RE: UUNET service

12 Apr 2002

...
In the cisco router, if you configure a aggregate route under 
bgp, it will be pointing to null0 to prevent this senario from 
happening. So my question( not related to attitude)is:Is this 
because of the aggregation?
-ns
No.  This is because the customer's router has no better way to get to their
own network than to go to their default, which is UU.  Were there an
aggregate configured, with no contributing route remaining to the aggregate,
the same behavior would occur because the aggregate would go away.

Simple scenario - UU static to the customer for net X
			customer static default to UU
                  customer link to net X fails
                  customer router uses next best path, which is default to
UU

This is quite common, actually.

chris
...
-----Original Message-----
From: jlewis@lewis.org [mailto:jlewis@lewis.org]
Sent: 12 April 2002 4:21 PM
To: Bradley Corner
Cc: nanog@merit.edu
Subject: Re: UUNET service
To me, that looks more like an outage (now fixed) on a 
customer network. The 'loop' between 
500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET and 
core62007-gw.customer.alter.net, could likely be caused by 
UU's customer advertising an aggregate route to UU, but not 
actually having a route to the IP...so they default back to 
UU, and UU sends it back to the customer.
This was likely a problem on the customer's network, so why 
should UUNet take a trouble report from you?  Not only are you 
not _the_ customer, you're not even a customer, and it's 
likely not a problem they can do anything about.  If it really 
were a UUNet problem, they probably assume their customer will 
report it.
...
| 37  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 161 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 38  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 210 |   --x      | UUNET
On Fri, 12 Apr 2002, Bradley Corner wrote:
...
I tried to notify UUNET at their 800-900-0241 number that 
there was a 
loop in their network. They told me that if I didn't have an account 
with them they were not interested in any information that I 
may have 
had for them. I stated that I was just calling so that they 
could pass 
the information onto an engineer. He repeated himself saying 
if you do 
not have an account with us I will not do anything with the 
information. I guess they think they run the internet and us small 
ISPs couldn't possibly know anything...
In case someone at UUNET reads this here is the traceroute.
==================================================
=== VisualRoute report on 12-Apr-02 3:04:18 PM === 
==================================================
Report for online.mmsi-usa.com [162.33.138.132]
Analysis: The routing loop (65.195.230.218 / 162.33.130.4 / 
162.33.128.249 / 205.197.182.201 / 162.33.138.129 / 65.195.230.217) 
starting in hops 12-17 is not allowing IP packets to get to their 
destination.
----------------------------------------------------------------------
...
--
---------------------------------------------------------------
---------
...
-----------------------------
| Hop | %Loss | IP Address      | Node Name
| Location                | Tzone  | ms  | Graph      | Network
|
----------------------------------------------------------------------
...
--
---------------------------------------------------------------
---------
...
-----------------------------
| 0   |       | 10.100.15.40    | BRADLEY.nefmls.com
| ...                     |        |     |            | (private use)
|
| 1   |       | 209.12.49.1     | -
| ?Jacksonville, FL 32256 |        | 1   | x          | Northeast
Florida MLS                |
| 2   |       | 206.222.124.121 | -
| ?Herndon, VA 20165      |        | 3   | x          | e.spire
Communications, Inc.         |
| 3   |       | 206.222.126.77  | washing2-dc-a5-0-0-10.rt.espire.net
| -                       |        | 27  | x--        | e.spire
Communications, Inc.         |
| 4   |       | 206.222.127.118 | reston-va-1-pos0-0-0.rt.espire.net
| -                       |        | 37  | x---       | e.spire
Communications, Inc.         |
| 5   |       | 198.32.187.97   | mae-east-level3.com
| Vienna, VA, USA         |        | 133 | --x-       | 
Exchange Point
Blocks                |
| 6   |       | 64.159.18.98    | ae0-54.mp2.Washington1.Level3.net
| Washington, DC, USA     | -05:00 | 137 |  -x---     | Level 3
Communications, Inc.         |
| 7   |       | 64.159.0.110    | 
so-0-0-0.mp1.Philadelphia1.Level3.net
| Philadelphia, PA, USA   | -05:00 | 147 |  -x------  | Level 3
Communications, Inc.         |
| 8   |       | 64.159.0.150    |
gige9-0.hsipaccess2.Philadelphia1.Level3.net | Philadelphia, 
PA, USA   |
-05:00 | 137 |  -x----    | Level 3 Communications, Inc.         |
| 9   |       | 63.208.101.158  | unknown.Level3.net
| -                       |        | 147 |  -x------- | Level 3
Communications, Inc.         |
| 10  |       | 162.33.162.25   | 401n--30th-st--phily.coretel.net
| ?Annapolis, MD 21401    |        | 139 | --x----    | Core
Communications, Inc.            |
| 11  | 10    | 162.33.162.29   | baltamtrak-p.highway.coretel.net
| ?Annapolis, MD 21401    |        | 146 |  -x------  | Core
Communications, Inc.            |
| 12  |       | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 142 |  -x----    | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 13  |       | 162.33.130.4    | i97.toad.net
| ?Woodbridge, NJ 07095   |        | 124 | --x--      | RAM
Communications Consultants, Inc. |
| 14  |       | 162.33.128.249  | tiara-2-balto.ds1.toad.net
| ?Woodbridge, NJ 07095   |        | 134 |  -x----    | RAM
Communications Consultants, Inc. |
| 15  |       | 205.197.182.201 | max2.toad.net
| ?Severna Park, MD 21146 |        | 146 |  -x--      | ToadNet, Inc.
|
| 16  |       | 162.33.138.129  | mmsi-cpe.dsllan.toad.net
| ?Woodbridge, NJ 07095   |        | 198 |   -x---    | RAM
Communications Consultants, Inc. |
| 17  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 147 |   x--      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 18  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 154 |   -x----   | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 19  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 154 |   -x--     | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 20  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 170 |  --x---    | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 21  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 131 |  -x--      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 22  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 150 |   -x---    | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 23  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 159 |   -x-      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 24  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 171 |   -x---    | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 25  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 169 |   -x-      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 26  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 188 |   -x----   | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 27  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 169 |    x--     | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 28  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 191 |    x-----  | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 29  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 179 |    x---    | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 30  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 188 |   -x----   | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 31  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 179 |   -x--     | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 32  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 163 |    x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 33  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 184 |   -x-      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 34  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 168 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 35  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 166 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 36  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 185 |   -x-      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 37  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 161 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 38  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 210 |   --x      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 39  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 152 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 40  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 167 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 41  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 176 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 42  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 164 |    x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 43  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 173 |    x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 44  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 158 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 45  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 168 |    x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 46  | 50    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 166 |    x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 47  | 50    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 159 |    x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 48  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 140 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 49  | 60    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 145 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 50  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 170 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 51  | 70    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 137 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 52  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 133 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 53  | 60    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 142 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 54  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 147 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 55  | 60    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 143 |   x-       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 56  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 156 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 57  | 60    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 167 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 58  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 167 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 59  | 60    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 170 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 60  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 174 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 61  | 70    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 173 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 62  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 178 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 63  | 60    | 65.195.230.217  | 500.Serial2-11.GW4.BWI1.ALTER.NET
| Baltimore, MD, USA      | -05:00 | 186 |   -x       | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| 64  | 60    | 65.195.230.218  | core62007-gw.customer.alter.net
| -                       |        | 183 |    x-      | UUNET
Technologies, Inc.             |
| ... |       |                 |
|                         |        |     |            |
|
| ?   |       | 162.33.138.132  | online.mmsi-usa.com
| ?Woodbridge, NJ 07095   |        |     |            | RAM
Communications Consultants, Inc. |
----------------------------------------------------------------------
...
--
---------------------------------------------------------------
---------
...
-----------------------------
Roundtrip time to 65.195.230.218, average = 183ms, min = 152ms, max =
210ms -- 12-Apr-02 3:04:18 PM
Bradley Corner
Northeast Florida Multiple Listing Service, Inc.
7801 Deecreek Club Rd Ste 1
Jacksonville FL 32217
(904) 394-9494
-- 
----------------------------------------------------------------------
Jon Lewis *jlewis@lewis.org*|  I route
System Administrator        |  therefore you are
Atlantic Net                |
_________ http://www.lewis.org/~jlewis/pgp for PGP public key_________

Martin, Christian

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