Good to know. I was one of those insiders, And it's running on my laptop currently. It got the 10240 build a bit ago. Which removed the "insider preview" water marks, And appears to be the full release version.. So it would appear the "insiders" already have it. Or the ability to get it. Nick Olsen Network Operations (855) FLSPEED x106 ---------------------------------------- From: "Justin Mckillican" <justin@mckill.ca> Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2015 4:49 PM To: nick@flhsi.com, "nanog@nanog.org list" <nanog@nanog.org> Subject: Re: Windows 10 Release For upgraders I believe only 5 million 'Insiders' that tested Windows 10 will get it tomorrow. The rest of the free upgraders (those from Win7 and Win8) will get it over the next two weeks at different times with the priority going to those that 'reserved' it in Windows Update tool. -justin

On Jul 28, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Nick Olsen <nick@flhsi.com> wrote:

Anyone anxious to see what kind of traffic comes from Windows 10 releasing tomorrow?

Being a 3-4GB download. Each device is moving more data than any Apple update ever did.

Wonder if they'll stage the release as apple appeared to have learned after IOS7 hammered a bunch of networks.

Nick Olsen Network Operations (855) FLSPEED x106

I see that everyone can download Windows 10 this morning! There goes my bandwidth. https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10 Curtis -----Original Message----- From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-bounces@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Justin Mckillican Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2015 3:49 PM To: nick@flhsi.com; nanog@nanog.org list Subject: Re: Windows 10 Release For upgraders I believe only 5 million 'Insiders' that tested Windows 10 will get it tomorrow. The rest of the free upgraders (those from Win7 and Win8) will get it over the next two weeks at different times with the priority going to those that 'reserved' it in Windows Update tool. -justin

On Jul 28, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Nick Olsen <nick@flhsi.com> wrote:

Anyone anxious to see what kind of traffic comes from Windows 10 releasing tomorrow?

Being a 3-4GB download. Each device is moving more data than any Apple update ever did.

Wonder if they'll stage the release as apple appeared to have learned after IOS7 hammered a bunch of networks.

Nick Olsen Network Operations (855) FLSPEED x106

http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2015-July/026136.html

Which appears to be about 25% crap, 30% FUD, and the remainder consists of concerns of varying levels of validity. For privacy-minded individuals who are not interested in sharing lots of stuff with Microsoft, there are install-time options to shut most of that off. Don't use "Express Settings." Select "Customize settings" and then turn most of the switches on the next two pages off. The real issue is that lots of people will select the "express settings" and then might have to do more work to undo the decisions made at this step on their behalf. I do think it is rotten that the defaults for the options are all "on." ... JG -- Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI - http://www.sol.net "We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me one chance [and] then I won't contact you again." - Direct Marketing Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in the US alone, that's way too many apples.

...

...

http://www.metzdowd.com/pipermail/cryptography/2015-July/026136.html

Which appears to be about 25% crap, 30% FUD, and the remainder consists of concerns of varying levels of validity.

really? read the legal fine print

https://edri.org/microsofts-new-small-print-how-your-personal-data-abused/

Again, a lot of crap and FUD mixed in there. It's legalese designed to cover their arses, because they default the options to "On" and assume most people will take the default. You CAN shut off the sharing. The legalese doesn't mean that the information is shared despite the fact that you configured your box not to share it. The real problem is that so many people have outsourced their problems to ${THE_CLOUD} that those of us who run our own services are now in the tiny minority. I'm disappointed (but hardly shocked) to discover that Microsoft doesn't support arbitratry CalDAV or CardDAV services with their built-in apps, for example. I realize I'm probably in another minority here, but as a Windows-hater, I nevertheless find that there's a bunch of stuff I need to do that only really works on Windows. What I really want is an up-to-date version of Windows 98 or maybe XP. I don't need all the Microsoft-added cruft for other things. I don't use their e-mail, or their calendar, or their contacts, or their web browser (usually). Or pretty much any Metro app. I understand why a lot of that crap is there, especially as they now need to try to make Win10 workable and usable on multiple device types, so I don't mind that they added it, and I understand that using any of that crap could mean that ${MICROSOFT_CLOUD} gets involved. Doesn't mean you have to use it! Windows 10 turns out to be fairly useful once you take a hatchet to it and bludgeon out all the stuff obviously intended for the average home user or the average phone user that is just supposed to "magically work." The legal fine print for most software is atrocious these days. This isn't shocking, sadly. I can find egregious crap in lots of license agreements and privacy statements out there. You don't actually *HAVE* to use a Microsoft Account to sign into Windows 10. If you DO sign in using a Microsoft Account, you're going to be hooking your Windows box up to a bunch of cloud services that you might not want or need. For many people, this may actually be the right choice, because how else do you sync things between your desktop, your laptop, your tablet, and your Windows phone? That carries with it a lot of benefits for the average non-techie user, but is a privacy issue as well. If you do that and then don't use any of their apps, because maybe you browse the web with Chrome and you're heavily invested in Google or Yahoo for mail, contacts, and calendar, you're still not sharing the data ... with Microsoft. But that data's still out there in someone's "cloud". I could be very cynical (and yet probably come frighteningly close to the mark) by noting that Microsoft is following in Google's footsteps in amassing a wealth of data about users by providing these add-on cloud services to users, and that the users are slowly becoming the product instead of being the customer, which makes it even more attractive to do the sorts of data collection and mining pioneered by some of those other companies. Yet none of this commits you. You don't have to share information. You don't have to use a Microsoft Account. You don't have to use any of their programs or apps that would share data. Screw them. So, again, I say, the quoted article contains about 25% crap, 30% FUD, and the remainder consists of concerns of varying levels of validity. This isn't the apocalypse. People have willingly been exchanging their privacy for free services on the Internet for many years. Those of us who prefer not to rely on those services are also able to navigate that maze. ... JG -- Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI - http://www.sol.net "We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me one chance [and] then I won't contact you again." - Direct Marketing Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in the US alone, that's way too many apples.

4.0gb in 10mins using home fttc is not bad :) Colin

On 29 Jul 2015, at 13:20, Scott Helms <khelms@zcorum.com> wrote:

It's downloading for me right now, though I did reserve my slot.

Scott Helms Vice President of Technology ZCorum (678) 507-5000 -------------------------------- http://twitter.com/kscotthelms --------------------------------

On Tue, Jul 28, 2015 at 4:49 PM, Justin Mckillican <justin@mckill.ca> wrote:

...

For upgraders I believe only 5 million 'Insiders' that tested Windows 10 will get it tomorrow. The rest of the free upgraders (those from Win7 and Win8) will get it over the next two weeks at different times with the priority going to those that 'reserved' it in Windows Update tool.

-justin

...

On Jul 28, 2015, at 4:45 PM, Nick Olsen <nick@flhsi.com> wrote:

Anyone anxious to see what kind of traffic comes from Windows 10 releasing tomorrow?

Being a 3-4GB download. Each device is moving more data than any Apple update ever did.

Wonder if they'll stage the release as apple appeared to have learned after IOS7 hammered a bunch of networks.

Nick Olsen Network Operations (855) FLSPEED x106

Does anyone know if Microsoft will be hosting the downloads from there ASN 8075 or from an CDN Provider like Akamai? -----Original Message----- From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-bounces@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Maurand Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2015 6:43 PM To: Niels Bakker <niels=nanog@bakker.net>; nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Windows 10 Release Microsoft tells me 3.2 GB for win 10 pro 64 bit. On July 28, 2015 6:04:04 PM EDT, Niels Bakker <niels=nanog@bakker.net> wrote:

* nick@flhsi.com (Nick Olsen) [Tue 28 Jul 2015, 22:46 CEST]:

...

Being a 3-4GB download. Each device is moving more data than any Apple

...

update ever did.

I'm not so sure of that. The 10.9 install image clocked in at 4.9 GB, and the Mac App Store for 10.10 Yosemite says "Size: 5.67 GB"; http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/features says "3GB download required" in the small print at the bottom.

-- Niels.

-- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity. ________________________________ CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail transmission, and any documents, files or previous e-mail messages attached to it may contain confidential information that is legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, or a person responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any of the information contained in or attached to this transmission is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this transmission in error please notify the sender immediately by replying to this e-mail. You must destroy the original transmission and its attachments without reading or saving in any manner. Thank you.

We have heard they will be available via 8075. Jason Bothe, Manager of Networking Rice University o +1 713 348 5500 m +1 713 703 3552 jason@rice.edu

On Jul 28, 2015, at 19:09, Erik Sundberg <ESundberg@nitelusa.com> wrote:

Does anyone know if Microsoft will be hosting the downloads from there ASN 8075 or from an CDN Provider like Akamai?

-----Original Message----- From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-bounces@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Curtis Maurand Sent: Tuesday, July 28, 2015 6:43 PM To: Niels Bakker <niels=nanog@bakker.net>; nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Windows 10 Release

Microsoft tells me 3.2 GB for win 10 pro 64 bit.

...

On July 28, 2015 6:04:04 PM EDT, Niels Bakker <niels=nanog@bakker.net> wrote: * nick@flhsi.com (Nick Olsen) [Tue 28 Jul 2015, 22:46 CEST]:

...

Being a 3-4GB download. Each device is moving more data than any Apple

...

update ever did.

I'm not so sure of that. The 10.9 install image clocked in at 4.9 GB, and the Mac App Store for 10.10 Yosemite says "Size: 5.67 GB"; http://www.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/features says "3GB download required" in the small print at the bottom.

-- Niels.

-- Sent from my Android device with K-9 Mail. Please excuse my brevity.

________________________________

CONFIDENTIALITY NOTICE: This e-mail transmission, and any documents, files or previous e-mail messages attached to it may contain confidential information that is legally privileged. If you are not the intended recipient, or a person responsible for delivering it to the intended recipient, you are hereby notified that any disclosure, copying, distribution or use of any of the information contained in or attached to this transmission is STRICTLY PROHIBITED. If you have received this transmission in error please notify the sender immediately by replying to this e-mail. You must destroy the original transmission and its attachments without reading or saving in any manner. Thank you.

You can download an ISO and burn it to install... Guessing if your upgrading multiple machines, that would be the way to go...

You don't even need to burn it to install. Just mount the ISO and run setup.exe ... JG -- Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI - http://www.sol.net "We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me one chance [and] then I won't contact you again." - Direct Marketing Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in the US alone, that's way too many apples.

Since the requirement is that users are upgrading from Win 7, 8, or 8.1 they've already had to create at least a minimal MS ID which means either creating an email account on Outlook.com or providing an existing email address and a password for MS. Scott Helms Vice President of Technology ZCorum (678) 507-5000 -------------------------------- http://twitter.com/kscotthelms -------------------------------- On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Matthew Black <Matthew.Black@csulb.edu> wrote:

Are users required to create any type of Microsoft cloud account (e.g., OneDrive, Office365, et alil) in order to install and use Windows 10? Of Office? Is it possible to simply use Windows 10 without any Microsoft or Google or Yahoo accounts?

Is the unique identifier available to advertisers only through IE (or its successor) OR will it also be available through Firefox/Chrome?

matthew black california state university, long beach

I was just thinking about my remaining Win 7 box _after_ I hit send and I believe you're correct (I have one still to upgrade). Which means users upgrading from 7 to 10 will need to create an ID, but users of 8 and 8.1 will use the one they already have. Scott Helms Vice President of Technology ZCorum (678) 507-5000 -------------------------------- http://twitter.com/kscotthelms -------------------------------- On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 10:23 AM, Brooks Bridges < brooks@firestormnetworks.net> wrote:

Just as a point of debate, I've been using Windows 7 for quite some time and I do not, nor have I ever, given MS any email information or have I created a Live account.

On 7/30/2015 7:19 AM, Scott Helms wrote:

...

Since the requirement is that users are upgrading from Win 7, 8, or 8.1 they've already had to create at least a minimal MS ID which means either creating an email account on Outlook.com or providing an existing email address and a password for MS.

Scott Helms Vice President of Technology ZCorum (678) 507-5000 -------------------------------- http://twitter.com/kscotthelms --------------------------------

On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Matthew Black <Matthew.Black@csulb.edu> wrote:

Are users required to create any type of Microsoft cloud account (e.g.,

...

OneDrive, Office365, et alil) in order to install and use Windows 10? Of Office? Is it possible to simply use Windows 10 without any Microsoft or Google or Yahoo accounts?

Is the unique identifier available to advertisers only through IE (or its successor) OR will it also be available through Firefox/Chrome?

matthew black california state university, long beach

Nope. For the upgrade the only piece of information MSFT needed was your email if you chose email notification once the upgrade was ready for you. After it's installed it will ask to finish up the install the 'Express' method which enabled a bunch of things like WIFI password sharing to friends and whatever else or if you chose the manual option like I did you can disable everything. It will also inherit your existing user settings, so if your user is a local one instead of a cloud one it will continue to be that way. It does install One Drive but again, if you never configured it or used it then you'll simply see it in your task bar with the "welcome" or signup screen. -justin

On Jul 30, 2015, at 10:19 AM, Scott Helms <khelms@zcorum.com> wrote:

Since the requirement is that users are upgrading from Win 7, 8, or 8.1 they've already had to create at least a minimal MS ID which means either creating an email account on Outlook.com or providing an existing email address and a password for MS.

Scott Helms Vice President of Technology ZCorum (678) 507-5000 -------------------------------- http://twitter.com/kscotthelms --------------------------------

On Thu, Jul 30, 2015 at 10:15 AM, Matthew Black <Matthew.Black@csulb.edu> wrote:

...

Are users required to create any type of Microsoft cloud account (e.g., OneDrive, Office365, et alil) in order to install and use Windows 10? Of Office? Is it possible to simply use Windows 10 without any Microsoft or Google or Yahoo accounts?

Is the unique identifier available to advertisers only through IE (or its successor) OR will it also be available through Firefox/Chrome?

matthew black california state university, long beach

Justin,

That's true, but it takes effort for people to either set up a local account or change to one, and very few consumers will do that or have.

Wow, then, problem solved, because it's at least twice as hard to get your Microsoft Account set up, configured, and verified. The sticky point is that very few consumers will KNOW that they can avoid the Microsoft account, and most won't take the time to explore the various options and possibilities. This isn't an effort thing. Setting up a local account is fairly effortless. It's a matter of the option being hidden away, because it is in Microsoft's interest to get everyone using the Windows cloud magic. ... JG -- Joe Greco - sol.net Network Services - Milwaukee, WI - http://www.sol.net "We call it the 'one bite at the apple' rule. Give me one chance [and] then I won't contact you again." - Direct Marketing Ass'n position on e-mail spam(CNN) With 24 million small businesses in the US alone, that's way too many apples.

On 01/08/2015 03:27, Keith Medcalf wrote:

It just means that you cannot use the crappy apps or the crappy app store.

which is fine until Microsoft ties in future software upgrades to the app store and you find that you can't upgrade without tying yourself into a Microsoft account. E.g. just like they did with the Windows 8.0 to 8.1 upgrade. Nick

1. Aug 2015 10:05 by nick@foobar.org:

On 01/08/2015 03:27, Keith Medcalf wrote:

...

It just means that you cannot use the crappy apps or the crappy app store.

which is fine until Microsoft ties in future software upgrades to the app store and you find that you can't upgrade without tying yourself into a Microsoft account.

E.g. just like they did with the Windows 8.0 to 8.1 upgrade.

It's been a while but I'm near certain that they did not require a microsoft account to download the 8.1 update - you just had to use their sucky application to start the process

You do not have to create or use a Microsoft account to use Windows 10 or any of the apps (other than the MS Store.) You can continue to log in to Windows using a local account. Aaron Childs Associate Director, Infrastructure Services  Information Technology Services Wilson Hall - 577 Western Ave. Westfield MA 01086 -----Original Message----- From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-bounces@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Matthew Black Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2015 10:16 AM To: North American Network Operators' Group (nanog@nanog.org) <nanog@nanog.org> Subject: RE: Windows 10 Release Are users required to create any type of Microsoft cloud account (e.g., OneDrive, Office365, et alil) in order to install and use Windows 10? Of Office? Is it possible to simply use Windows 10 without any Microsoft or Google or Yahoo accounts? Is the unique identifier available to advertisers only through IE (or its successor) OR will it also be available through Firefox/Chrome? matthew black california state university, long beach

'QoS problems are to be expected' . Uh? Don't you put QoS into place just to ensure that the minimum bandwidth you need to ensure critical services (such that your voice traffic is not impeded for example) are NOT affected across your WAN links when there are big globs of data banging around? Surely, If anything, this is the one case and time when the QoS deployment effort can be shown to have value (obviously the policies would already have been validated against saturated links as part of sign off) alan