On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 7:38 AM, Tony Patti <tony@swalter.com> wrote:
Thanks, I liked your pointer to the SDR.
But can I ask you for a bit more info about your statement
"where oscilloscopes and frequency analysis is available to anyone with some Google-fu"
We don't need as much test equipment before?
(as a guy with an oscilloscope in his basement, I don't see how Google can do what that device can).
Thanks,
Tony
All I meant was that the tools are relatively accessible to anyone with the desire to look - An oscilloscope with the necessary freq. range to study 4G communications can be bought or fabricated (all that's really needed is a microcontroller with an ADC, some gain amps and time), an appropriate SDR to intercept the signals shouldn't be too hard to source, and that community has been blowing up for a few years now. Hell, there are even a couple examples of LGA 4G receivers floating around in the wild (gtm801, for example). Ignoring all of that, there are commercial options like the YellowFin 4G analyzer. No idea how much one of those costs, though. Now, like Jay said, there are the issues of encryption and such, but that's just another barrier to entry. A little Google-fu could probably source a paper dealing with its implementation, at least. I doubt it would be easy, but if the motivation exists, the required test bed is easily assembled, and the information is available. Not like we're talking about intercepted military GPS bands or something. It's a consumer device that can sit on a workbench and be tested at the leisure of the security researcher. - J.
now THAT would be a cool project! On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 2:25 PM, Jazz Kenny <trapperjohn117@gmail.com>wrote:
On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 7:38 AM, Tony Patti <tony@swalter.com> wrote:
Thanks, I liked your pointer to the SDR.
But can I ask you for a bit more info about your statement
"where oscilloscopes and frequency analysis is available to anyone with some Google-fu"
We don't need as much test equipment before?
(as a guy with an oscilloscope in his basement, I don't see how Google can do what that device can).
Thanks,
Tony
All I meant was that the tools are relatively accessible to anyone with the desire to look - An oscilloscope with the necessary freq. range to study 4G communications can be bought or fabricated (all that's really needed is a microcontroller with an ADC, some gain amps and time), an appropriate SDR to intercept the signals shouldn't be too hard to source, and that community has been blowing up for a few years now. Hell, there are even a couple examples of LGA 4G receivers floating around in the wild (gtm801, for example). Ignoring all of that, there are commercial options like the YellowFin 4G analyzer. No idea how much one of those costs, though.
Now, like Jay said, there are the issues of encryption and such, but that's just another barrier to entry. A little Google-fu could probably source a paper dealing with its implementation, at least.
I doubt it would be easy, but if the motivation exists, the required test bed is easily assembled, and the information is available. Not like we're talking about intercepted military GPS bands or something. It's a consumer device that can sit on a workbench and be tested at the leisure of the security researcher.
- J.
-- Phil Fagan Denver, CO 970-480-7618
There's already code out there for the GNURadio project's software defined radio infrastructure that supports some very basic LTE analysis.... using a $20 or less USB DTV tuner stick!! Only a matter of time before some radio devices with a lot more bandwidth become affordable and easily accessible. https://github.com/Evrytania/LTE-Cell-Scanner On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Phil Fagan <philfagan@gmail.com> wrote:
now THAT would be a cool project!
On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 2:25 PM, Jazz Kenny <trapperjohn117@gmail.com
wrote:
On Mon, Jun 17, 2013 at 7:38 AM, Tony Patti <tony@swalter.com> wrote:
Thanks, I liked your pointer to the SDR.
But can I ask you for a bit more info about your statement
"where oscilloscopes and frequency analysis is available to anyone with some Google-fu"
We don't need as much test equipment before?
(as a guy with an oscilloscope in his basement, I don't see how Google can do what that device can).
Thanks,
Tony
All I meant was that the tools are relatively accessible to anyone with the desire to look - An oscilloscope with the necessary freq. range to study 4G communications can be bought or fabricated (all that's really needed is a microcontroller with an ADC, some gain amps and time), an appropriate SDR to intercept the signals shouldn't be too hard to source, and that community has been blowing up for a few years now. Hell, there are even a couple examples of LGA 4G receivers floating around in the wild (gtm801, for example). Ignoring all of that, there are commercial options like the YellowFin 4G analyzer. No idea how much one of those costs, though.
Now, like Jay said, there are the issues of encryption and such, but that's just another barrier to entry. A little Google-fu could probably source a paper dealing with its implementation, at least.
I doubt it would be easy, but if the motivation exists, the required test bed is easily assembled, and the information is available. Not like we're talking about intercepted military GPS bands or something. It's a consumer device that can sit on a workbench and be tested at the leisure of the security researcher.
- J.
-- Phil Fagan Denver, CO 970-480-7618
-- -- Tom Morris, KG4CYX Mad Scientist For Hire Chairman, South Florida Tropical Hamboree / Miami Hamfest Engineer, WRGP Radiate FM, Florida International University 786-228-7087 151.820 Megacycles
On Tue, Jun 18, 2013 at 02:31:37PM -0600, Phil Fagan wrote:
now THAT would be a cool project!
(I missed the beginnig of this thread; sorry if this is a repeat.) There was the fellow demonstrating a spoofed 2G GSM tower at DefCon recently: http://www.forbes.com/sites/firewall/2010/07/31/despite-fcc-scare-tactics-re... And the YouTube video was pretty cool to watch, for technical depth. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rXVHPNhsOzo Part of his talk described how he could (up a point) block 3G, to cause phones to fail over to 2G, where he could get them. 4G is a whole different thing, but the talk was educational, nonetheless...
-- Phil Fagan Denver, CO 970-480-7618
-- Brian Reichert <reichert@numachi.com> BSD admin/developer at large
participants (4)
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Brian Reichert -
Jazz Kenny -
Phil Fagan -
Tom Morris