Re: GPON vs. GEPON
We do not sell TV but that means our customers are cable cutters that do a ton of Netflix, HBO Nordic, ViaSat, SBS, DR TV etc streaming. Our traffic level per customer is about the double of what others report. VoIP is not very popular, but people do that too. In either case traffic levels from VoIP is so low that it is below the noise floor. When you can get 940 Mbit/s transfer rates with 1 ms latency and no jitter, a single 64 Kbit/s voice stream is not going to be a problem. We point customers to third party SIP providers and everyone are happy with that. Do the math: a Netflix HD stream is about 5 Mbit/s. How many such stream can you have with 2,4 Gbit/s capacity on a GPON OLT? Yes a lot. You might say but every home has at least 5 TVs now, so with 64 users you need to be able to do 5 times 64 times 5 Mbit/s (*). But it simply does not work that way. We are very far from a situation where it works that way. Instead we monitor the traffic levels, and if sometime in the future the peak traffic becomes a problem, we are ready to either lower the split ratio or invest in the next technology (probably some kind of x*10 Gbit/s PON). Until then we take the cost savings of using a split ratio that works in the real world. (*) nobody has a backbone that can cope with that kind of traffic either. Regards, Baldur On 9 January 2016 at 05:41, Josh Reynolds <josh@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
And you are doing 6+ stream IPTV and VoIP as well? On Jan 8, 2016 9:58 PM, "Baldur Norddahl" <baldur.norddahl@gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 January 2016 at 13:56, Josh Reynolds <josh@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
A 8-16 way split per gpon is more reasonable. I think the current cards are 4-10 gpon ports per, and 2 cards per E7-2. I know they have 2x10Gbps LAG working for uplink, can't remember if 4x10Gbps LAG works yet or not.
That is rubbish. We are using 128 optical splits and 64 users per OLT and a mix of users buying either 100 or 1000 Mbit/s service. This just works. The system is very far from being overloaded. We would put even more users on the OLT if our vendor would allow this (they only support a max of 64 users per OLT).
Remember the very first thing users do when you sell 1000 Mbit/s internet is to run a speedtest. Our users do that too and they do get the expected 940-950 Mbit/s (=gigabit ethernet wire speed) speedtest result at all time of day, also at peak usage.
Regards,
Baldur
You might be surprised... Our upstreams want to simply bypass 40Gbps waves and want us to move straight to 100Gbps. The cost difference is minimal. We are set up where each customer can DVR or watch up to 6 shows at once, per household. There's a reason Google did 16 way splits, and yes, we have two paths we are looking at for NG-PON2. One with Calix, another with another vendor. On Jan 8, 2016 10:57 PM, "Baldur Norddahl" <baldur.norddahl@gmail.com> wrote:
We do not sell TV but that means our customers are cable cutters that do a ton of Netflix, HBO Nordic, ViaSat, SBS, DR TV etc streaming. Our traffic level per customer is about the double of what others report.
VoIP is not very popular, but people do that too. In either case traffic levels from VoIP is so low that it is below the noise floor. When you can get 940 Mbit/s transfer rates with 1 ms latency and no jitter, a single 64 Kbit/s voice stream is not going to be a problem. We point customers to third party SIP providers and everyone are happy with that.
Do the math: a Netflix HD stream is about 5 Mbit/s. How many such stream can you have with 2,4 Gbit/s capacity on a GPON OLT? Yes a lot. You might say but every home has at least 5 TVs now, so with 64 users you need to be able to do 5 times 64 times 5 Mbit/s (*). But it simply does not work that way. We are very far from a situation where it works that way. Instead we monitor the traffic levels, and if sometime in the future the peak traffic becomes a problem, we are ready to either lower the split ratio or invest in the next technology (probably some kind of x*10 Gbit/s PON). Until then we take the cost savings of using a split ratio that works in the real world.
(*) nobody has a backbone that can cope with that kind of traffic either.
Regards,
Baldur
On 9 January 2016 at 05:41, Josh Reynolds <josh@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
And you are doing 6+ stream IPTV and VoIP as well? On Jan 8, 2016 9:58 PM, "Baldur Norddahl" <baldur.norddahl@gmail.com> wrote:
On 8 January 2016 at 13:56, Josh Reynolds <josh@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
A 8-16 way split per gpon is more reasonable. I think the current cards are 4-10 gpon ports per, and 2 cards per E7-2. I know they have 2x10Gbps
LAG
working for uplink, can't remember if 4x10Gbps LAG works yet or not.
That is rubbish. We are using 128 optical splits and 64 users per OLT and a mix of users buying either 100 or 1000 Mbit/s service. This just works. The system is very far from being overloaded. We would put even more users on the OLT if our vendor would allow this (they only support a max of 64 users per OLT).
Remember the very first thing users do when you sell 1000 Mbit/s internet is to run a speedtest. Our users do that too and they do get the expected 940-950 Mbit/s (=gigabit ethernet wire speed) speedtest result at all time of day, also at peak usage.
Regards,
Baldur
On 9 January 2016 at 07:45, Josh Reynolds <josh@kyneticwifi.com> wrote:
You might be surprised...
It is hard to be surprised when you have hard numbers. I run a network and unsurprisingly know exactly how much traffic my users cause. That number is currently about 2 Mbit/s peak aggregated per household. Do you need 100 Gbit/s instead of 40 Gbit/s? Yes you do if you carry traffic from more than 20,000 users or perhaps you have 10,000 users but want to plan for expected traffic increase over the next two years. But nobody plans their backbone so it can carry 20-30 Mbit/s aggregated per household. Well if you do, you have no competition, because otherwise someone else will figure out how to run a network at 1/10 the cost of what you do, and you will go out of business. Before someone points out the obvious: That math does not carry over to GPON OLT planning (too few users for the aggregation). You will have higher peak than 64x 2 Mbit/s on your OLT. But still, 2.4 Gbit/s shared among 64 users is currently more than sufficient that nobody is going to see any limits on their download rate, even during peak. And that is with users on 1000 Mbit/s plans. I have no idea what Google did or why. I have a feeling that my own hard earned experiences overrides any hear say on that matter... Of course what I am telling you might also be hear say (although directly from a primary source) so do what you think is best. I am just sharing our experiences in the spirit of this forum. Regards, Baldur
On 9/Jan/16 08:45, Josh Reynolds wrote:
There's a reason Google did 16 way splits, and yes, we have two paths we are looking at for NG-PON2. One with Calix, another with another vendor.
At previous job, we did 24x splits to guarantee 100Mbps to each home; up to 50Mbps for Internet Access, 26Mbps for two 1080p IPTV HD streams, and another 24Mbps for margin (which covered VoIP). At present job, we'll stick with Active-E. Mark.
participants (3)
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Baldur Norddahl -
Josh Reynolds -
Mark Tinka