One of our own in the Guardian.
On 2013-07-13 14:44, Bill Woodcock wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/09/xmission-isp-customers-privacy-n...
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?) I do hope the latest patches $network_vendor has sent Pete allows him to get IPv6 to me, though. :-P Jima
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home? Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA. I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month. This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN. Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW! -- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
Someone I know in Washington state has 100/100 at home and made the comment to me a year ago that it was one of the slower speeds offered. I am not sure who his ISP is however. -Grant On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Joe Hamelin <joe@nethead.com> wrote:
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
http://www.nwi.net/ I'm thinking. Rides the county's fiber network. I remember delivering them T1s from Seattle back in the day ('96ish). I sure wish I could get some of that love. -- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474 On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:32 PM, Grant Ridder <shortdudey123@gmail.com>wrote:
Someone I know in Washington state has 100/100 at home and made the comment to me a year ago that it was one of the slower speeds offered. I am not sure who his ISP is however.
-Grant
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Joe Hamelin <joe@nethead.com> wrote:
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
He might have been talking about Condo Internet if he is in the Seattle area. They deliver 1Gig connections to your Condo/Apartment, if your in one of the buildings they service. Also I wanted to mention that I have only seen,heard and experienced good things from Xmission. It is nice to see how they have been handling these issues. Sincerely, Mark On 7/13/2013 9:32 PM, Grant Ridder wrote:
Someone I know in Washington state has 100/100 at home and made the comment to me a year ago that it was one of the slower speeds offered. I am not sure who his ISP is however.
-Grant
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Joe Hamelin <joe@nethead.com> wrote:
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:46 PM, Mark Keymer <mark@viviotech.net> wrote:
He might have been talking about Condo Internet if he is in the Seattle area. They deliver 1Gig connections to your Condo/Apartment, if your in one of the buildings they service.
I know the guy that does Condo. He was a very good friend of a very good friend of NANOG. Joe Wood (RIP) from Google, Flying Croc, and Wolfe. They were just starting a CLEC in the Puget Sound area when Joe died. Damn, I miss that bastard. -- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
Yep, that would be us. :) Lots of 100/100 and 1g/1g home Ethernet connections around the Seattle area. :) Joe was a great guy, we miss him still, one of the nicest guys I knew. John van Oppen Spectrum Networks Direct: 206-973-8302 Main: 206-973-8300 ________________________________________ From: Joe Hamelin [joe@nethead.com] Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2013 10:46 PM To: Mark Keymer Cc: NANOG list Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:46 PM, Mark Keymer <mark@viviotech.net> wrote:
He might have been talking about Condo Internet if he is in the Seattle area. They deliver 1Gig connections to your Condo/Apartment, if your in one of the buildings they service.
I know the guy that does Condo. He was a very good friend of a very good friend of NANOG. Joe Wood (RIP) from Google, Flying Croc, and Wolfe. They were just starting a CLEC in the Puget Sound area when Joe died. Damn, I miss that bastard. -- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
X2 on Joe. ---Nick On 7/14/13 6:52 PM, "John van Oppen" <jvanoppen@spectrumnet.us> wrote:
Yep, that would be us. :) Lots of 100/100 and 1g/1g home Ethernet connections around the Seattle area. :)
Joe was a great guy, we miss him still, one of the nicest guys I knew.
John van Oppen Spectrum Networks Direct: 206-973-8302 Main: 206-973-8300
________________________________________ From: Joe Hamelin [joe@nethead.com] Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2013 10:46 PM To: Mark Keymer Cc: NANOG list Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian.
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:46 PM, Mark Keymer <mark@viviotech.net> wrote:
He might have been talking about Condo Internet if he is in the Seattle area. They deliver 1Gig connections to your Condo/Apartment, if your in one of the buildings they service.
I know the guy that does Condo. He was a very good friend of a very good friend of NANOG. Joe Wood (RIP) from Google, Flying Croc, and Wolfe. They were just starting a CLEC in the Puget Sound area when Joe died.
Damn, I miss that bastard.
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
Nice to see our network talked about on here :0) -----Original Message----- From: Grant Ridder [mailto:shortdudey123@gmail.com] Sent: Saturday, July 13, 2013 9:33 PM To: Joe Hamelin Cc: NANOG list Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. Someone I know in Washington state has 100/100 at home and made the comment to me a year ago that it was one of the slower speeds offered. I am not sure who his ISP is however. -Grant On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:20 PM, Joe Hamelin <joe@nethead.com> wrote:
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
Yet, here, where I live, only 47 road miles from New York City, I have a cable company who sells me metered (yes, METERED) DOCSIS, for nearly $100/month, 35/3. The limitation is like 100 GB/month or something (the equivalent of the amount of Netflix or AppleTV my kids watch in a weekend) No alternatives, no FiOS, no nothing. Well, I can get 3/.768 DSL if I please. Someone, please help me. Please.
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
In Mountain View (the middle of Silicon Valley) the only choice i have is overpriced Comcast w/ a 300 gig limit. I used to chew threw 300 gig in a week when i was in school. -Grant On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:44 PM, Alex Rubenstein <alex@corp.nac.net> wrote:
Yet, here, where I live, only 47 road miles from New York City, I have a cable company who sells me metered (yes, METERED) DOCSIS, for nearly $100/month, 35/3. The limitation is like 100 GB/month or something (the equivalent of the amount of Netflix or AppleTV my kids watch in a weekend) No alternatives, no FiOS, no nothing. Well, I can get 3/.768 DSL if I please.
Someone, please help me.
Please.
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire
store.
They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
There are a few wireless providers that serve the Mountain View area.. -Mike Founder Ridge Wireless www.ridgewireless.net Sent from my iPhone On Jul 13, 2013, at 21:56, Grant Ridder <shortdudey123@gmail.com> wrote:
In Mountain View (the middle of Silicon Valley) the only choice i have is overpriced Comcast w/ a 300 gig limit. I used to chew threw 300 gig in a week when i was in school.
-Grant
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:44 PM, Alex Rubenstein <alex@corp.nac.net> wrote:
Yet, here, where I live, only 47 road miles from New York City, I have a cable company who sells me metered (yes, METERED) DOCSIS, for nearly $100/month, 35/3. The limitation is like 100 GB/month or something (the equivalent of the amount of Netflix or AppleTV my kids watch in a weekend) No alternatives, no FiOS, no nothing. Well, I can get 3/.768 DSL if I please.
Someone, please help me.
Please.
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire
store.
They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
Well, I think Google has the right idea with providing Internet by floating balloons. And the way that cell phone tech has been improving, we might all have 10G in... 10 years or so? If Google is providing it, it'll be monitored by our government but hey, we'll have enough bandwidth to hang ourselves with :) I really wish more places would just start Internet co-ops. On Jul 14, 2013 1:10 AM, "Mike Lyon" <mike.lyon@gmail.com> wrote:
There are a few wireless providers that serve the Mountain View area..
-Mike
Founder Ridge Wireless www.ridgewireless.net
Sent from my iPhone
On Jul 13, 2013, at 21:56, Grant Ridder <shortdudey123@gmail.com> wrote:
In Mountain View (the middle of Silicon Valley) the only choice i have is overpriced Comcast w/ a 300 gig limit. I used to chew threw 300 gig in a week when i was in school.
-Grant
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:44 PM, Alex Rubenstein <alex@corp.nac.net> wrote:
Yet, here, where I live, only 47 road miles from New York City, I have a cable company who sells me metered (yes, METERED) DOCSIS, for nearly $100/month, 35/3. The limitation is like 100 GB/month or something (the equivalent of the amount of Netflix or AppleTV my kids watch in a weekend) No alternatives, no FiOS, no nothing. Well, I can get 3/.768 DSL if I please.
Someone, please help me.
Please.
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire
store.
They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
Don't know about you, but when I log into my Comcast account I see : *Note:enforcement of the 250GB data consumption threshold is currently suspended * Even then, the 250GB only ever applied for the "slower" accounts. Scott On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:49 PM, Grant Ridder <shortdudey123@gmail.com>wrote:
In Mountain View (the middle of Silicon Valley) the only choice i have is overpriced Comcast w/ a 300 gig limit. I used to chew threw 300 gig in a week when i was in school.
-Grant
On Sat, Jul 13, 2013 at 9:44 PM, Alex Rubenstein <alex@corp.nac.net> wrote:
Yet, here, where I live, only 47 road miles from New York City, I have a cable company who sells me metered (yes, METERED) DOCSIS, for nearly $100/month, 35/3. The limitation is like 100 GB/month or something (the equivalent of the amount of Netflix or AppleTV my kids watch in a weekend) No alternatives, no FiOS, no nothing. Well, I can get 3/.768 DSL if I please.
Someone, please help me.
Please.
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire
store.
They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
and here i am in the icann-selected hotel for the icann conference, and they gave us a total of 500MB of metered usage. for our entire stay, not per day. (should be better on the conference net). maybe i should just check out and check in every day. On Jul 14, 2013, at 6:44 AM, Alex Rubenstein <alex@corp.nac.net> wrote:
Yet, here, where I live, only 47 road miles from New York City, I have a cable company who sells me metered (yes, METERED) DOCSIS, for nearly $100/month, 35/3. The limitation is like 100 GB/month or something (the equivalent of the amount of Netflix or AppleTV my kids watch in a weekend) No alternatives, no FiOS, no nothing. Well, I can get 3/.768 DSL if I please.
Someone, please help me.
Please.
Jima said: Really, who has 100/100 at home?
Oddly, those living in Grand Coulee, WA.
I went there once to setup corporate connectivity for a regional tire store. They ordered the minimal drop, 50/50Mbs. One of the tire changers there told me that he had 100/100 at home for $50/month.
This was a town without T-Mobile service. I had to haul out the butt set and clip on to the business POTS lines to turn up the VPN.
Most of rural Central Washington has very good fiber connectivity. Forward looking Public Utility Districts FTW!
-- Joe Hamelin, W7COM, Tulalip, WA, 360-474-7474
On Jul 14, 2013, at 6:50 AM, Mark Seiden <mis@seiden.com> wrote:
and here i am in the icann-selected hotel for the icann conference, and they gave us a total of 500MB of metered usage.
Trust me, the 500MB limit (per day, and resettable if you go down to the front desk and request more) is the least of your worries: % ping trantor.virtualized.org .... Request timeout for icmp_seq 179 Request timeout for icmp_seq 180 Request timeout for icmp_seq 181 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=104 ttl=40 time=78594.936 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=64 ttl=40 time=119037.553 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=80 ttl=40 time=103268.363 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=80 ttl=40 time=103690.981 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=64 ttl=40 time=120196.719 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=64 ttl=40 time=120333.246 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=85 ttl=40 time=99395.502 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=105 ttl=40 time=79406.728 ms Request timeout for icmp_seq 186 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=93 ttl=40 time=94822.040 ms Request timeout for icmp_seq 188 Request timeout for icmp_seq 189 ... Regards, -drc
You're on a continent with the second least amount of light pollution of all of the continents on earth (iirc) and are somehow surprised about bad net access? I would question the wisdom of planning a tech conference there, but not the facility itself. On Sun, Jul 14, 2013 at 4:16 AM, David Conrad <drc@virtualized.org> wrote:
On Jul 14, 2013, at 6:50 AM, Mark Seiden <mis@seiden.com> wrote:
and here i am in the icann-selected hotel for the icann conference, and they gave us a total of 500MB of metered usage.
Trust me, the 500MB limit (per day, and resettable if you go down to the front desk and request more) is the least of your worries:
% ping trantor.virtualized.org .... Request timeout for icmp_seq 179 Request timeout for icmp_seq 180 Request timeout for icmp_seq 181 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=104 ttl=40 time=78594.936 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=64 ttl=40 time=119037.553 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=80 ttl=40 time=103268.363 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=80 ttl=40 time=103690.981 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=64 ttl=40 time=120196.719 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=64 ttl=40 time=120333.246 ms (DUP!) 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=85 ttl=40 time=99395.502 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=105 ttl=40 time=79406.728 ms Request timeout for icmp_seq 186 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=93 ttl=40 time=94822.040 ms Request timeout for icmp_seq 188 Request timeout for icmp_seq 189 ...
Regards, -drc
On Jul 14, 2013, at 2:12 AM, shawn wilson <ag4ve.us@gmail.com> wrote:
You're on a continent with the second least amount of light pollution of all of the continents on earth (iirc) and are somehow surprised about bad net access? I would question the wisdom of planning a tech conference there, but not the facility itself.
Nope. Here's a trace to the same destination, from Cape Town: woody$ ping trantor.virtualized.org PING trantor.virtualized.org (199.48.134.42): 56 data bytes 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=0 ttl=241 time=228.552 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=1 ttl=241 time=241.209 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=2 ttl=241 time=243.835 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=3 ttl=241 time=316.949 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=4 ttl=241 time=283.197 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=5 ttl=241 time=229.341 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=6 ttl=241 time=242.710 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=7 ttl=241 time=307.105 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=8 ttl=241 time=330.387 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=9 ttl=241 time=244.312 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=10 ttl=241 time=231.485 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=11 ttl=241 time=241.859 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=12 ttl=241 time=249.606 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=13 ttl=241 time=250.695 ms 64 bytes from 199.48.134.42: icmp_seq=14 ttl=241 time=253.704 ms ^C --- trantor.virtualized.org ping statistics --- 15 packets transmitted, 15 packets received, 0.0% packet loss round-trip min/avg/max/stddev = 228.552/259.663/330.387/32.060 ms b8f6b1147369:~ woody$ -Bill
On Jul 14, 2013 5:36 AM, "Bill Woodcock" <woody@pch.net> wrote:
On Jul 14, 2013, at 2:12 AM, shawn wilson <ag4ve.us@gmail.com> wrote:
You're on a continent with the second least amount of light pollution of all of the continents on earth (iirc) and are somehow surprised about bad net access? I would question the wisdom of planning a tech conference there, but not the facility itself.
Nope.
Heh nice pic :) Ok I've been wrong before.
On Jul 14, 2013, at 11:12 AM, shawn wilson <ag4ve.us@gmail.com> wrote:
You're on a continent with the second least amount of light pollution of all of the continents on earth (iirc) and are somehow surprised about bad net access?
Africa is not homogeneous.
I would question the wisdom of planning a tech conference there, but not the facility itself.
Actually, I expect the bandwidth/latency at the conference venue itself is fine (has been so far, but the conference hasn't really started yet), even given the high-bandwidth requirements (streaming audio and video in parallel sessions and around 2000 attendees and a zillion wifi devices). ICANN has been doing this for a while in a bunch of different places (some significantly more challenging than Durban, ZA). I suspect the problem is the (offsite) hotel that Mark and I are at was not really prepared for a full house of folks interested in viewing streams, downloading documents, etc. (despite attempts to inform the hotel of the impending tsunami). I imagine folks involved in setting up NANOG-related networks might be familiar with this sort of situation... Regards, -drc
I suspect the problem is the (offsite) hotel that Mark and I are at was not really prepared for a full house of folks interested in viewing streams, downloading documents, etc. (despite attempts to inform the hotel of the impending tsunami). I imagine folks involved in setting up NANOG-related networks might be familiar with this sort of situation...
I've talked to people who do conference arrangements, and no matter what you tell the hotel, the hotel talks to their outsourced Internet provider, who tells them it will be fine, which of course it will not be. The hotel outsourcers also tend to have poorly trained staff who think that the way to increase wifi capacity is to turn the power on all of the APs up to 11. The IETF deals with this problem by writing into the conference agreement that their netops people will take over the hotel's network for the duration of the meeting, and bring in their own adequate backhaul. Dunno what ICANN does.
On 7/14/13 7:22 AM, John Levine wrote:
I suspect the problem is the (offsite) hotel that Mark and I are at was not really prepared for a full house of folks interested in viewing streams, downloading documents, etc. (despite attempts to inform the hotel of the impending tsunami). I imagine folks involved in setting up NANOG-related networks might be familiar with this sort of situation... I've talked to people who do conference arrangements, and no matter what you tell the hotel, the hotel talks to their outsourced Internet provider, who tells them it will be fine, which of course it will not be. The hotel outsourcers also tend to have poorly trained staff who think that the way to increase wifi capacity is to turn the power on all of the APs up to 11. Simply put they were'nt designed and built to be operated with 100% concurrency. Short of some kind of exceptional contractual arrangement you shouldn't expect them to be different when you arrive then when the facility was contracted. The IETF deals with this problem by writing into the conference agreement that their netops people will take over the hotel's network for the duration of the meeting, and bring in their own adequate backhaul. Dunno what ICANN does. Building a network for a week is expensive. it's gotten a lot simpler and cheaper but it's still relatively extrodinary. Taking over existing infrastructure operating it and putting it back is a new challenge everytime.
On 7/13/2013 10:15 PM, Jima wrote:
On 2013-07-13 14:44, Bill Woodcock wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/09/xmission-isp-customers-privacy-n...
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?)
A whole lot of folks in Chattanooga... https://epbfi.com/enroll/packages/#/fi-speed-internet-100 100Mb symmetric is $69/mo, 250Mb is $139, 1Gbit is $299 Largely Alcatel/Lucent GPON. Business rates considerably higher :) They are one of our providers and we aren't "metered". I don't know how they're handling domestic rates / quotas. Jeff
On 14 July 2013 10:11, Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> wrote:
On 7/13/2013 10:15 PM, Jima wrote:
On 2013-07-13 14:44, Bill Woodcock wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/09/xmission-isp-customers-privacy-n...
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?)
A whole lot of folks in Chattanooga... https://epbfi.com/enroll/packages/#/fi-speed-internet-100
100Mb symmetric is $69/mo, 250Mb is $139, 1Gbit is $299
Largely Alcatel/Lucent GPON. Business rates considerably higher :) They are one of our providers and we aren't "metered". I don't know how they're handling domestic rates / quotas.
There are a number of 100/100 under $100/mo providers in the US, but most of them are concentrated in various rural areas. I've tried maintaining an up-to-date list of providers with reasonable offers at http://bmap.su/, but lately haven't had the time to keep on updating it. C.
I would imagine this cheap rural fiber showed up after the RUS stimulus? A former employer (GCI, in Anchorage Alaska) received quite a bit of money in the form of a grant/loan for a rural fiber network (I think they may have received the largest of all grants). Would be interesting to know how much of this was as a result of dot gov funding. Sent from my Mobile Device. -------- Original message -------- From: "Constantine A. Murenin" <mureninc@gmail.com> Date: 07/14/2013 10:59 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. On 14 July 2013 10:11, Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> wrote:
On 7/13/2013 10:15 PM, Jima wrote:
On 2013-07-13 14:44, Bill Woodcock wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/09/xmission-isp-customers-privacy-n...
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?)
A whole lot of folks in Chattanooga... https://epbfi.com/enroll/packages/#/fi-speed-internet-100
100Mb symmetric is $69/mo, 250Mb is $139, 1Gbit is $299
Largely Alcatel/Lucent GPON. Business rates considerably higher :) They are one of our providers and we aren't "metered". I don't know how they're handling domestic rates / quotas.
There are a number of 100/100 under $100/mo providers in the US, but most of them are concentrated in various rural areas. I've tried maintaining an up-to-date list of providers with reasonable offers at http://bmap.su/, but lately haven't had the time to keep on updating it. C.
On 7/14/2013 3:37 PM, Warren Bailey wrote:
I would imagine this cheap rural fiber showed up after the RUS stimulus? A former employer (GCI, in Anchorage Alaska) received quite a bit of money in the form of a grant/loan for a rural fiber network (I think they may have received the largest of all grants). Would be interesting to know how much of this was as a result of dot gov funding.
It's decidedly not yet "rural" but starting to expand beyond simple urban. It is our Electric provider utility, and much of the build out was tied to "Smart Grid" power meter integration. I'm not familiar with the politics, but there were some battles over funding and justification. They are competing with (at least) Comcast/XFinity, AT&T/Uverse, and Charter in the local market. Their initial buildout pre-dated "stimulus funding". We were involved in an earlier effort for "Metro Ethernet" but that didn't work out so well. The more recent GPON is the ongoing success story. Jeff
On Sun, Jul 14, 2013 at 3:49 PM, Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> wrote:
It is our Electric provider utility, and much of the build out was tied to "Smart Grid" power meter integration. I'm not familiar with the politics, but there were some battles over funding and justification.
Power Utility issues vis-a-vis fiber were discussed by James Salter at this years F2c http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=04b-IzSRh0M&list=PLuVpWA96MxueWSaBIonLaoJBb6KHM6qGj&index=8 -- --------------------------------------------------------------- Joly MacFie 218 565 9365 Skype:punkcast WWWhatsup NYC - http://wwwhatsup.com http://pinstand.com - http://punkcast.com VP (Admin) - ISOC-NY - http://isoc-ny.org -------------------------------------------------------------- -
I'm happy to say we did not use federal or state money to build the fiber or the network in Grant County. There is some of that floating around us though. -----Original Message----- From: Warren Bailey [mailto:wbailey@satelliteintelligencegroup.com] Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 12:37 PM To: Constantine A. Murenin; Jeff Kell Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. I would imagine this cheap rural fiber showed up after the RUS stimulus? A former employer (GCI, in Anchorage Alaska) received quite a bit of money in the form of a grant/loan for a rural fiber network (I think they may have received the largest of all grants). Would be interesting to know how much of this was as a result of dot gov funding. Sent from my Mobile Device. -------- Original message -------- From: "Constantine A. Murenin" <mureninc@gmail.com> Date: 07/14/2013 10:59 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. On 14 July 2013 10:11, Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> wrote:
On 7/13/2013 10:15 PM, Jima wrote:
On 2013-07-13 14:44, Bill Woodcock wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/09/xmission-isp-customers-p rivacy-nsa
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?)
A whole lot of folks in Chattanooga... https://epbfi.com/enroll/packages/#/fi-speed-internet-100
100Mb symmetric is $69/mo, 250Mb is $139, 1Gbit is $299
Largely Alcatel/Lucent GPON. Business rates considerably higher :) They are one of our providers and we aren't "metered". I don't know how they're handling domestic rates / quotas.
There are a number of 100/100 under $100/mo providers in the US, but most of them are concentrated in various rural areas. I've tried maintaining an up-to-date list of providers with reasonable offers at http://bmap.su/, but lately haven't had the time to keep on updating it. C.
Many of the Washington state PUDs very early in the day took on the charge of delivering "broadband" to places that the telco's did not see ROI for. It did and still does make sense to deliver fiber along with power to the home but that is the kind of long term thinking that can be costly up front for future improved quality of life. Nice to see some acknowledgement on the list of that vision. +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ Nick Guy | Network Architecture | NoaNet | nickguy@noanet.net| +-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------+ -----Original Message----- From: Robert Bergman [mailto:Rbergma@gcpud.org] Sent: Monday, July 15, 2013 8:34 AM To: Warren Bailey; Constantine A. Murenin; Jeff Kell Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: RE: One of our own in the Guardian. I'm happy to say we did not use federal or state money to build the fiber or the network in Grant County. There is some of that floating around us though. -----Original Message----- From: Warren Bailey [mailto:wbailey@satelliteintelligencegroup.com] Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 12:37 PM To: Constantine A. Murenin; Jeff Kell Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. I would imagine this cheap rural fiber showed up after the RUS stimulus? A former employer (GCI, in Anchorage Alaska) received quite a bit of money in the form of a grant/loan for a rural fiber network (I think they may have received the largest of all grants). Would be interesting to know how much of this was as a result of dot gov funding. Sent from my Mobile Device. -------- Original message -------- From: "Constantine A. Murenin" <mureninc@gmail.com> Date: 07/14/2013 10:59 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. On 14 July 2013 10:11, Jeff Kell <jeff-kell@utc.edu> wrote:
On 7/13/2013 10:15 PM, Jima wrote:
On 2013-07-13 14:44, Bill Woodcock wrote:
http://www.guardian.co.uk/world/2013/jul/09/xmission-isp-customers-p rivacy-nsa
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?)
A whole lot of folks in Chattanooga... https://epbfi.com/enroll/packages/#/fi-speed-internet-100
100Mb symmetric is $69/mo, 250Mb is $139, 1Gbit is $299
Largely Alcatel/Lucent GPON. Business rates considerably higher :) They are one of our providers and we aren't "metered". I don't know how they're handling domestic rates / quotas.
There are a number of 100/100 under $100/mo providers in the US, but most of them are concentrated in various rural areas. I've tried maintaining an up-to-date list of providers with reasonable offers at http://bmap.su/, but lately haven't had the time to keep on updating it. C.
On 2013-07-13 20:15, Jima wrote:
I can happily state that XMission is my home ISP, with UTOPIA (city-involved fiber optic provider) as the local loop. (Really, who has 100/100 at home?)
Thanks to everyone who responded -- my list of places I'm willing to live is rounding out. ;-) XMission does offer 1000/1000, as well; I seem to recall the price is something like $300/mo. For us, the problem was more finding remote sites that can push data rates anywhere near one's own limit (as it's enough of a problem at 100mbit), making the price bump not quite worth it. The unfortunate fallout from having such great service is that I live in fear of having to move outside of a UTOPIA service area, and back to the duopoly providers (Comcast & CenturyLink for the most part here). One might suggest getting XMission over DSL, but CenturyLink has been locking out third-party providers as they've rolled out ADSL2. Jima
On 7/14/2013 9:08 PM, Jima wrote:
XMission does offer 1000/1000, as well; I seem to recall the price is something like $300/mo. For us, the problem was more finding remote sites that can push data rates anywhere near one's own limit (as it's enough of a problem at 100mbit), making the price bump not quite worth it.
Very true. We have two gigs, but a commercial speedtest comes up seriously short (typically 100+ Mbps) while a locally hosted speedtest will show 800-900+. Not sure how much is "their" upstream versus simple physics... you'd have to be the only test subject to a gig-connected server to do much better. We have had some "contrived" examples over I2 that pushed 500Mbps symmetric, but they ran that demo over our I2 pipe because their commodity link couldn't deliver the necessary rate/latency. Jeff
To be honest, that is the problem with most smaller ISPs, their uplinks are not all 10G... The only way to have users who reliably get high speed tests is to make sure one does not have 1G upstream links but obviously for a smaller provider that would not be an option. I think this is why our retail service routinely is in the top few on the public speed test sites in the US... The (obvious) secret is having more than 1G of headroom on every link to the world and using a lot of 10G internally. From my testing on my home link to our network and a bunch of customer links, public speed tests of above 800 mbit/sec on gigE are pretty achievable assuming the testing server is in the same metro and well provisioned (IE not on a tiny ISP). John -----Original Message----- From: Jeff Kell [mailto:jeff-kell@utc.edu] Sent: Sunday, July 14, 2013 10:50 PM To: Jima Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: One of our own in the Guardian. On 7/14/2013 9:08 PM, Jima wrote:
XMission does offer 1000/1000, as well; I seem to recall the price is something like $300/mo. For us, the problem was more finding remote sites that can push data rates anywhere near one's own limit (as it's enough of a problem at 100mbit), making the price bump not quite worth it.
Very true. We have two gigs, but a commercial speedtest comes up seriously short (typically 100+ Mbps) while a locally hosted speedtest will show 800-900+. Not sure how much is "their" upstream versus simple physics... you'd have to be the only test subject to a gig-connected server to do much better. We have had some "contrived" examples over I2 that pushed 500Mbps symmetric, but they ran that demo over our I2 pipe because their commodity link couldn't deliver the necessary rate/latency. Jeff
participants (20)
-
Alex Rubenstein -
Bill Woodcock -
Constantine A. Murenin -
David Conrad -
Grant Ridder -
Jeff Kell -
Jima -
Joe Hamelin -
joel jaeggli -
John Levine -
John van Oppen -
Joly MacFie -
Mark Keymer -
Mark Seiden -
Mike Lyon -
Nick Guy -
Robert Bergman -
Scott Howard -
shawn wilson -
Warren Bailey