Those who know Fred and knew Jon personally might want to throw an oar in the water on this blog posting from last month... http://esr.ibiblio.org/?p=4591 And that's not mentioning, of course, the people who want to throw the oar *at* ESR: I know he's a polarizing individual. :-) Cheers, -- jra -- Jay R. Ashworth Baylink jra@baylink.com Designer The Things I Think RFC 2100 Ashworth & Associates http://baylink.pitas.com 2000 Land Rover DII St Petersburg FL USA #natog +1 727 647 1274