Le sigh .. Hotmail/Outlook/Live https://support.microsoft.com/en-us/getsupport?oaspworkflow=start_1.0.0.0&wfname=capsub&productkey=edfsmsbl3&locale=en-us Google/Gmail https://support.google.com/mail/contact/bulk_send_new?rd=1 AOL https://postmaster.aol.com/trouble-ticket Yahoo https://io.help.yahoo.com/contact/index?page=contact&locale=en_US&y=PROD_MAIL_ML# As for SORBS, I'm not aware of anyone that uses it these days because of the extortion thing and the rather ..ahem .. "eccentric" nature of it's owner. Regards, Michael Holstein Cleveland State University ________________________________________ From: Ricky Beam <jfbeam@gmail.com> Sent: Thursday, July 30, 2015 6:41 PM To: Michael O Holstein Subject: Re: Working with Spamhaus On Thu, 30 Jul 2015 09:59:55 -0400, Michael O Holstein <michael.holstein@csuohio.edu> wrote:
100 spammy messages isn't enough to get you in trouble, as long as it stops there.
I see you've never had the pleasure of dealing with SORBS. All it takes is *ONE* message - EVER - to be instantly, and forever, listed in their spamtraps list. Getting on the list is automatic and immediate. There are no thresholds or limits; and there's expiration. The only way off that list is to PAY them to remove you. (which makes it illegal in most places. The corporate sharks flipped when I pointed them to that "policy".)
as were the other major players (MS, Google, AOL, Yahoo) by just filling out their postmaster forms.
What "postmaster forms"? Those 4 are the most *impossible* companies with whom I've ever tried to interact. I *know* there are people at Google but I'll be damned if there's a way to reach any of them.
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu wrote:
On Sat, 01 Aug 2015 04:48:11 +0900, Randy Bush said:
As for SORBS, I'm not aware of anyone that uses it these days
many folk do
Many of them your competitors? :) (Sorry, couldn't resist :)
Is that to be encouraged? :) ---------------------------------------------------------------------- Jon Lewis, MCP :) | I route | therefore you are _________ http://www.lewis.org/~jlewis/pgp for PGP public key_________
Hi, As for SORBS, I'm not aware of anyone that uses it these days because of
the extortion thing and the rather ..ahem .. "eccentric" nature of it's owner.
and
I see you've never had the pleasure of dealing with SORBS. All it takes is *ONE* message - EVER - to be instantly, and forever, listed in their spamtraps list. Getting on the list is automatic and immediate. There are no thresholds or limits; and there's expiration. The only way off that list is to PAY them to remove you. (which makes it illegal in most places. The corporate sharks flipped when I pointed them to that "policy".)
I work for Proofpoint -- we acquired SORBS back in 2011. There is obviously some incorrect / very outdated information / viewpoints here, so I thought it would make sense to clear the air a bit: Listings can happen a number of different ways, however the vast majority of these can be resolved, either through automatic delisting, or manual delisting (via SORBS support ticket). Additionally, there is NO CHARGE to be delisted. I'm happy to help mitigate any issues -- feel free to hit me up off list -- jangerbauer@proofpoint.com Thanks --Jaren
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 17:28:34 -0400, Jaren Angerbauer <jarenangerbauer@gmail.com> wrote:
I work for Proofpoint -- we acquired SORBS back in 2011.
Hint: The Internet has a LONG memory. The liberal and numerous dropping of "for free" makes me laugh. "You" knew the tainted nature of what you were buying. Nobody, to this day, places much trust at all in SORBS. I dare say there isn't anyone on NANOG (certainly any "long hairs") that haven't had at least one interaction with SORBS, most likely due to spamtraps; that number drops to almost zero when you put the word "good" in that sentence. Maybe it's better now under new management; we (the royal we) moved on long ago.
It's what they call a free country Those that don't use it don't use it, and those who do are free to do so --srs
On 31-Jul-2015, at 4:56 PM, Ricky Beam <jfbeam@gmail.com> wrote:
On Fri, 31 Jul 2015 17:28:34 -0400, Jaren Angerbauer <jarenangerbauer@gmail.com> wrote: I work for Proofpoint -- we acquired SORBS back in 2011.
Hint: The Internet has a LONG memory.
The liberal and numerous dropping of "for free" makes me laugh. "You" knew the tainted nature of what you were buying. Nobody, to this day, places much trust at all in SORBS. I dare say there isn't anyone on NANOG (certainly any "long hairs") that haven't had at least one interaction with SORBS, most likely due to spamtraps; that number drops to almost zero when you put the word "good" in that sentence. Maybe it's better now under new management; we (the royal we) moved on long ago.
On Fri, Jul 31, 2015 at 5:28 PM, Jaren Angerbauer <jarenangerbauer@gmail.com> wrote:
I work for Proofpoint -- we acquired SORBS back in 2011. There is delisting (via SORBS support ticket). Additionally, there is NO CHARGE to be delisted.
Hi Jaren, The big problem I remember with SORBS from my ISP days was that if they tested an open relay at IP address A and the return message came from IP address B, they listed IP address B. This put me in an impossible situation as an ISP providing an SMTP smarthost to my authenticated customers. If just one of them screwed up their mail programming, not trying to spam mind you, just screwed up their configuration, my entire relay was hit with a block. Practically speaking, to keep my mail server off SORBS I was required to employ SORBS on my relay to block any customers whose IP appear as an input into SORBS. If I wanted to stay off their list then I MUST use them. Bad ethics there IMO. Is itstill SORBS practice to list both input and output IP addresses of an open relay, regardless of detected spam activity and without any attempt to notify the mail op of the problem? Regards, Bill Herrin -- William Herrin ................ herrin@dirtside.com bill@herrin.us Owner, Dirtside Systems ......... Web: <http://www.dirtside.com/>
----- Original Message ----- From: Jaren Angerbauer <jarenangerbauer@gmail.com> To: "nanog@nanog.org" <nanog@nanog.org> Cc: Sent: Friday, July 31, 2015 2:28 PM Subject: Re: Working with Spamhaus Hi, As for SORBS, I'm not aware of anyone that uses it these days because of
the extortion thing and the rather ..ahem .. "eccentric" nature of it's owner.
and
I see you've never had the pleasure of dealing with SORBS. All it takes is *ONE* message - EVER - to be instantly, and forever, listed in their spamtraps list. Getting on the list is automatic and immediate. There are no thresholds or limits; and there's expiration. The only way off that list is to PAY them to remove you. (which makes it illegal in most places. The corporate sharks flipped when I pointed them to that "policy".)
I work for Proofpoint -- we acquired SORBS back in 2011. There is obviously some incorrect / very outdated information / viewpoints here, so I thought it would make sense to clear the air a bit: Listings can happen a number of different ways, however the vast majority of these can be resolved, either through automatic delisting, or manual delisting (via SORBS support ticket). Additionally, there is NO CHARGE to be delisted. I'm happy to help mitigate any issues -- feel free to hit me up off list -- jangerbauer@proofpoint.com Thanks --Jaren There is a very good reason as to why the .." some incorrect / very outdated information / viewpoints here..<snip> Matt/Michelle Sullivan did a lot of good things but a lot more *bad* in the name of SORBS - ergo the SORBS-Anathema. ...I have; just like many others on this list, have had to deal with this entity that had in essence turned into a joke. ./Randy ./Randy
----- Original Message ----- From: Randy <randy_94108@yahoo.com> To: Jaren Angerbauer <jarenangerbauer@gmail.com>; "nanog@nanog.org" <nanog@nanog.org> Cc: Sent: Friday, July 31, 2015 9:53 PM Subject: Re: Working with Spamhaus ----- Original Message ----- From: Jaren Angerbauer <jarenangerbauer@gmail.com> To: "nanog@nanog.org" <nanog@nanog.org> Cc: Sent: Friday, July 31, 2015 2:28 PM Subject: Re: Working with Spamhaus Hi, As for SORBS, I'm not aware of anyone that uses it these days because of
the extortion thing and the rather ..ahem .. "eccentric" nature of it's owner.
and
I see you've never had the pleasure of dealing with SORBS. All it takes is *ONE* message - EVER - to be instantly, and forever, listed in their spamtraps list. Getting on the list is automatic and immediate. There are no thresholds or limits; and there's expiration. The only way off that list is to PAY them to remove you. (which makes it illegal in most places. The corporate sharks flipped when I pointed them to that "policy".)
I work for Proofpoint -- we acquired SORBS back in 2011. There is obviously some incorrect / very outdated information / viewpoints here, so I thought it would make sense to clear the air a bit: Listings can happen a number of different ways, however the vast majority of these can be resolved, either through automatic delisting, or manual delisting (via SORBS support ticket). Additionally, there is NO CHARGE to be delisted. I'm happy to help mitigate any issues -- feel free to hit me up off list -- jangerbauer@proofpoint.com Thanks --Jaren There is a very good reason as to why the .." some incorrect / very outdated information / viewpoints here..<snip> Matt/Michelle Sullivan did a lot of good things but a lot more *bad* in the name of SORBS - ergo the SORBS-Anathema. ...I have; just like many others on this list, have had to deal with this entity that had in essence turned into a joke. ./Randy ./Randy ....and to echo OP ovservation: at my last $day-job: SORBS wanted payment ( payment options: paypal and other electronic-means; To a Fund to suppport the defense(in court in Australia) of (someone whose I name I don't remember..) Needless to say, the next exec-memo said: "Anyone who uses SORBS is on their own. ./Randy
participants (9)
-
Jaren Angerbauer -
Jon Lewis -
Michael O Holstein -
Randy -
Randy Bush -
Ricky Beam -
Suresh Ramasubramanian -
Valdis.Kletnieks＠vt.edu -
William Herrin