On Thu, Feb 15, 2001 at 01:16:29PM -0800, smd@clock.org wrote:

Cool, speeding tickets for people with 10Gbps links in production today.

"if you route, don't drink. if you drink, don't route."

We don't need a "police force" per se as much as a functionary who, on behalf of the paying membership of the registry, tries to establish (e.g., with a phone call! or some email!) whether the announcement is a question of simple, honest misconfiguration or misunderstanding, or whether it's deliberate. Moreover, with another couple of phone calls (or email), a deliberately bad announcer can talk with the network(s) immediately upstream from a deliberate bad-announcer and suggest that the membership as a whole would appreciate the installation of strict filters against the bad announcer.

i agree that a setup as described here could have it's place.. i'm warning against the "hang `em high" attitude that was being proposed in earlier posts... that isn't to say i don't still have misgivings about such a system, just that your proposal seems much more sane. some sort of education and intervention system makes more sense than a blackhole for any perceived offense approach...

If that produces no results, rat out the source and its immediate upstreams to the whole membership.

| and the offending party will announce 32 /23s.. what will this solve?

Great, so we know that the offending party is not only deliberately announcing bogus data into the routing system, but actually _disrupting_ it. This is what real-life police are for.

perhaps this example was a little disingenuous on my part.. perhaps a better example would be: what happens when people just announce 32 /23s instead of 2 /19s to make it harder to blackhole... indeed, if people are announcing the /23s right off the bat, it's harder to prove that they are being malicious(tho it might not be as hard to prove that they're idiots :-)..

Sean.

On Fri, Feb 16, 2001 at 03:46:29PM +0100, Daniel Karrenberg wrote:

In principle this is a good idea. However I suspect that the effort involved in getting to the right people at the announcing AS and/or their up-stream peers is "not negligible". So this can easily become a serious effort.

i agree, as the "right people" in this case would not only have to be good network engineers, but also good at communicating with others AND relatively immune to politics....

As a person somehow connected to the registry system ;-) I would be interested to hear privately from ISPs whether they would like such a service and -more importantly- whether they would be prepared to put procedures in place by which the registries can reliably reach knowledgeable routing engineers that have the task of tracking down such problems as well as the resources and authority to do so.

i think for something like this to work well, it would have to be somewhat separate from the individual registries...

Daniel

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