Hey folks. I'm working with my friends at National Public Radio. They're having network problems, and I'm not sure the correct people at UUNet to report this anomaly to. The answer NPR got from UUNet was: MFS trouble in Dallas. Does that make sense? any suggestions? thanks in advance. sorry for the interruption. # /usr/local/bin/traceroute npr.org traceroute to npr.org (199.0.132.69), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets 1 router.butterfly.net (199.73.40.1) 7 ms 5 ms 3 ms 2 s0.router.clark.net (199.73.41.254) 12 ms 15 ms 12 ms 3 sl-dc-1-S19-T1.sprintlink.net (144.228.4.1) 19 ms 29 ms 17 ms 4 sl-dc-8-F0/0.sprintlink.net (144.228.20.8) 21 ms 19 ms 17 ms 5 sl-mae-e-H2/0-T3.sprintlink.net (144.228.10.42) 26 ms 18 ms 19 ms 6 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 26 ms 297 ms * 7 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 22 ms 31 ms 44 ms 8 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 62 ms 87 ms * 9 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 37 ms 36 ms 28 ms 10 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 63 ms 83 ms 77 ms 11 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 21 ms 32 ms 27 ms 12 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 40 ms 50 ms 68 ms 13 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 33 ms 19 ms 31 --Dave http://iron.butterfly.net/motodave
Hey folks.
I'm working with my friends at National Public Radio. They're having network problems, and I'm not sure the correct people at UUNet to report this anomaly to. The answer NPR got from UUNet was: MFS trouble in Dallas. Does that make sense?
any suggestions?
thanks in advance. sorry for the interruption.
# /usr/local/bin/traceroute npr.org traceroute to npr.org (199.0.132.69), 30 hops max, 40 byte packets 1 router.butterfly.net (199.73.40.1) 7 ms 5 ms 3 ms 2 s0.router.clark.net (199.73.41.254) 12 ms 15 ms 12 ms 3 sl-dc-1-S19-T1.sprintlink.net (144.228.4.1) 19 ms 29 ms 17 ms 4 sl-dc-8-F0/0.sprintlink.net (144.228.20.8) 21 ms 19 ms 17 ms 5 sl-mae-e-H2/0-T3.sprintlink.net (144.228.10.42) 26 ms 18 ms 19 ms 6 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 26 ms 297 ms * 7 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 22 ms 31 ms 44 ms 8 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 62 ms 87 ms * 9 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 37 ms 36 ms 28 ms 10 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 63 ms 83 ms 77 ms 11 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 21 ms 32 ms 27 ms 12 Vienna1.VA.Alter.Net (192.41.177.249) 40 ms 50 ms 68 ms 13 sl-mae-e-F0/0.sprintlink.net (192.41.177.241) 33 ms 19 ms 31
Well, at a zero-level information point (which is all I have from here :-) this looks like Sprintlink thinks that network is reachable via Alternet, and Alternet thinks it is reachable via Sprintlink. Thus the looping. I'd contact the respective NOCs and let them hash it out. At least one of these two is (obviously) wrong. :-) -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | (shell, PPP, SLIP, leased) in Chicagoland Voice: [+1 312 248-8649] | 7 POPs online through Chicago, all 28.8 Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" for more information ISDN: Surf at Smokin' Speed | WWW: http://www.mcs.net, gopher: gopher.mcs.net
Did this happen on Friday? If so I heard from a directly knowledgeable source that there was a power failure in Dallas that affected the MFS pop there and that MFS had to bring in a truck with generators to get the node operational again. If this is correct wold the looping be really blamable to either UUNET or Sprint? ******************************************************************** Gordon Cook, Editor & Publisher Subscript.: Individ-ascii $85 The COOK Report on Internet -> NREN Non Profit. $150 431 Greenway Ave, Ewing, NJ 08618 Small Corp & Gov't $200 (609) 882-2572 Corporate $350 Internet: cook@cookreport.com Corporate. Site Lic $650 http://www.netaxs.com/~cook <- Subscription Info & COOK Report Index ********************************************************************
Did this happen on Friday? If so I heard from a directly knowledgeable source that there was a power failure in Dallas that affected the MFS pop there and that MFS had to bring in a truck with generators to get the node operational again. If this is correct wold the looping be really blamable to either UUNET or Sprint?
******************************************************************** Gordon Cook, Editor & Publisher Subscript.: Individ-ascii $85
The trace shows bouncing between sites which are both local to Washington DC. I don't see how Dallas comes into this, unless at least one site involved is pointing default somewhere (which could cause this). My understanding is that both Sprint and Alternet run defaultless (as do many multihomed providers who have a reasonable route table such as MCS.) Discontinuities in a defaultless network do not show up as route loops -- they show up as !Hs or black-holes (ie: no returns at all) somewhere along the line, depending on ICMP configuration issues. You *can* get them if one or more of the routers in the game are pointing default (or have a less-specific CIDR route) in a way which can be looped back. This is an architectual problem which needs to be found and fixed -- looping packets will destroy the efficiency of your circuits (consider the TTL of most packets and the number of bounces before they TTL out). Hard-wired and "pulled-up" routes can also cause this kind of silliness. -- -- Karl Denninger (karl@MCS.Net)| MCSNet - The Finest Internet Connectivity Modem: [+1 312 248-0900] | (shell, PPP, SLIP, leased) in Chicagoland Voice: [+1 312 248-8649] | 7 POPs online through Chicago, all 28.8 Fax: [+1 312 248-9865] | Email to "info@mcs.net" for more information ISDN: Surf at Smokin' Speed | WWW: http://www.mcs.net, gopher: gopher.mcs.net
Subject: Re: MAE-east weirdness From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" <karl@mcs.com> To: gcook@tigger.jvnc.net Cc: motodave@butterfly.net, nanog@merit.edu, rdean@npr.org
Can we PLEASE not use nanog for this sort of thing? I mean, yes, it's for operational issues, but it's not for the sort of ignorant fingerpointing you can resolve by just calling the relevent party's NOC.
Did this happen on Friday? If so I heard from a directly knowledgeable source that there was a power failure in Dallas that affected the MFS pop there and that MFS had to bring in a truck with generators to get the node operational again. If this is correct wold the looping be really blamable to either UUNET or Sprint?
Gordon, if you care, call up Alternet and Sprint before sending out mail.
involved is pointing default somewhere (which could cause this). My understanding is that both Sprint and Alternet run defaultless (as do many multihomed providers who have a reasonable route table such as MCS.)
Karl, I believe your understanding is incorrect, but, nevertheless, I believe that this can all be attributed to a DS3 cut that is affected Alternet, and has been all day. I'm sure they know and are working to fix it as quickly as they can, and presumbaly they're having problem with route flap. -- John Hawkinson jhawk@panix.com
My apologies John... if my comment was not in keeping with accepted standards for this list I'll go back to lurking. ******************************************************************** Gordon Cook, Editor & Publisher Subscript.: Individ-ascii $85 The COOK Report on Internet -> NREN Non Profit. $150 431 Greenway Ave, Ewing, NJ 08618 Small Corp & Gov't $200 (609) 882-2572 Corporate $350 Internet: cook@cookreport.com Corporate. Site Lic $650 http://www.netaxs.com/~cook <- Subscription Info & COOK Report Index ******************************************************************** On Mon, 8 May 1995, John Hawkinson wrote:
Subject: Re: MAE-east weirdness From: "Karl Denninger, MCSNet" <karl@mcs.com> To: gcook@tigger.jvnc.net Cc: motodave@butterfly.net, nanog@merit.edu, rdean@npr.org
Can we PLEASE not use nanog for this sort of thing?
I mean, yes, it's for operational issues, but it's not for the sort of ignorant fingerpointing you can resolve by just calling the relevent party's NOC.
Did this happen on Friday? If so I heard from a directly knowledgeable source that there was a power failure in Dallas that affected the MFS pop there and that MFS had to bring in a truck with generators to get the node operational again. If this is correct wold the looping be really blamable to either UUNET or Sprint?
Gordon, if you care, call up Alternet and Sprint before sending out mail.
involved is pointing default somewhere (which could cause this). My understanding is that both Sprint and Alternet run defaultless (as do many multihomed providers who have a reasonable route table such as MCS.)
Karl, I believe your understanding is incorrect, but, nevertheless, I believe that this can all be attributed to a DS3 cut that is affected Alternet, and has been all day. I'm sure they know and are working to fix it as quickly as they can, and presumbaly they're having problem with route flap.
-- John Hawkinson jhawk@panix.com
The correct folks at UUNET/AlterNet to report this is our NOC: noc@uunet.uu.net +1 800 827-4864 +1 703 206 5820 In any case, we have investigating problems with a T3 between our Vienna, VA and Falls-Church, VA locations. --asp@uunet.uu.net (Andrew Partan)
Under water etc. We had a customer who was out due to the smart jack being a bit wet ! There are alot of problems in the Dallas area. Joseph Stroup
participants (6)
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asp＠uunet.uu.net -
ATM_Feel_the_Power -
David Levine -
Gordon Cook -
John Hawkinson -
Karl Denninger, MCSNet