http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57598978-93/google-outage-reportedly-caused... "How big is the Internet"? Depends in whether Google is up or not? -- Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics of System Administrators: Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to learn from their mistakes. (Adapted from Stephen Pinker)
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*? -Blake On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:38 AM, Larry Sheldon <LarrySheldon@cox.net> wrote:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-**1023_3-57598978-93/google-** outage-reportedly-caused-big-**drop-in-global-traffic/<http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57598978-93/google-outage-reportedly-caused-big-drop-in-global-traffic/>
"How big is the Internet"?
Depends in whether Google is up or not?
-- Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics of System Administrators: Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to learn from their mistakes. (Adapted from Stephen Pinker)
I have got my local bookmarks. :D On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:42 AM, Blake Dunlap <ikiris@gmail.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
-Blake
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:38 AM, Larry Sheldon <LarrySheldon@cox.net> wrote:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-**1023_3-57598978-93/google-** outage-reportedly-caused-big-**drop-in-global-traffic/< http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57598978-93/google-outage-reportedly-caused...
"How big is the Internet"?
Depends in whether Google is up or not?
-- Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics of System Administrators: Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to learn from their mistakes. (Adapted from Stephen Pinker)
Or I just type in Slashdot.org and off to the races. If DNS went down on the other hand, I'd be mowing my lawn. Sent from my Mobile Device. -------- Original message -------- From: james jones <james@freedomnet.co.nz> Date: 08/19/2013 7:50 AM (GMT-08:00) To: Blake Dunlap <ikiris@gmail.com> Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Trivium I have got my local bookmarks. :D On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:42 AM, Blake Dunlap <ikiris@gmail.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
-Blake
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:38 AM, Larry Sheldon <LarrySheldon@cox.net> wrote:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-**1023_3-57598978-93/google-** outage-reportedly-caused-big-**drop-in-global-traffic/< http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57598978-93/google-outage-reportedly-caused...
"How big is the Internet"?
Depends in whether Google is up or not?
-- Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics of System Administrators: Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to learn from their mistakes. (Adapted from Stephen Pinker)
On Aug 19, 2013, at 10:42 , Blake Dunlap <ikiris@gmail.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
Pretending that wasn't a troll, I wonder how much of the traffic these days is things like AppleTV, Roku, OS updates, iThing/Android 'Apps', etc. that do not require a user to type "www.bing.com" into the Google search box[*] so they can find the web page. -- TTFN, patrick [*] I've actually see someone type "www.yahoo.com" into the Google search box, then use Yahoo! to search for something. Don't ask....
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:38 AM, Larry Sheldon <LarrySheldon@cox.net> wrote:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-**1023_3-57598978-93/google-** outage-reportedly-caused-big-**drop-in-global-traffic/<http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57598978-93/google-outage-reportedly-caused-big-drop-in-global-traffic/>
"How big is the Internet"?
Depends in whether Google is up or not?
-- Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics of System Administrators: Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to learn from their mistakes. (Adapted from Stephen Pinker)
It's pretty well known that the "hottest searches" pages put up by the major search engines filter out the extremely high levels of background noise. Compare http://www.google.com/trends/ with http://www.google.com/trends/explore#cmpt=q while it's more engaging to show the hottest searches as being about your favorite actor or singer, the truth is, those search queries over any appreciable length of time are drowned out by the awe-inspiring number of people typing things like "facebook.com" into the search box so they can click on the link to facebook...instead of just typing it into the URL bar directly. Same with people searching for yahoo on google, or hotmail on yahoo. It isn't the cool, sexy data people want to see, so it gets trimmed out of the "hottest search" results pages. darn it. I had something else I was going to add, but that was 2 hours and two phone calls ago, and now it's completely gone. :/ Matt On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 8:11 AM, Patrick W. Gilmore <patrick@ianai.net>wrote:
On Aug 19, 2013, at 10:42 , Blake Dunlap <ikiris@gmail.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
Pretending that wasn't a troll, I wonder how much of the traffic these days is things like AppleTV, Roku, OS updates, iThing/Android 'Apps', etc. that do not require a user to type "www.bing.com" into the Google search box[*] so they can find the web page.
-- TTFN, patrick
[*] I've actually see someone type "www.yahoo.com" into the Google search box, then use Yahoo! to search for something. Don't ask....
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 2:38 AM, Larry Sheldon <LarrySheldon@cox.net> wrote:
http://news.cnet.com/8301-**1023_3-57598978-93/google-** outage-reportedly-caused-big-**drop-in-global-traffic/< http://news.cnet.com/8301-1023_3-57598978-93/google-outage-reportedly-caused...
"How big is the Internet"?
Depends in whether Google is up or not?
-- Requiescas in pace o email Two identifying characteristics of System Administrators: Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Infallibility, and the ability to learn from their mistakes. (Adapted from Stephen Pinker)
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 9:48 PM, Randy Bush <randy@psg.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
ask that to 20% of the world's population
Turning off Google is essentially doing a rm -rf http:// www-wide analog to rm -rf / or temporarily loss of the root directory, pending a fsck. The important stuff is still there, somewhere... it's just becomes a real chore to get to your files without a useful directory provided by the indexing system, until you can get your superblock repaired. Webcrawler, Gopher sites, and Archie search engine become viable options. There's also backup on some stacks of tapes somewhere labelled Bing, DMOZ, Yahoo, and a few other misc. unlabelled stacks, various well-known .COM and .EDU domains, which you could probably use to find your materials if you downloaded the old Hosts.txt files; if you look long and hard enough, you can still find the filesystem data you need to relink the directory and get at the files you need; it can just be darn inconvenient sorting out all the spam. randy
-- -JH
I'm curious; do people really think that the difference in material indexed between Google, Yahoo/Bing, and others is really that big? I don't mean the heuristics and algorithms used to return the results in a particularly useful order; I mean the sheer raw set of indexed pages. I don't debate that Google found a particularly useful page ranking system; but I question the notion that the loss of Google was akin to the loss of your root directory. Matt On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:12 PM, Jimmy Hess <mysidia@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 9:48 PM, Randy Bush <randy@psg.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
ask that to 20% of the world's population
Turning off Google is essentially doing a rm -rf http:// www-wide analog to rm -rf / or temporarily loss of the root directory, pending a fsck.
The important stuff is still there, somewhere... it's just becomes a real chore to get to your files without a useful directory provided by the indexing system, until you can get your superblock repaired.
Webcrawler, Gopher sites, and Archie search engine become viable options.
There's also backup on some stacks of tapes somewhere labelled Bing, DMOZ, Yahoo, and a few other misc. unlabelled stacks, various well-known .COM and .EDU domains, which you could probably use to find your materials if you downloaded the old Hosts.txt files; if you look long and hard enough, you can still find the filesystem data you need to relink the directory and get at the files you need; it can just be darn inconvenient sorting out all the spam.
randy
-- -JH
I agree. I think its over stated. But I do think there was a more direct customer-disadvantage outcome, albiet increadibly brief. I think a bunch of people like me have now got a better sense our always-on backend is 'brittle' even if very very strong, most of the time. http://www.google.com/appsstatus#hl=en&v=status&ts=1376701087982 suggests it was a disconnection from considerably more than search. I don't believe index analogies jusify some of the scaling/visualization/comparison-to-root-dns things, but I would have been made distinctly uncomfortable in some circumstances by the loss of google backed email, google drive, and their implicit "no local storage required: you're always on" behaviour. An example is when I posted some stuff to the UK from the Post office across from the hotel at IETF, and spend 2 min online searching google mail for the address. Or, given the new "your airline ticket on your phone" model, I might have been trying to checkin at the last 5 minutes onto a flight. Or get into a ball game... Is this "40% of the net offline" ? no. Was it pretty wide reaching? Yes. On Tue, Aug 20, 2013 at 3:29 PM, Matthew Petach <mpetach@netflight.com>wrote:
I'm curious; do people really think that the difference in material indexed between Google, Yahoo/Bing, and others is really that big? I don't mean the heuristics and algorithms used to return the results in a particularly useful order; I mean the sheer raw set of indexed pages. I don't debate that Google found a particularly useful page ranking system; but I question the notion that the loss of Google was akin to the loss of your root directory.
Matt
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 10:12 PM, Jimmy Hess <mysidia@gmail.com> wrote:
On Mon, Aug 19, 2013 at 9:48 PM, Randy Bush <randy@psg.com> wrote:
Without Google, how do you know where anything even *is*?
ask that to 20% of the world's population
Turning off Google is essentially doing a rm -rf http:// www-wide analog to rm -rf / or temporarily loss of the root directory, pending a fsck.
The important stuff is still there, somewhere... it's just becomes a real chore to get to your files without a useful directory provided by the indexing system, until you can get your superblock repaired.
Webcrawler, Gopher sites, and Archie search engine become viable options.
There's also backup on some stacks of tapes somewhere labelled Bing, DMOZ, Yahoo, and a few other misc. unlabelled stacks, various well-known .COM and .EDU domains, which you could probably use to find your materials if you downloaded the old Hosts.txt files; if you look long and hard enough, you can still find the filesystem data you need to relink the directory and get at the files you need; it can just be darn inconvenient sorting out all the spam.
randy
-- -JH
participants (9)
-
Blake Dunlap -
George Michaelson -
james jones -
Jimmy Hess -
Larry Sheldon -
Matthew Petach -
Patrick W. Gilmore -
Randy Bush -
Warren Bailey