Posting from freebie E-mail Accounts
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems. Andrew
On Mar 30, 2010, at 11:42 PM, Andrew D Kirch wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account?
I'm implicitly legit; further, gmail auto-threads all of the run-on posts automatically (much unlike mail.app, outlook 2k8, etc). What's the beef? -Tk
On 3/30/2010 22:42, Andrew D Kirch wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
I have mixed feelings--I use a gmail account for some things. As a moderator on other lists, I'm more comfortable with taking a quick hammer to miscreants with any debate off line. -- Democracy: Three wolves and a sheep voting on the dinner menu. Requiescas in pace o email Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Eppure si rinfresca ICBM Targeting Information: http://tinyurl.com/4sqczs http://tinyurl.com/7tp8ml
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub.... Seriously -jim yes posted from gmail acct. On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:42 AM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net> wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 9:00 PM, jim deleskie <deleskie@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
Ditto. - - ferg -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: PGP Desktop 9.5.3 (Build 5003) wj8DBQFLssujq1pz9mNUZTMRAjWSAJ4hkP0RWOVcd3I1gKz1yns46oVNIQCg1Mgo vSQUjEXmqmQBfraDy+gfsgw= =W1My -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- "Fergie", a.k.a. Paul Ferguson Engineering Architecture for the Internet fergdawgster(at)gmail.com ferg's tech blog: http://fergdawg.blogspot.com/
Paul Ferguson wrote:
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On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 9:00 PM, jim deleskie <deleskie@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
Ditto.
- - ferg
+1 (posting from gmail account) jc
Currently there are 3556 post's from nanog in this mailist account, I use this 1, of ten sub-accounts that I have with this provider to focus clearly on Nanog related issues. It is not free. I do however prefer that the professionals stay away from irc or facebook cutsy pie names, it is also good if you show those names like fergie does his, it is part of the network tradition and in good spirit. -henry ________________________________ From: JC Dill <jcdill.lists@gmail.com> To: "nanog@nanog.org" <nanog@nanog.org> Sent: Wed, March 31, 2010 12:04:32 AM Subject: Re: Posting from freebie E-mail Accounts Paul Ferguson wrote:
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On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 9:00 PM, jim deleskie <deleskie@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
Ditto.
- - ferg
+1 (posting from gmail account) jc
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
Ditto.
- - ferg
+1 (posting from gmail account)
+2 (also from gmail) free anti spam, no need for antivirus, free storage, spam don't go to my "official" address, don't have to make backups, can read from anywhere, mostly used for email lists. The problem is the source not what service he/she uses, trolls will be trolls regardless of what freebie fqdn they use. Jorge
We are not allowed to post from work email accounts to lists such as these as well. The CISO's reasoning (and he may have a point...) is that we might ask the list "Hey...I can't figure out why my Cisco $MODEL router is doing "this" when I upgrade to $VERSION of IOS." Then someone trolling to hack you knows you have one of them in your network running that version of code. It still may be easy enough to extrapolate where you work from your personal email using other publicly available methods but On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 4:49 AM, Jorge Amodio <jmamodio@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
Ditto.
- - ferg
+1 (posting from gmail account)
+2 (also from gmail)
free anti spam, no need for antivirus, free storage, spam don't go to my "official" address, don't have to make backups, can read from anywhere, mostly used for email lists.
The problem is the source not what service he/she uses, trolls will be trolls regardless of what freebie fqdn they use.
Jorge
jim deleskie <deleskie@gmail.com> writes: Hi,
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail.
As a positive side effect there are fewer "Out of Office replies" when people use different accounts for "normal" work mail and mailing lists.
If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Or use a decent mail client which allows scoring and / or kill files. cheers, Jens -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Foelderichstr. 40 | 13595 Berlin, Germany | +49-151-18721264 | | http://blog.quux.de | jabber: jenslink@guug.de | ------------------- | -------------------------------------------------------------------------
+1 On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:00 AM, jim deleskie <deleskie@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:42 AM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net> wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
-1 On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 10:54 AM, Richard Barnes <richard.barnes@gmail.com> wrote:
+1
On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:00 AM, jim deleskie <deleskie@gmail.com> wrote:
I'm betting more then a few of use free mail accts to keep this separate from our work mail. If your really having that much issue, config your mail server to drop it yourself or unsub....
Seriously
-jim yes posted from gmail acct.
On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 12:42 AM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net> wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
On Wed, March 31, 2010 4:42 pm, Andrew D Kirch wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
I've found that most folks administering mailing lists tend to advocate that folks use a personal email address on them, not a professional one, as it tends to free the list from a glut of 'Out of Office' notices, rediculously long disclaimer footers, and other such things; this seems particularly relevant for NANOG. With that in mind and noting a goodly number of folks using gmail, among others, i'm not sure the cost:benefit would be there? There's other ways to moderate content on a mailing list....
I keep all of my mailing list stuff in gmail. I suppose I could move it, but this list has so little trouble (unless gmail is doing a fantastic job of shielding me) that I don't see the point. On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 10:42 PM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net>wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
-- mailto:Neal@layer3arts.com // GoogleTalk: nrauhauser@gmail.com GV: 202-642-1717
I use gmail for all mailing lists. It's easier for me to organize my work flow and catch up on threads on my BB when I have a spare idle moment. On 3/31/10, neal rauhauser <nrauhauser@gmail.com> wrote:
I keep all of my mailing list stuff in gmail. I suppose I could move it, but this list has so little trouble (unless gmail is doing a fantastic job of shielding me) that I don't see the point.
On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 10:42 PM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net>wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
-- mailto:Neal@layer3arts.com // GoogleTalk: nrauhauser@gmail.com GV: 202-642-1717
Andrew D Kirch wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
Ok, point made. Andrew
On 2010.03.30 23:42, Andrew D Kirch wrote:
I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers,
I oppose this proposal. There are very legitimate (and legal) reasons why people may want to post to an operational list, using an address that can not tie them to the location or business that they are posting from. This list does not see much spam (or at least I don't). That said, let the list maintainers decide. Steve
On Wed, 31 Mar 2010, Steve Bertrand wrote:
On 2010.03.30 23:42, Andrew D Kirch wrote:
I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers,
I oppose this proposal.
There are very legitimate (and legal) reasons why people may want to post to an operational list, using an address that can not tie them to the location or business that they are posting from.
This list does not see much spam (or at least I don't). That said, let the list maintainers decide.
I would much prefer if EVERYBODY used freebie email accounts as opposed to their corporate ones, as this would make it more likely that they would quote "correctly" and we would get less silly legal disclaimers and out of office messages. I don't use my work account for any mailing lists because it's totally useless for that purpose. I also will participate in these mailing lists regardless of my employer, thus I never understood why someone would want to post from their corporate accounts. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se
On 3/30/10 10:41 PM, Mikael Abrahamsson wrote:
I would much prefer if EVERYBODY used freebie email accounts as opposed to their corporate ones, as this would make it more likely that they would quote "correctly" and we would get less silly legal disclaimers and out of office messages.
I don't use my work account for any mailing lists because it's totally useless for that purpose. I also will participate in these mailing lists regardless of my employer, thus I never understood why someone would want to post from their corporate accounts.
That's an exact opposite of silly from the OP's request; my "corporate account" works just fine. ~Seth
My employer has an unwritten policy that says we're free to post what we want where we want as long as we do not make it obvious who our employer is. I.E. don't post from the company email accounts. I use both personal domains and freebie accounts to comply with this request. Richey -----Original Message----- From: Mikael Abrahamsson [mailto:swmike@swm.pp.se] Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 2:01 AM To: Seth Mattinen Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Posting from freebie E-mail Accounts On Tue, 30 Mar 2010, Seth Mattinen wrote:
That's an exact opposite of silly from the OP's request; my "corporate account" works just fine.
Well, your corporate account seems to involve less silly (exchange/lotus notes) than most. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se
Until somebody does 'view headers' and sees /X/-/Sender/-/IP / and oh look, it was sent from 'foobarco' ;-) FAIL -- Leigh On 31/03/10 16:55, Richey wrote:
My employer has an unwritten policy that says we're free to post what we want where we want as long as we do not make it obvious who our employer is. I.E. don't post from the company email accounts. I use both personal domains and freebie accounts to comply with this request.
Richey
-----Original Message----- From: Mikael Abrahamsson [mailto:swmike@swm.pp.se] Sent: Wednesday, March 31, 2010 2:01 AM To: Seth Mattinen Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Posting from freebie E-mail Accounts
On Tue, 30 Mar 2010, Seth Mattinen wrote:
That's an exact opposite of silly from the OP's request; my "corporate account" works just fine.
Well, your corporate account seems to involve less silly (exchange/lotus notes) than most.
On Wed, March 31, 2010 12:14 pm, Leigh Porter wrote:
Until somebody does 'view headers' and sees
/X/-/Sender/-/IP / and oh look, it was sent from 'foobarco' ;-)
That depends on how they are sending it, of course. Webmail usually just has the IP of the host, and I imagine quite a few others around here have their own personal servers that could also be used for this, one way or another. Then of course there are things like Blackberries and iPhones that can send email themselves, and are likely to have IP addresses that are linked to something besides their current location. Daniel T. Staal --------------------------------------------------------------- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. ---------------------------------------------------------------
On Mar 31, 2010, at 12:43 PM, Daniel Staal wrote:
On Wed, March 31, 2010 12:14 pm, Leigh Porter wrote:
Until somebody does 'view headers' and sees
/X/-/Sender/-/IP / and oh look, it was sent from 'foobarco' ;-)
That depends on how they are sending it, of course. Webmail usually just has the IP of the host, and I imagine quite a few others around here have their own personal servers that could also be used for this, one way or another.
GMail doesn't even add that header, so you don't have to worry where you are browsing from. < cue thread about Google's arrogance that they know better how to stop spam than anyone else; cue thread about Google's complete inability to stop spam even close to as well as many others; cue thread about Google's hypocrisy about adding X-Sender-IP on IMAP injected mail, but not through web mail; cue thread about people talking about e-mail / spam on NANOG; cue thread about moving the whole thing to nanog-futures; cue thread about ....
-- TTFN, patrick
Then of course there are things like Blackberries and iPhones that can send email themselves, and are likely to have IP addresses that are linked to something besides their current location.
Daniel T. Staal
--------------------------------------------------------------- This email copyright the author. Unless otherwise noted, you are expressly allowed to retransmit, quote, or otherwise use the contents for non-commercial purposes. This copyright will expire 5 years after the author's death, or in 30 years, whichever is longer, unless such a period is in excess of local copyright law. ---------------------------------------------------------------
On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 07:41:18AM +0200, Mikael Abrahamsson wrote:
I would much prefer if EVERYBODY used freebie email accounts as opposed to their corporate ones, as this would make it more likely that they would quote "correctly" and we would get less silly legal disclaimers and out of office messages.
What's your opinion (if any) about free-mail accounts listed for ARIN/APNIC/RIPE/LACNIC/AFRINIC/KRNIC/TWNIC (RIR) contacts? -- Henry Yen Aegis Information Systems, Inc. Senior Systems Programmer Hicksville, New York
On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 11:42:46PM -0400, Andrew D Kirch wrote:
I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers [...]
Bad idea. While free webmail providers are prodigious sources of abuse, they're not prodigious sources of abuse that makes it through to this list -- thanks to what I'm presuming is prudent configuration of the MTA and Mailman instance involved in running it. Additionally, some folks find that directing bulk, non-personal traffic like mailing lists to free webmail accounts makes it easier for them to participate. (And as noted by others, it does seem to free us from the meaningless, unenforceable, threatening disclaimers imposed by some of the more clueless companies out there.) If using those accounts facilitates the participation of people who can contribute to the community, then I see no reason at present to put up barriers to that. ---Rsk
I also use a "freebie" webmail account for nanog mail. I would be opposed to this. Tom On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 8:42 PM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net> wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
on the other hand, such a move would trim a huge number of list members, which might refocus the list to "North America". --bill On Wed, Mar 31, 2010 at 09:25:56AM -0700, Tom Hutton wrote:
I also use a "freebie" webmail account for nanog mail. I would be opposed to this.
Tom
On Tue, Mar 30, 2010 at 8:42 PM, Andrew D Kirch <trelane@trelane.net> wrote:
Is there anyone here who is legitimate using a freebie webmail account? I am proposing that the NANOG administration drop everything originating from commonly used webmail providers, and add further RHS filters as additional providers are identified as problems.
Andrew
on the other hand, such a move would trim a huge number of list members, which might refocus the list to "North America".
participants (27)
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Andrew D Kirch -
Anton Kapela -
bmanning＠vacation.karoshi.com -
Charles Mills -
Charles Morris -
Daniel Staal -
Henry Linneweh -
Henry Yen -
Jay Nakamura -
JC Dill -
Jens Link -
jim deleskie -
Jorge Amodio -
Larry Sheldon -
Leigh Porter -
Mark Foster -
Mikael Abrahamsson -
neal rauhauser -
Patrick W. Gilmore -
Paul Ferguson -
Randy Bush -
Rich Kulawiec -
Richard Barnes -
Richey -
Seth Mattinen -
Steve Bertrand -
Tom Hutton