On Wed, 12 Dec 2007, Chris Cole wrote:
uniform agreement that the ratio of <10km to 10km to 40km applications is 10x or more. So given this view, it would be a very hard sell to convince the IEEE to only support a single 40km reach. In effect this would double the optics cost for most users.
Ah, single reach wasn't my intention. The point I tried to make was that if 10km and 40km is very near in price, and 3km is considerably cheaper, then it makes more sense to do 3km and 40km reaches to get two distinct prices and reaches. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se
The 40km/10km cost ratio is between 1.6x and 2x, depending on the source. The 10km/4km cost ratio is between 1.15x and 1.3x, again depending on the source. Chris -----Original Message----- From: Mikael Abrahamsson [mailto:swmike@swm.pp.se] Sent: Wednesday, December 12, 2007 11:17 PM To: Chris Cole Cc: nanog@merit.edu Subject: RE: IEEE 40GE & 100GE On Wed, 12 Dec 2007, Chris Cole wrote:
uniform agreement that the ratio of <10km to 10km to 40km applications
is 10x or more. So given this view, it would be a very hard sell to convince the IEEE to only support a single 40km reach. In effect this would double the optics cost for most users.
Ah, single reach wasn't my intention. The point I tried to make was that if 10km and 40km is very near in price, and 3km is considerably cheaper, then it makes more sense to do 3km and 40km reaches to get two distinct prices and reaches. -- Mikael Abrahamsson email: swmike@swm.pp.se
Thus spake "Chris Cole" <chris.cole@finisar.com>
The 40km/10km cost ratio is between 1.6x and 2x, depending on the source.
The 10km/4km cost ratio is between 1.15x and 1.3x, again depending on the source.
If those numbers translate into prices (not costs), then I'd prefer to see 40km and 4km optics, with no 10km optics. The important point is that the 40km optics neet to be able to handle 4.1km links with no attenuators, preferably without any human tuning at all. You only pay the extra capital cost once (if there even is any, due to more volume of fewer parts), but you pay labor and sparing over and over. S Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking
So, assuming this translates roughly to optics being: $1,000 4km $1,300 10km $2,600 40km You'd rather have to pay $2,600 for all your campus links than $1,300 for all your LAN links? My preference would be quite different. I'd much rather pay $1,300 for the LAN links than $2,600 for the Campus links. Owen On Dec 13, 2007, at 1:51 PM, Stephen Sprunk wrote:
Thus spake "Chris Cole" <chris.cole@finisar.com>
The 40km/10km cost ratio is between 1.6x and 2x, depending on the source.
The 10km/4km cost ratio is between 1.15x and 1.3x, again depending on the source.
If those numbers translate into prices (not costs), then I'd prefer to see 40km and 4km optics, with no 10km optics. The important point is that the 40km optics neet to be able to handle 4.1km links with no attenuators, preferably without any human tuning at all. You only pay the extra capital cost once (if there even is any, due to more volume of fewer parts), but you pay labor and sparing over and over.
S
Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking
Owen, You are an optimist. Initially, the pricing will be more then an order of magnitude higher. :) Chris -----Original Message----- From: Owen DeLong [mailto:owen@delong.com] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 2:51 PM To: Stephen Sprunk Cc: Chris Cole; Mikael Abrahamsson; North American Noise and Off-topic Gripes Subject: Re: IEEE 40GE & 100GE So, assuming this translates roughly to optics being: $1,000 4km $1,300 10km $2,600 40km You'd rather have to pay $2,600 for all your campus links than $1,300 for all your LAN links? My preference would be quite different. I'd much rather pay $1,300 for the LAN links than $2,600 for the Campus links. Owen On Dec 13, 2007, at 1:51 PM, Stephen Sprunk wrote:
Thus spake "Chris Cole" <chris.cole@finisar.com>
The 40km/10km cost ratio is between 1.6x and 2x, depending on the source.
The 10km/4km cost ratio is between 1.15x and 1.3x, again depending on the source.
If those numbers translate into prices (not costs), then I'd prefer to see 40km and 4km optics, with no 10km optics. The important point is that the 40km optics neet to be able to handle 4.1km links with no attenuators, preferably without any human tuning at all. You only pay the extra capital cost once (if there even is any, due to more volume of fewer parts), but you pay labor and sparing over and over.
S
Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking
Chris, Those were straw-man numbers. The point is that eventually it all becomes a commodity and mass-produced, and I'd like to see the stuff that would be maximally useful to us be the commodity that benefits most from the mass production. Hence my preference for the 10km optics. ---rob "Chris Cole" <chris.cole@finisar.com> writes:
Owen,
You are an optimist. Initially, the pricing will be more then an order of magnitude higher. :)
Chris
-----Original Message----- From: Owen DeLong [mailto:owen@delong.com] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 2:51 PM To: Stephen Sprunk Cc: Chris Cole; Mikael Abrahamsson; North American Noise and Off-topic Gripes Subject: Re: IEEE 40GE & 100GE
So, assuming this translates roughly to optics being:
$1,000 4km $1,300 10km $2,600 40km
You'd rather have to pay $2,600 for all your campus links than $1,300 for all your LAN links?
My preference would be quite different. I'd much rather pay $1,300 for the LAN links than $2,600 for the Campus links.
Owen
On Dec 13, 2007, at 1:51 PM, Stephen Sprunk wrote:
Thus spake "Chris Cole" <chris.cole@finisar.com>
The 40km/10km cost ratio is between 1.6x and 2x, depending on the source.
The 10km/4km cost ratio is between 1.15x and 1.3x, again depending on the source.
If those numbers translate into prices (not costs), then I'd prefer to see 40km and 4km optics, with no 10km optics. The important point is that the 40km optics neet to be able to handle 4.1km links with no attenuators, preferably without any human tuning at all. You only pay the extra capital cost once (if there even is any, due to more volume of fewer parts), but you pay labor and sparing over and over.
S
Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking
The 40km optics will require optical attenuators for distances somewhere below 20km, possibly for 10km or less. They will certainly require optical attenuators for 4km distances. Chris -----Original Message----- From: Stephen Sprunk [mailto:stephen@sprunk.org] Sent: Thursday, December 13, 2007 1:52 PM To: Chris Cole; Mikael Abrahamsson Cc: North American Noise and Off-topic Gripes Subject: Re: IEEE 40GE & 100GE Thus spake "Chris Cole" <chris.cole@finisar.com>
The 40km/10km cost ratio is between 1.6x and 2x, depending on the source.
The 10km/4km cost ratio is between 1.15x and 1.3x, again depending on the source.
If those numbers translate into prices (not costs), then I'd prefer to see 40km and 4km optics, with no 10km optics. The important point is that the 40km optics neet to be able to handle 4.1km links with no attenuators, preferably without any human tuning at all. You only pay the extra capital cost once (if there even is any, due to more volume of fewer parts), but you pay labor and sparing over and over. S Stephen Sprunk "God does not play dice." --Albert Einstein CCIE #3723 "God is an inveterate gambler, and He throws the K5SSS dice at every possible opportunity." --Stephen Hawking
participants (5)
-
Chris Cole -
Mikael Abrahamsson -
Owen DeLong -
Robert E. Seastrom -
Stephen Sprunk