Re: Puerto Rico: Lack of electricity threatens telephone and internet services
This thread is mostly full of idle speculation, is at the least insensitive and verges on offensive. If you have operational information about Puerto Rico (see Sean Donelan's posts rather than these responses), please go ahead. If you would like to allocate blame, please go somewhere else to do it. The Internet is full of people who are blaming Puerto Rico for getting hit by a hurricane. I don't need it here. Thanks, T (From Humacao) El 19 oct. 2017 19:45, "Jean-Francois Mezei" <jfmezei_nanog@vaxination.ca> escribió: On 2017-10-19 18:18, Wayne Bouchard wrote:
Well, the problem as I understand it is that the infrastructure was not all that great to begin with. Much of it was damaged in the first storm and when this second one came through, what remained basically disappeared.
Being hit with a Cat 5 hurricane/cyclone in a caribeean island that hasn't been a direct hit from severe storms in decades will cause extensive damage no matter what state its infrastructure was in before. Vegetation that does not regular storms to "prune" it will grow to a point where it will cause major damage when a big storm hits. And a caribbean island who has never been "rich" will not have had, as a priority, increasing building codes to widthstand hurricanes. Building codes get updated after a big devastating hurricane, whether it is for Darwin in 1974 (Tracy) or ones like Andrew in Florida. It's easy for a state the size of Texas to send all of its electrical utility trucks to the Houson area to repair damage. But they too would be stretched thin if all of Texas had been leveled. If buildings were not built to widthstand a 5 or a 4, then the building itself becomes destructor of infrastructure as its materials become high speed projectiles throuwn at other buildings and especially teleohone/electrical lines. I went through a category 4 (Olivia, Australia 1996). While the town and building I was in (Karatha) were built to new standards and had little damage, I witnessed the power of it, and I can totally understand Puerto Rico being destroyed. I know a politician with tendancy to skew facts points to Puerto Rico having had terrible infrastructure. But consider that Darwin, a "rich" town" was wiped out in 1974 by Tracy. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B89wBGydSvs Tracy was a 4. Maria was a 5. (note the alert sound at start of video still sends shivers down my spine because it was the same as I heard before Olivia hit). The population was evacuated by 747s because there was nothing there to support it. The road link to is (Stuart Highway) is so long that Darwin is tantamount to an island. (especially since Stuart wasn't fully paved back then). Also note: in Florida, the utilities positioned all their equipment in safe places so it could survive storm and be deployed when needed. But what happens when there is no safe place, or the safe places become isolated because roads become impassable? It is one thing when a state has some areas with high level of destruction. But when the whole state is destroyed, it is a truly different situation because its economy is also destroyed. Florida Power still has plenty of revenues from undamaged areas to pay for the repairs in damaged areas. The Utility in Puerto Rico doesn't. (and if it was finacially weak before, it makes things worse). When you see other states' utilities coming to help in a highly damaged area, don't think for a minute they do this for free. The local utility stll gets a bill at the end of the day for the work done. If the Puerto Rico company has no cash to pay, don't exopect other utilities to send crews.
Here's a fact, the next ICANN meeting in March is still a go in San Juan PR. Hopefully bringing 2000 people will have a positive impact on the local economy.
-----Original Message----- From: NANOG [mailto:nanog-bounces@nanog.org] On Behalf Of Todd Underwood Sent: October 19, 2017 7:56 PM To: Jean-Francois Mezei <jfmezei_nanog@vaxination.ca> Cc: NANOG list <nanog@nanog.org> Subject: Re: Puerto Rico: Lack of electricity threatens telephone and internet services
This thread is mostly full of idle speculation, is at the least insensitive and verges on offensive.
If you have operational information about Puerto Rico (see Sean Donelan's posts rather than these responses), please go ahead. If you would like to allocate blame, please go somewhere else to do it. The Internet is full of people who are blaming Puerto Rico for getting hit by a hurricane. I don't need it here.
Thanks,
T (From Humacao)
El 19 oct. 2017 19:45, "Jean-Francois Mezei" <jfmezei_nanog@vaxination.ca> escribió:
On 2017-10-19 18:18, Wayne Bouchard wrote:
Well, the problem as I understand it is that the infrastructure was not all that great to begin with. Much of it was damaged in the first storm and when this second one came through, what remained basically disappeared.
Being hit with a Cat 5 hurricane/cyclone in a caribeean island that hasn't been a direct hit from severe storms in decades will cause extensive damage no matter what state its infrastructure was in before.
Vegetation that does not regular storms to "prune" it will grow to a point where it will cause major damage when a big storm hits.
And a caribbean island who has never been "rich" will not have had, as a priority, increasing building codes to widthstand hurricanes. Building codes get updated after a big devastating hurricane, whether it is for Darwin in 1974 (Tracy) or ones like Andrew in Florida.
It's easy for a state the size of Texas to send all of its electrical utility trucks to the Houson area to repair damage. But they too would be stretched thin if all of Texas had been leveled.
If buildings were not built to widthstand a 5 or a 4, then the building itself becomes destructor of infrastructure as its materials become high speed projectiles throuwn at other buildings and especially teleohone/electrical lines.
I went through a category 4 (Olivia, Australia 1996). While the town and building I was in (Karatha) were built to new standards and had little damage, I witnessed the power of it, and I can totally understand Puerto Rico being destroyed.
I know a politician with tendancy to skew facts points to Puerto Rico having had terrible infrastructure. But consider that Darwin, a "rich" town" was wiped out in 1974 by Tracy.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=B89wBGydSvs
Tracy was a 4. Maria was a 5. (note the alert sound at start of video still sends shivers down my spine because it was the same as I heard before Olivia hit).
The population was evacuated by 747s because there was nothing there to support it. The road link to is (Stuart Highway) is so long that Darwin is tantamount to an island. (especially since Stuart wasn't fully paved back then).
Also note: in Florida, the utilities positioned all their equipment in safe places so it could survive storm and be deployed when needed. But what happens when there is no safe place, or the safe places become isolated because roads become impassable?
It is one thing when a state has some areas with high level of destruction. But when the whole state is destroyed, it is a truly different situation because its economy is also destroyed. Florida Power still has plenty of revenues from undamaged areas to pay for the repairs in damaged areas. The Utility in Puerto Rico doesn't. (and if it was finacially weak before, it makes things worse).
When you see other states' utilities coming to help in a highly damaged area, don't think for a minute they do this for free. The local utility stll gets a bill at the end of the day for the work done. If the Puerto Rico company has no cash to pay, don't exopect other utilities to send crews.
Its too early for an after-action review. Nevertheless, this report by the Miami Herald is the best summary to date of the aftermath in Puerto Rico. Its solid journalism, covers the wide-span of the destruction, and gives credit and blame based on documented evidence. Its longer than a typical newspaper article. Nevertheless, worth the read. http://www.miamiherald.com/news/weather/hurricane/article179744081.html ‘Days were lost’: Why Puerto Rico is still suffering a month after Hurricane Maria BY PATRICIA MAZZEI AND OMAYA SOSA PASCUAL pmazzei@miamiherald.com Center for Investigative Journalism OCTOBER 19, 2017 2:17 PM Sosa Pascual reports for Puerto Rico’s Center for Investigative Journalism (CPI), which worked jointly with the Miami Herald on this report. McClatchy correspondent Tim Johnson contributed from Utuado, Puerto Rico.
participants (3)
-
Jacques Latour -
Sean Donelan -
Todd Underwood