RE: Regional differences in P2P
Mikael Abrahamsson wrote: I would also like to add that over here Direct Connect is quite common among the more organized and hard-core file swappers, while the really-hardcore guys of course are still using private ftp servers.
There is some private FTP server use in the US as well; it is difficult to measure the bandwidth it uses, as it often involves encryption and therefore is inventoried as miscellaneous traffic by probes. I am not a hardcore file swapper, but like everyone else I granted access to my FTP to a few buddies. However, it works only over VPN: no static IP and no encryption, no FTP (there also is an unwritten clause about red wine). I believe that Europeans tend to underestimate American private FTP usage (and vice-versa) because it is more difficult for someone from the other side of the pond to penetrate the relatively private circles of private FTP file sharing.
With proliferation of 10 meg ethernet (full duplex) connections for residential use in (especially) northern europe and in asia, users are more likely to serve content to other users around the world.
Note that 10meg Ethernet full-duplex is becoming available in the US as well. Where I live (Sacramento, California) we have this: http://personal.surewest.com/internet/highspeed10mb.php Note that they cap the service at 40 GB/mo, which still is ~40 movies, more than I can watch :-)
My interpretation of this is that p2p networks are quite intelligent in using the available bandwidth, and that Copyright holders only solution is a "content crunch" due to providers limiting their users upload potential due to heavy usage, such as capping the amount of bandwidth allowed per month or alike.
I agree, but see above: a 40GB/mo cap is not something that I care about. Granted, I'm not a hardcore file swapper but 40GB/mo are more than enough for most including myself. As shown here: http://arneill-py.sacramento.ca.us/mrtg/192.168.222.1_et0_0.html My usage last month was 2 GB and the average over the last 20 months was 8GB/mo. And I do share some files.
Petri Helenius wrote: If you leave BitTorrent out, which is probably the fastest growing protocol out there, the statistics are missing about one third of the bits moved.
BitTorrent is a third of p2p traffic in Sweden? Wow. In the US it is a small blip on the radar. My reading about the big five is as follows: +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! Protocol ! Typical client ! Comments ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! FastTrack ! Kazaa ! Declines everywhere. Privacy concerns ! ! ! ! are killing it in the US. ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! WinMX ! Winmx ! Stable client, stable market share. ! ! ! ! Fit for MP3s, not for warez or movies ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! Gnutella ! various, a mess ! Doomed to disappear sooner or later. ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! eDonkey ! mostly eMule ! Fastest rising in the US (at the ! ! ! now ! expense of FastTrack, mostly). There ! ! ! ! are more than one client but it's not ! ! ! ! a mess like Gnutella. Fit for large ! ! ! ! files, for MP3s initial queing has ! ! ! ! pushed lots of users back to WinMX ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ ! BitTorrent ! BitTorrent ! New; reported fit both for large ! ! ! ! files and MP3s however privacy ! ! ! ! concerns are as high as Kazaa and the ! ! ! ! interface is not nearly as polished ! ! ! ! as WinMX or eMule. Too early to call. ! +------------+-----------------+---------------------------------------+ Crystal ball reading: Gnutella will disappear. WinMX and eDonkey will eventually eat FastTrack (numerous swappers use both WinMX and eMule); BitTorrent is an outsider. Regional differences between Western Europe and North America will blend; Asia/Pacific too early to make predictions. Michel.
On Thu, 15 Jul 2004, Michel Py wrote:
I agree, but see above: a 40GB/mo cap is not something that I care about. Granted, I'm not a hardcore file swapper but 40GB/mo are more
I don't know of any capped service over here, nobody dares take the first step. The largest 10meg provider here launched a new 100 meg full duplex service for their approx 200.000 household reach at USD$110 a month with a 300G cap (their 10 meg service for $45 a month is uncapped) and there has been a fair amount of users complaining about 300G not being nearly enough. When you start swapping DVDRs it just isn't. If they capped their 10M service I believe there would be a riot. I know a few smaller providers who use netflow or alike to find their very high-bw consuming customers and then put them into a ratelimit access list and limit their outgoing traffic. This is probably the best way to go, instead of capping you limit their speed. It requires that you have hardware that'll do this, which can be hard for larger ISPs. Smaller ones have an easier time finding scalable solutions. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se
Michel Py wrote:
BitTorrent is a third of p2p traffic in Sweden? Wow. In the US it is a small blip on the radar.
Should hold water for Sweden too. Wonder why so many of the bittorrent streams terminate in the US if it's not on your radar. Maybe time for finetuning the radar ... Pete
On Fri, Jul 16, 2004 at 09:51:28PM +0300, Petri Helenius wrote:
Michel Py wrote:
BitTorrent is a third of p2p traffic in Sweden? Wow. In the US it is a small blip on the radar.
Should hold water for Sweden too. Wonder why so many of the bittorrent streams terminate in the US if it's not on your radar. Maybe time for finetuning the radar ...
BitTorrent is in my "top ten" tcp ports in my netflow. right after https and pop3(non-ssl/110 port) in some of my more recent data, but is in the top 5 in some parts of my network as well. - jared -- Jared Mauch | pgp key available via finger from jared@puck.nether.net clue++; | http://puck.nether.net/~jared/ My statements are only mine.
participants (4)
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Jared Mauch
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Michel Py
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Mikael Abrahamsson
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Petri Helenius