There were several other providers who got notes from me about prefixes that were flapping every several seconds or thereabouts. The tally so far: Polite "we have a ticket open and will get someone to fix things" from three providers (thanks ANS, BBN, EBONE). A trio of no-answer-yets, one of which has since been fixed, one of which will be fixed since I have the advantage of sharing a room with the routing guru of the NSP in question and the bigger advantage of not needing nearly as much sleep. :-) The third no-answer-yet is from a smaller provider in Europe, and I expect they'll get back to me in their morning. Finally, there was the previous reply. Sean. P.S.: Oh, I also have to thank Pushpendra Mohta of CERFNET who replied to an earlier note personally with an explanation of what was going on.
Can we stop this bashing right here, Sean? I don't believe that this list is the adequate forum four such childish behaviour. I have a collection of your past emails and I am rather fed up withthis. Can Sean be removed from the list? These are not contributions in any sense of constructivity at all. Sprint can very well chose a different person to make their corporate views known on an nanog scale.Mike Mike On Mon, 11 Sep 1995, Sean Doran wrote:
There were several other providers who got notes from me about prefixes that were flapping every several seconds or thereabouts. The tally so far:
Polite "we have a ticket open and will get someone to fix things" from three providers (thanks ANS, BBN, EBONE).
A trio of no-answer-yets, one of which has since been fixed, one of which will be fixed since I have the advantage of sharing a room with the routing guru of the NSP in question and the bigger advantage of not needing nearly as much sleep. :-)
The third no-answer-yet is from a smaller provider in Europe, and I expect they'll get back to me in their morning.
Finally, there was the previous reply.
Sean.
P.S.: Oh, I also have to thank Pushpendra Mohta of CERFNET who replied to an earlier note personally with an explanation of what was going on.
------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael F. Nittmann mn@ios.com Senior Network Architect ------------ IDT/IOS - Internet Online Services ---------- 294 State Street -------- Hackensack, NJ 07601 ------ ---- +1 (201) 928 1000 xt. 500 -- +1 (201) 928 1057 FAX +1 (201) 441 5861 Pager \/
Michael, Sprint and Sean are at the forefront of many issues involved with scaling issues on the Internet. I have found his comments are valuable, and not childish. Michael keep your comments to yourself. Bob Gibson Capital Area Internet Service On Mon, 11 Sep 1995, Michael F. Nittmann wrote:
Can we stop this bashing right here, Sean? I don't believe that this list is the adequate forum four such childish behaviour. I have a collection of your past emails and I am rather fed up withthis.
Can Sean be removed from the list? These are not contributions in any sense of constructivity at all.
Sprint can very well chose a different person to make their corporate views known on an nanog scale.Mike
Mike
On Mon, 11 Sep 1995, Sean Doran wrote:
There were several other providers who got notes from me about prefixes that were flapping every several seconds or thereabouts. The tally so far:
Polite "we have a ticket open and will get someone to fix things" from three providers (thanks ANS, BBN, EBONE).
A trio of no-answer-yets, one of which has since been fixed, one of which will be fixed since I have the advantage of sharing a room with the routing guru of the NSP in question and the bigger advantage of not needing nearly as much sleep. :-)
The third no-answer-yet is from a smaller provider in Europe, and I expect they'll get back to me in their morning.
Finally, there was the previous reply.
Sean.
P.S.: Oh, I also have to thank Pushpendra Mohta of CERFNET who replied to an earlier note personally with an explanation of what was going on.
------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael F. Nittmann mn@ios.com Senior Network Architect ------------ IDT/IOS - Internet Online Services ---------- 294 State Street -------- Hackensack, NJ 07601 ------ ---- +1 (201) 928 1000 xt. 500 -- +1 (201) 928 1057 FAX +1 (201) 441 5861 Pager \/
On Mon, 11 Sep 1995, Michael F. Nittmann wrote:
Can we stop this bashing right here, Sean? I don't believe that this list
How was this bashing exactly? -dorian
On Mon, 11 Sep 1995, Sean Doran wrote:
There were several other providers who got notes from me about prefixes that were flapping every several seconds or thereabouts. The tally so far:
Polite "we have a ticket open and will get someone to fix things" from three providers (thanks ANS, BBN, EBONE).
A trio of no-answer-yets, one of which has since been fixed, one of which will be fixed since I have the advantage of sharing a room with the routing guru of the NSP in question and the bigger advantage of not needing nearly as much sleep. :-)
The third no-answer-yet is from a smaller provider in Europe, and I expect they'll get back to me in their morning.
Finally, there was the previous reply.
Sean.
P.S.: Oh, I also have to thank Pushpendra Mohta of CERFNET who replied to an earlier note personally with an explanation of what was going on.
------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael F. Nittmann mn@ios.com Senior Network Architect ------------ IDT/IOS - Internet Online Services ---------- 294 State Street -------- Hackensack, NJ 07601 ------ ---- +1 (201) 928 1000 xt. 500 -- +1 (201) 928 1057 FAX +1 (201) 441 5861 Pager \/
______________________________________________________________________________ Dorian Kim Email: dorian@cic.net 2901 Hubbard Drive Network Engineer Phone: (313)998-6976 Ann Arbor MI 48105 CICNet Network Systems Fax: (313)998-6105 http://www.cic.net/~dorian
Can we stop this bashing right here, Sean? I don't believe that this list is the adequate forum four such childish behaviour. I have a collection of your past emails and I am rather fed up withthis.
Can Sean be removed from the list? These are not contributions in any sense of constructivity at all.
I disagree. When the traditional channels don't work, sometimes publicity is the only thing to cause a company to pay attention. Do not underestimate the value of peer pressure. We all have to resort to it at one point or another. Furthermore, Sean has contributed many construtive posts to this list in the onslaught of arguments. Let's not call the kettle black. Dave -- Dave Siegel President, RTD Systems & Networking, Inc. (520)318-0696 Systems Consultant -- Unix, LANs, WANs, Cisco dsiegel@rtd.com User Tracking & Acctg -- "Written by an ISP, http://www.rtd.com/ for an ISP."
Well, after all this, can we then get say to a point where we define like engineering guidelines. This exists in machine engineering and everywhere else. It would mean that certain types of access shouldbe designed in a certain manner, and also explain why and what the impacts are (see my earlier post, yes, everybody knows how to do this). There are more points, not only this one: proxy agg, as path manipulation etc. This way a provider has at least the chance to check if his design is 'within the normal and customary'. Since these things are no corporate secrets, how about giving it a corner on the merit web sites? I still maintain that public complaint about something that is between providers, without (this is the point) constructive proposal of a solution, is public whining. Well, you all seem to accept and like this, we all have our views. Mike On Tue, 12 Sep 1995, Dave Siegel wrote:
Can we stop this bashing right here, Sean? I don't believe that this list is the adequate forum four such childish behaviour. I have a collection of your past emails and I am rather fed up withthis.
Can Sean be removed from the list? These are not contributions in any sense of constructivity at all.
I disagree.
When the traditional channels don't work, sometimes publicity is the only thing to cause a company to pay attention.
Do not underestimate the value of peer pressure. We all have to resort to it at one point or another.
Furthermore, Sean has contributed many construtive posts to this list in the onslaught of arguments.
Let's not call the kettle black.
Dave
-- Dave Siegel President, RTD Systems & Networking, Inc. (520)318-0696 Systems Consultant -- Unix, LANs, WANs, Cisco dsiegel@rtd.com User Tracking & Acctg -- "Written by an ISP, http://www.rtd.com/ for an ISP."
------------------------------------------------------------------- Michael F. Nittmann mn@ios.com Senior Network Architect ------------ IDT/IOS - Internet Online Services ---------- 294 State Street -------- Hackensack, NJ 07601 ------ ---- +1 (201) 928 1000 xt. 500 -- +1 (201) 928 1057 FAX +1 (201) 441 5861 Pager \/
participants (5)
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Dave Siegel -
Dorian Rysling Kim -
Michael F. Nittmann -
Robert Gibson -
Sean Doran