also appreciate your comments. > >--vadim > vadim, I finally satisfied that someone who has a clue on IP and Internet has written clearly on my favorite topic. Indeed, I do not dispute many of your points regards route-flap and role of IX. However, IMHO you have constructed a non-existent foe solely for the purposes of argument. Specifically your statement: "The following ... argue that native IP routing is the only currently existing technology which can hold a global data network together." This is a point that no one with a clue is disputing WRT Internet IP traffic. Even though ATMnet has been delivering IP-over-ATM to commercial users longer than any other provider, we never claim that the Internet should exist *EXCLUSVELY* as ATM technology. Quite the contrary, we (and our customers) see the technical and economic power of ATM technology in the ability to support fully integrated services. On the other hand, no one with a clue can dispute that we need to push for better IP routing technologies, regardless of the L1/L2 medium used. ..mike.. Mike Trest, ATMNET Voice: 619 643-1805 5440 Morehouse Drive Fax: 619 643-1801 San Diego, CA USA 92121 EMAIL: trest(a)ATMnet.net

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the promised text
by Vadim Antonov 22 Nov '96

22 Nov '96

I loaded the text on merits of ATM vs native IP routing to the Pluris Inc's web server. You may find it at http://www.pluris.com Please contact me if you have any problems with the text. I'll also appreciate your comments. --vadim

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Re: RWHOIS, SWIP, and proving ownership
by owen＠DeLong.SJ.CA.US 21 Nov '96

21 Nov '96

> Consider this a side note to the preceding discussion. > > 1. Most of our clients understand that their ''lease'' on network address > space is at our whim, by contract for IP connectivity, and is subject > to renumbering if WE assign them new space, if WE are assigned new space, > or if they move elsewhere. > > Therefore they don't ask us to SWIP the nets nor do they care. > So... > 2. RWHOIS doesn't run on any production operating system. I know Unix is > in vogue, but since we do the 99.96% uptime schtick, we use operating > systems that stay up (VMS). This means we can't run RWHOIS (even if we > did want to, which if you read #1 above you'll see we don't.) > I don't see any reason you couldn't modify RWHOIS to compile/run on VMS. It's pretty straightforward C code with very few UNIX specific calls in it. Admittedly, we run UNIX (which has been up 99.96%+ at our site). In fact, the last time I worked in a shop with a bunch of VMS users, the VMS system was down alot more often than our UNIX systems. Oh well... Guess it's religion. > 3. We currently use almost all of a /18, two thirds of a /19, a few /22s, > and some /24s. It would be easy to justify a /17 based on all this, but > if someone wanted to be rigid about RWHOIS and SWIP, even a bunch of > traceroutes aren't going to convince them. > > Back in THE GOOD OLD DAYS (tm), we said "Be flexible with what you accept, > be rigid with what you send out." (Others made it sound better and put it > in RFCs... D.C. for one.. :) > That applies to network protocols and interactions between machines. > Nowadays I see the motto has become "Be rigid in what you accept, and modify > your templates as often as possible." This criticism applies equally to the > RA IRR as it does to the InterNIC. > I will support this criticism of the NIC, but the RA has not refused any of my submissions based on templates over a year old. > Gee, and this started out as one sentence that went "We don't run RWHOIS, our > clients don't want it, our operating system won't support it, and you better > listen when we ask for a /17 ;)" > We don't conform to any standard, we don't care what the rest of the net does, and you better give us what we want when we want it. Cute. I expected better from you of all people, Ehud. > Ehud > Owen

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RFC - Roots For Consensus
by Jim Fleming 21 Nov '96

21 Nov '96

---------- From: Jim Fleming[SMTP:JimFleming@unety.net.] Sent: Thursday, November 21, 1996 9:38 AM To: 'New Newdom'; 'paul(a)vix.com'; Bob Allisat Cc: bobm(a)nic.ddn.mil; jamesf(a)arl.mil; Jim Fleming; koda(a)isi.edu; marcel(a)nsipo.nasa.gov; 'Mark Kosters'; markk(a)netsol.com; matti(a)comedia.se; psinet-domain-admin(a)psi.com; sneeri(a)ni.umd.edu Subject: RE: FW: RFC - Roots For Consensus On Wednesday, November 20, 1996 11:42 PM, Paul A Vixie[SMTP:paul@vix.com] wrote: @ > Paul A Vixie wrote: @ > >(edit)... Each root name server operator (*.ROOT-SERVERS.NET) @ > >carries exactly the data that the IANA has approved. Never more and @ > >never less. @ > @ > IANA was one fellow with a few @ > assistants. So this one fellow @ > tells nine other guys who run these @ > root servers exactly what names @ > will or will not be recognized? @ @ Yes. Think of the root name servers (not "the popular..." or "the old..." @ but simply THE ROOT NAME SERVERS) as common carriers. They are respon sible @ for accuracy and delivery but not content. @ Paul, I think it might be useful to define some common terminology. Root Name Server Primarily directs ISP Name Servers to TLD Name Servers TLD Name Server Primarily directs ISP Name Servers to SLD Name Servers SLD Name Server Primarily directs ISP Name Servers to Web and Mail Servers ISP Name Server Primarily serve customers' stub resolvers and interface with all of the above name servers in a frequency that decreases from the top (Root) to the Bottom (SLD and below) because of caching. No one argues that accuracy and coherence are not important. In fact, one way to gain better accuracy and coherence is to make sure that name servers are properly classified, configured, and maintained. One of the current problems with the overall DNS system is that the 9 "popular" Root Name Servers mix (or combine) the function of a Root Name Server and a TLD Name Server. In a similar manner, many ISPs combine the function of their ISP Name Server and one or more SLD Name Servers. This is especially true in the case where "virtual" domains are used. There are many reasons why accuracy and coherence are important. One of the main reasons is to ensure accuracy in financial accounting records, interstate commerce, and accurate fullfillment of Federal and State tax laws. I suggest that everyone operating a Root Name Server and a TLD Name Server consult with their attorneys and accountants regarding how income derived from the operation of those servers has to be properly and "accurately" attributed to the proper taxing authority at the Federal and State levels. One of the reasons why it is important to separate the Root Name Servers from the TLD Name Servers is because there may be no income and/or profits derived from operating a Root Name Server. On the other hand, operating a .COM TLD Name Server, in a particular State (let's say Kansas) means that some portion of the income derived from operating that server and service has to be attributed to the State of Kansas. That way there will be accuracy and coherence when companies file their tax returns. @ > And this is how a critical element @ > in the communications of 50+ @ > million people was being governed? @ @ Yes. This is a "principle" and its name is "coherence". (I'm quoting those @ words for the benefit of Mr. Fleming, who will probably need to look both of @ them up in a dictionary.) @ @ > What an amateurish, closed and @ > utterly bankrupt process! Bring @ > on Root 64 Mr Fleming! NOW! At @ > least there will be 64 or more @ > participants. That makes abuses @ > far more unlikely. @ > Bob Allisat @ @ You are arguing in favour of "the tyranny of the majority" and if you'll @ check your history books you'll see that it hasn't worked out well whenever @ it's been tried. @ @ If you would rather have 64 root name servers that DO NOT LISTEN TO SOME @ CENTRAL AUTHORITY and each offer their own version of the DNS name space, @ then you do not understand (a) history, (b) politics, (c) economics, @ (d) engineering, (e) science, and (f) ethics. @ Once again, I suggest that people check with their attorney's and accountants on how tax laws work at the Federal and State levels. I believe that these laws have been developed over hundreds of years and certainly cover (a), (b), (c), and (f). It seems to me that people who are focused on (d) and (e) may not understand all of the ramifications of their actions. @ "Coherence" is how we got "here" and it's how we'll get from here onward. @ IANA is changing the authority model so that there will be more lawyers and @ more insurance policies and more people able to take the heat, and under @ that expanded shield there is room for a mechanism that admits more iTLD's. @ @ But while we will see an end to the single-person authority model, we will @ NOT see an end to the need for, and the presence of, DNS coherence. You can @ rail against this and you can wail about this but DNS just will not work @ without coherence and the Internet citizenry will not be able to get useful @ work done without coherence. @ @ I have directed followups to a mailing list that I do not read. Please @ continue this discussion there without me. @ @ Paul, as long as you operate a Root Name Server and more importantly a TLD Name Server for the "commercial" .COM domain in the State of California then I would think that you would want to keep up with how the laws of that State apply to you. Also, since you appear to be operating this commercial venture as a non-profit operation (ISC?), I would think that you would also be interested in Federal Tax laws and how accuracy and coherence are key to making that system work. You can bury your head in the sand, but if you do, I suggest that it be in International waters off the coast of California, because at this point in time you are standing on Federal and State soil, and that makes you, your companies and your servers subject to the laws of those regions. If you have some special "dispensation" from the IANA or the ISOC that makes you immune from Federal and State laws, please let everyone know. -- Jim Fleming UNETY Systems, Inc. Naperville, IL e-mail: JimFleming(a)unety.net JimFleming(a)unety.net.s0.g0 (EDNS/IPv8)

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