Books for the NOC guys...
This morning I went digging for a book to recommend that someone in our NOC read in order to understand at a high level how Internet infrastructure works (bgp, igps, etc) and discovered that the old standbys (Huitema, Halabi, Perlman) have all not been updated in a decade or so. On the one hand, they're all still quite relevant since there hasn't been anything really earth-shattering in that department, but they are all going to be lean to nonexistent on stuff like IPv6 and NLRI negotiation. So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read? Thanks, -r
On Apr 2, 2010, at 7:09 PM, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
<http://www.amazon.com/Router-Security-Strategies-Securing-Network/dp/1587053365/ref=sr_1_2?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270210783&sr=8-2> <http://www.amazon.com/Practical-BGP-Russ-White/dp/0321127005/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270210821&sr=1-1> <http://www.amazon.com/TCP-Guide-Comprehensive-Illustrated-Protocols/dp/159327047X/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270210859&sr=1-1> <http://www.amazon.com/TCP-Illustrated-Volumes-1-3-Boxed/dp/0201776316/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270210884&sr=1-1> ----------------------------------------------------------------------- Roland Dobbins <rdobbins@arbor.net> // <http://www.arbornetworks.com> Injustice is relatively easy to bear; what stings is justice. -- H.L. Mencken
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
In an attempt to wean them off of unmanageable PERL scripts <http://www.complete.org/FoundationsOfPythonNetworkProgramming> There are tons of tutorials and articles on the web, often with links to other useful stuff <http://www.howstuffworks.com/internet-infrastructure.htm/printable> <http://www.inetdaemon.com/tutorials/internet/ip/routing/bgp/troubleshooting/> And let's not forget all of the NANOG presentations. Sometimes the slides are quite good on their own but if not, the audio is there too. <http://www.nanog.org/meetings/nanog29/presentations/smith.pdf> I would encourage them to download PDFs, videos and websites for future reference and to share with colleagues. Also, set up a wiki, and ask them all to record any useful bits of info there and to track Recent Changes every week or so to see what colleagues are sharing. --Michael Dillon
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 13:48:48 BST, Michael Dillon said:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
In an attempt to wean them off of unmanageable PERL scripts
There is not, and there never will be, a useful programming language that makes it the least bit difficult to write totally abominable creeping-horror unmaintainable code in. The ability of a programmer to write totally obtuse code is entirely orthogonal to the choice of implementation language. Some people just don't have good taste, and will produce train wrecks in any language. Remember that it's possible to write Fortran-IV code in any language. :) Unless you teach them stuff like "Document the sources and expected types of input data", "add useful comments that explain your choice of algorithms rather than "a++; /* Add one to A */", and "If the language supports operator overloading, don't be a bozo and abuse it", the code will be unmaintainable.
On 4/2/2010 08:39, Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 13:48:48 BST, Michael Dillon said:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
In an attempt to wean them off of unmanageable PERL scripts
There is not, and there never will be, a useful programming language that makes it the least bit difficult to write totally abominable creeping-horror unmaintainable code in.
The ability of a programmer to write totally obtuse code is entirely orthogonal to the choice of implementation language. Some people just don't have good taste, and will produce train wrecks in any language. Remember that it's possible to write Fortran-IV code in any language. :)
Unless you teach them stuff like "Document the sources and expected types of input data", "add useful comments that explain your choice of algorithms rather than "a++; /* Add one to A */", and "If the language supports operator overloading, don't be a bozo and abuse it", the code will be unmaintainable.
"Teach them". Train them. Have standards. Enforce them (pay according to compliance). What a concept! We did that using Autocoder and COBOL. What next? "Manage" them? Is that even legal? -- Democracy: Three wolves and a sheep voting on the dinner menu. Requiescas in pace o email Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Eppure si rinfresca ICBM Targeting Information: http://tinyurl.com/4sqczs http://tinyurl.com/7tp8ml
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 13:48:48 BST, Michael Dillon said:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
In an attempt to wean them off of unmanageable PERL scripts
There is not, and there never will be, a useful programming language that makes it the least bit difficult to write totally abominable creeping-horror unmaintainable code in.
The ability of a programmer to write totally obtuse code is entirely orthogonal to the choice of implementation language. Some people just don't have good taste, and will produce train wrecks in any language. Remember
I just show them this: http://warriorsofthe.net/ -Scott -----Original Message----- From: Larry Sheldon [mailto:LarrySheldon@cox.net] Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 9:46 AM To: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: Books for the NOC guys... On 4/2/2010 08:39, Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu wrote: that
it's possible to write Fortran-IV code in any language. :)
Unless you teach them stuff like "Document the sources and expected types of input data", "add useful comments that explain your choice of algorithms rather than "a++; /* Add one to A */", and "If the language supports operator overloading, don't be a bozo and abuse it", the code will be unmaintainable.
"Teach them". Train them. Have standards. Enforce them (pay according to compliance). What a concept! We did that using Autocoder and COBOL. What next? "Manage" them? Is that even legal? -- Democracy: Three wolves and a sheep voting on the dinner menu. Requiescas in pace o email Ex turpi causa non oritur actio Eppure si rinfresca ICBM Targeting Information: http://tinyurl.com/4sqczs http://tinyurl.com/7tp8ml
On 02/04/2010 14:39, Valdis.Kletnieks@vt.edu wrote:
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 13:48:48 BST, Michael Dillon said:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
In an attempt to wean them off of unmanageable PERL scripts
There is not, and there never will be, a useful programming language that makes it the least bit difficult to write totally abominable creeping-horror unmaintainable code in.
+n "Whatever language you write in, your task as a programmer is to do the best you can with the tools at hand. A good programmer can overcome a poor language or a clumsy operating system, but even a great programming environment will not rescue a bad programmer". (Kernighan and Pike) Although language zealots are loth to admit it, certain languages are better suited to some things than to others. Perl's syntactical support for text processing are second to none, but for web stuff, it's hideous. PHP stinks on the command line and text processing, yet its web integration makes it a good candidate for small web projects. Shell scripts are designed specifically for command line tool management, pipes and all that sort of thing, and just because other languages support popen() and system, that doesn't necessarily make them good choices for stuff which involves unix scripting. I write readable and maintainable code in all three. Java elicits strong reactions. No doubt, you can use Java plumbing libraries to scale to impressively large systems. On the other hand, Cisco Configuration Professional (the new SDM) provides an excellent example of how badly you can screw up a good idea by using the wrong tool - I'm not interesting in using or recommending a desktop tool which takes 2 minutes to start on a fast computer. You can write unimaginably awful code in python and ruby, and irrtoolset's code is a prime example of what you can do with c++. Yet, we all acknowledge that python, ruby and c++ are high quality languages. In short: less zealotry, more pragmatism and a realisation that each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Bad code is bad code in any language. Nick
Once upon a time, Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com> said:
All true, but I'd still say there's a special rung in hell for bad perl.
Ehh, bad perl is still more readable than good APL. At least I can reformat the perl! :-) -- Chris Adams <cmadams@hiwaay.net> Systems and Network Administrator - HiWAAY Internet Services I don't speak for anybody but myself - that's enough trouble.
On Fri, Apr 2, 2010 at 10:53 AM, Chris Adams <cmadams@hiwaay.net> wrote:
Once upon a time, Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com> said:
All true, but I'd still say there's a special rung in hell for bad perl.
Ehh, bad perl is still more readable than good APL. At least I can reformat the perl! :-)
In my experience bad perl usually consists of using system() a lot to run shell commands and read the input. Creative well-written perl, now there's something unreadable and unmaintainable! :-) -B
On Apr 2, 2010, at 1:53 44PM, Chris Adams wrote:
Once upon a time, Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com> said:
All true, but I'd still say there's a special rung in hell for bad perl.
Ehh, bad perl is still more readable than good APL. At least I can reformat the perl! :-) --
Oh, I don't know about that -- you an often reformat APL, too. Just because something can be written in one line doesn't mean it should be! And bad APL -- well, that's produced either by people who are trying to be too clever, or who haven't grokked APL's array-as-a-whole philosophy, and try to use its (very poor) looping or conditional control flow primitives. --Steve Bellovin, http://www.cs.columbia.edu/~smb
It's the same level reserved for child molesters and people who talk at the theater... Michael Thomas wrote:
On 04/02/2010 10:43 AM, Nick Hilliard wrote:
In short: less zealotry, more pragmatism and a realisation that each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Bad code is bad code in any language.
All true, but I'd still say there's a special rung in hell for bad perl.
Mike ------------------------------------------------------------------------
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In short: less zealotry, more pragmatism and a realisation that each language has its own strengths and weaknesses. Bad code is bad code in any language.
All true, but I'd still say there's a special rung in hell for bad perl.
And it is exacerbated by the huge volume of bad PERL books out there and the fact that entry level NOC monkeys often get the idea that PERL is cool and therefore learn it as their first and only language without a lot of critical thinking. Also, please note that the original request was for books, or in other words documents containing guidance. I supplied the name of such a document providing guidance using Python. If someone wanted to play the game and trump me, then they would quote the title of another book, or at least a substantial website tutorial, that uses another programming language. --Michael Dillon
On Friday 02 April 2010 04:08:03 pm Michael Dillon wrote:
If someone wanted to play the game and trump me, then they would quote the title of another book, or at least a substantial website tutorial, that uses another programming language.
I wish I could reply to this yesterday.... Then, I would have simply pointed to http://www.catb.org/~esr/intercal/intercal.ps.gz and let that hang out there for a while. One of the finest examples of a write-only language. Or, better yet, I could point you to a non-April 1st CGI programming example: http://www.fcc.gov/mb/audio/bickel/archive/colorit-fortran-get-cgi-example.t... Please at least look at that last link even if you already know better than to read the PostScript document at the first link. Look at where the CGI example came from, and consider doing something like rancid in either of those two languages. There is worse out there than perl. Also consider that the second link was originally written for VAX/VMS. I've personally used expect (and the tcl underpinnings) for a number of years, but I wouldn't call it very readable. If you want to force people to write things that are readable, choose COBOL. See http://theamericanprogrammer.com/books/books.cobol.shtml for a list of pertinent books. Having said all that, I'll agree with Michael on using Python, as it is very readable even when you try to obfuscate it, thanks in no small part to the whole 'indentation is significant' design decision.
Nick Hilliard wrote:
"PHP stinks on the command line and text processing"
This is a bit of a broad sweeping statement! Can you elaborate on what your definition of how PHP "stinks" in this context? We have dozens of CLI scripts all written in PHP, some of which have been running for years and never given us any grief. We specifically chose PHP as the scripting language to standardize on to replace PERL because it was simple to learn and extremely powerful. I came from a PERL (and C/Pascal/Assembler) background so I found the PHP language stylings a natural fit when I discovered it in 2001, and have been using it for most of my scripting needs ever since. PHP adopts a lot of "PERL-isms" which I find very comfortable. Occasionally I do hear of someone deriding PHP, and naturally I would like to hear their side of the story. Often, I find it is due to lack of experience with PHP CLI scripting, or perhaps just PHP's capabilities in general. M
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
While not specifically a NOC book, we find that it lays a great foundation to build from (if, perhaps, a bit basic in certain areas): Network Warrior by Gary A. Donahue http://www.amazon.com/Network-Warrior-Everything-need-wasnt/dp/0596101511/ This is a great book with an easy to read style. Tom Walsh
On Fri, Apr 2, 2010 at 6:02 AM, Express Web Systems <mailinglists@expresswebsystems.com> wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
While not specifically a NOC book, we find that it lays a great foundation to build from (if, perhaps, a bit basic in certain areas):
Network Warrior by Gary A. Donahue
http://www.amazon.com/Network-Warrior-Everything-need-wasnt/dp/0596101511/
This is a great book with an easy to read style.
+1 Network Warrior. -B
Aside from the ones already mentioned, troubleshooting books are a great asset, also. Here are some of my favorites: http://www.amazon.com/Network-Analysis-Troubleshooting-Scott-Haugdahl/dp/020... http://www.amazon.com/Troubleshooting-Campus-Networks-Practical-Protocols/dp... http://www.amazon.com/Network-Maintenance-Troubleshooting-Guide-Solutions/dp... <- just ordered the 2nd edition, after having browsed it at a friend ***Stefan Mititelu http://twitter.com/netfortius http://www.linkedin.com/in/netfortius On Fri, Apr 2, 2010 at 9:02 AM, Express Web Systems <mailinglists@expresswebsystems.com> wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
While not specifically a NOC book, we find that it lays a great foundation to build from (if, perhaps, a bit basic in certain areas):
Network Warrior by Gary A. Donahue
http://www.amazon.com/Network-Warrior-Everything-need-wasnt/dp/0596101511/
This is a great book with an easy to read style.
Tom Walsh
On Fri, 02 Apr 2010 08:09:29 -0400 "Robert E. Seastrom" <rs@seastrom.com> wrote:
This morning I went digging for a book to recommend that someone in our NOC read in order to understand at a high level how Internet infrastructure works (bgp, igps, etc) and discovered that the old standbys (Huitema, Halabi, Perlman) have all not been updated in a decade or so. [...] So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
That is an excellent question Rob. I still recommend and prefer to use Radia's book when I teach networking classes. There are lots of books that regurgitate the specs or spend a fair amount of time on the core algorithms and mechanisms, but few go into the "why" and "what if" like she does that makes it so exceptional and particularly relevant from an operations perspective. I often will play a clip or two from past meetings like NANOG and discuss that in class to make up for the lack of reference and discussion material elsewhere. Perhaps point them at a few of your favorite presentations on a particular operationally relevant topic you want them to know more about? John
On Apr 2, 2010, at 7:09 AM, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
This morning I went digging for a book to recommend that someone in our NOC read in order to understand at a high level how Internet infrastructure works (bgp, igps, etc) and discovered that the old standbys (Huitema, Halabi, Perlman) have all not been updated in a decade or so.
On the one hand, they're all still quite relevant since there hasn't been anything really earth-shattering in that department, but they are all going to be lean to nonexistent on stuff like IPv6 and NLRI negotiation.
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Thanks,
-r
It kind of depends on what you want from your NOC folk and (at least a little bit) which "level" NOC people need the resource. In addition to the ones already listed, we encourage Tier 1 and Tier 2 people to read and understand these two books: T1: A Survival Guide http://www.amazon.com/T1-Survival-Guide-Matthew-Gast/dp/0596001274/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270216284&sr=8-1 Network Maintenance and Troubleshooting Guide http://www.amazon.com/Network-Maintenance-Troubleshooting-Guide-Solutions/dp/0321647416/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270216655&sr=1-1 We find these are both pretty solid resources, especially for our Tier 1 folks. Since much of what they eventually deal with are Layer 1 problems, having resources that focus on Layer 1 helps get their mind moving that direction. If we have a routing problem, that generally needs to get bumped up anyway since it means somethings misconfigured or a routing protocol is acting up. -- Brad Fleming
"Robert E. Seastrom" <rs@seastrom.com> writes:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
<http://www.amazon.com/Illustrated-Network-Modern-Kaufmann-Metworking/dp/0123745411/> I think it's quite good and covers many "modern" topics. One drawback: It mentions ethereal and not wireshark. At the time of writing ethereal must have been dead for about 2 years. Jens -- ------------------------------------------------------------------------- | Foelderichstr. 40 | 13595 Berlin, Germany | +49-151-18721264 | | http://blog.quux.de | jabber: jenslink@guug.de | ------------------- | -------------------------------------------------------------------------
On Apr 2, 2010, at 8:10 AM, Jens Link wrote:
"Robert E. Seastrom" <rs@seastrom.com> writes:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
<http://www.amazon.com/Illustrated-Network-Modern-Kaufmann-Metworking/dp/0123745411/>
I think it's quite good and covers many "modern" topics. One drawback: It mentions ethereal and not wireshark. At the time of writing ethereal must have been dead for about 2 years.
Heh.. GUIs they come and GUIs they go... tcpdump works forever. Owen
The Limoncelli etc book is brilliant. There's phil smith and barry greene's old "Cisco ISP Essentials" too. Very good if somewhat outdated And then there's this if you just want security - http://www.amazon.com/Router-Security-Strategies-Securing-Network/dp/1587053365/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&s=books&qid=1270223489&sr=1-1 On Fri, Apr 2, 2010 at 9:06 PM, Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wrote:
On 4/2/10 2:09 PM, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Practice of System and Network Administration by Limoncelli, Hogan, and Challup. I may be biased, being married to Hogan.
-- Suresh Ramasubramanian (ops.lists@gmail.com)
On Friday 02 April 2010 11:36:53 am Eliot Lear wrote:
Practice of System and Network Administration by Limoncelli, Hogan, and Challup. I may be biased, being married to Hogan.
+1 on PSNA. I like it as much for its non-technical content as for its technical content (a similar book, by Limncelli, "Time Management for System Administrators" is also on my shelf, with great non-technical content, and should be a must-read for any technical personnel, IMO). +1 also on Network Warrior, although not for everything. I also have 'Cisco Network Professional's Advanced Internetworking Guide' by Patrick J. Conlan, published by Sybex. Comes with the full text on CD in PDF form, too. The URL is pretty long, so use the search on sybex.com to find it. Here's the ToC: 1. Enterprise Network Design. 2. Switching. 3. Spanning Tree Protocol (STP). 4. Routing Concepts and Distance Vector Routing Protocols. 5. Advanced Distance Vector Protocols. 6. Link State Routing Protocols. 7. Exterior Routing Protocols. 8. Multicast. 9. IP Version 6. 10. Redundancy Protocols. 11. WAN and Teleworker Connections. 12. Virtual Private Networks (VPN). 13. Device Security. 14. Switch Security. 15. Cisco IOS Firewall. 16. Cisco IOS IPS. 17. Voice. 18. DiffServ Quality of Service (QOS). 19. Wireless Devices and Topologies. 20. Wireless Management and Security. Which pretty much, I think, covers the bases asked about in the OP. The copyright is May 2009, so it's not too bad out of date.
On Fri, Apr 2, 2010 at 8:36 AM, Eliot Lear <lear@cisco.com> wrote:
On 4/2/10 2:09 PM, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Practice of System and Network Administration by Limoncelli, Hogan, and Challup. I may be biased, being married to Hogan.
Chalup with one L (though of course she didn't have that name when you and I first met her...) -- ---- Thanks; Bill Note that this isn't my regular email account - It's still experimental so far. And Google probably logs and indexes everything you send it.
Well, speaking as one who wrote an ISP-specific, although not NOC-specific book about a decade ago, it doesn't seem as if there is a commercial motivation to update them. For the record, it's _Building Service Provider Networks_ (Wiley, 2001), and I'm proud of it. Nevertheless, I'm not opposed to trying to create updated open-source guidance. I do a good deal of work with http://en.citizendium.org, a real-name Wiki that is trying to reach critical mass. Anybody interested in collaborating? I'd actually started more on RPSL and peering than first-tier ops, but hadn't done anything more for lack of activity there. Certainly, I could port some of my NANOG tutorials, not that I have the PPT for many but just the PDF.
-----Original Message----- From: Robert E. Seastrom [mailto:rs@seastrom.com] Sent: Friday, April 02, 2010 8:09 AM To: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Books for the NOC guys...
This morning I went digging for a book to recommend that someone in our NOC read in order to understand at a high level how Internet infrastructure works (bgp, igps, etc) and discovered that the old standbys (Huitema, Halabi, Perlman) have all not been updated in a decade or so.
On the one hand, they're all still quite relevant since there hasn't been anything really earth-shattering in that department, but they are all going to be lean to nonexistent on stuff like IPv6 and NLRI negotiation.
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Thanks,
-r
While not the stevens book, "the illustrated network" isbn 978-0-12-374541-5 was a pretty good attempt to do a modern version of the same. any book that attempts to cover all layers of the stack is going to have it's limits, but it has saved my bacon a couple of times now... The author is normally a juniper press author and as a result the examples that aren't done on freebsd or linux systems are done on junos which is either a benifit or a drawback depending on your environment. disclaimer, I did review it for content/accuracy, but wasn't compensated for doing so. joel On 04/02/2010 05:09 AM, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
This morning I went digging for a book to recommend that someone in our NOC read in order to understand at a high level how Internet infrastructure works (bgp, igps, etc) and discovered that the old standbys (Huitema, Halabi, Perlman) have all not been updated in a decade or so.
On the one hand, they're all still quite relevant since there hasn't been anything really earth-shattering in that department, but they are all going to be lean to nonexistent on stuff like IPv6 and NLRI negotiation.
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Thanks,
-r
On Fri, Apr 02, 2010, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Since I thought this was worthwhile summarising, I've dumped it on the mail topics page in the Wiki: http://nanog.cluepon.net/index.php/MailTopics I specifically left out the programming language related ranting. Adrian
I also grabbed the list http://isoc-ny.org/wiki/Networking Thanks to all who contributed. j On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Adrian Chadd <adrian@creative.net.au> wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2010, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Since I thought this was worthwhile summarising, I've dumped it on the mail topics page in the Wiki:
http://nanog.cluepon.net/index.php/MailTopics
I specifically left out the programming language related ranting.
Adrian
-- --------------------------------------------------------------- Joly MacFie 218 565 9365 Skype:punkcast WWWhatsup NYC - http://wwwhatsup.com http://pinstand.com - http://punkcast.com Secretary - ISOC-NY - http://isoc-ny.org ---------------------------------------------------------------
On Mon, Apr 26, 2010, Joly MacFie wrote:
I also grabbed the list http://isoc-ny.org/wiki/Networking
Thanks to all who contributed.
Please feel free to add a link to the above url in the nanog wiki.
j
On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Adrian Chadd <adrian@creative.net.au> wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2010, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Since I thought this was worthwhile summarising, I've dumped it on the mail topics page in the Wiki:
http://nanog.cluepon.net/index.php/MailTopics
I specifically left out the programming language related ranting.
Adrian
-- --------------------------------------------------------------- Joly MacFie 218 565 9365 Skype:punkcast WWWhatsup NYC - http://wwwhatsup.com http://pinstand.com - http://punkcast.com Secretary - ISOC-NY - http://isoc-ny.org ---------------------------------------------------------------
-- - Xenion - http://www.xenion.com.au/ - VPS Hosting - Commercial Squid Support - - $24/pm+GST entry-level VPSes w/ capped bandwidth charges available in WA -
I was unable to register an acconut & edit the page. I would recommend including the O'reilly BGP book by Iljitsch van Beijnum. Under online stuff: The TCP/IP guide, which is surprisingly thorough: http://www.tcpipguide.com/ On Tue, Apr 27, 2010 at 11:11:07AM +0800, Adrian Chadd wrote:
On Mon, Apr 26, 2010, Joly MacFie wrote:
I also grabbed the list http://isoc-ny.org/wiki/Networking
Thanks to all who contributed.
Please feel free to add a link to the above url in the nanog wiki.
j
On Sat, Apr 3, 2010 at 6:52 AM, Adrian Chadd <adrian@creative.net.au> wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2010, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Since I thought this was worthwhile summarising, I've dumped it on the mail topics page in the Wiki:
http://nanog.cluepon.net/index.php/MailTopics
I specifically left out the programming language related ranting.
Adrian
-- --------------------------------------------------------------- Joly MacFie 218 565 9365 Skype:punkcast WWWhatsup NYC - http://wwwhatsup.com http://pinstand.com - http://punkcast.com Secretary - ISOC-NY - http://isoc-ny.org ---------------------------------------------------------------
-- - Xenion - http://www.xenion.com.au/ - VPS Hosting - Commercial Squid Support - - $24/pm+GST entry-level VPSes w/ capped bandwidth charges available in WA -
-- Naveen Nathan To understand the human mind, understand self-deception. - Anon
On 4/3/10 1:52 PM, Adrian Chadd wrote:
On Fri, Apr 02, 2010, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
So, what are you having your up-and-coming NOC staff read?
Since I thought this was worthwhile summarising, I've dumped it on the mail topics page in the Wiki:
http://nanog.cluepon.net/index.php/MailTopics
I specifically left out the programming language related ranting.
Can we create some instant web-poll to rank these books? I am sure many people would participate. There are several free services online, or I can volunteer a wordpress installation with the relevant plugin. Thanks, Gadi.
On Fri, Apr 02, 2010 at 08:09:29AM -0400, Robert E. Seastrom wrote:
This morning I went digging for a book to recommend that someone in our NOC read in order to understand at a high level how Internet infrastructure works
How to do comes automatically, *why* to do is the difference between a good and great engineer. Watching old nanog (and other country-nog) archives is good, going to the actual meetings and meeting people is better, and developing a culture of shared understanding and colaboration is golden. I guess I mean, working out the what the "best way" to build a network is rather than following an example.. If you do like dead trees, then capturing the spirit of what I mean comes from older books like my (prized) "ISP Survival Guide" (Geoff Huston). My 2p. Andy
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Eliot Lear -
Express Web Systems -
Gadi Evron -
Howard C. Berkowitz -
Jens Link -
Joel Jaeggli -
John Kristoff -
Joly MacFie -
Lamar Owen -
Larry Sheldon -
Marty Anstey -
Michael Dillon -
Michael Thomas -
Naveen Nathan -
Nick Hilliard -
Owen DeLong -
Ray Sanders -
Robert E. Seastrom -
Scott Berkman -
Stefan -
Steven Bellovin -
Suresh Ramasubramanian -
Valdis.Kletnieks＠vt.edu