From: rrv@uiuc.edu (Ross Veach) At 2:48 PM 11/4/95, Michael Dillon wrote:
10% packet loss is quite within the normal range of parameters for a packet switching network such as the Internet.
Sorry Michael, wrong answer. 1% packet loss is intolerable. 10% packet loss is all but useless for serious work.
And the 40% reported here (at MAE-East) is excrable. Except at the older MAE-East, it's not _links_ that are on the blink. It's the (too few) exchanges, and the very bad routing policies. Of course, the idiocy of choosing ATM kept most of the NAPs off-line, until they switched to FDDI. My solution is to take the contracts away from MFS and Ameritech effective immediately, and grant them to someone who knows what they are doing. I may not agree with all the older CIX policies, but at least it worked! Bill.Simpson@um.cc.umich.edu Key fingerprint = 2E 07 23 03 C5 62 70 D3 59 B1 4F 5E 1D C2 C1 A2
"take the contracts away from MFS...." uh, the last I knew there was no "contract" that MFS has from anyone (the gubmint types??) that can be taken away. I haven't taken the time to sort out who pays for what at the other NAPs. The Gigaswitch at MAE-EAST is smoking along just fine. There *are* ports onto MAE-EAST with lower-performance than dedicated Gigaswitch ports, but that is a function of what some clients want to buy. To a good first approximation, MFS sells what the clients want. Same with MAE-WEST as well. That is why some attachees have a port on a shared Ethernet off the FDDI and others have (possibly multiple) dediated FDDI ports on the Gigaswitch. Remember that MAE-EAST existed over a year before NAPs were created. As for additional exchange points, this is trivially obvious and will almost certainly come to pass in some time frame, I hope sooner rather than later. What is less obvious is who runs them, especially if one has second thoughts about the majority of the exchanges not be run by one company, as well as insist they be implemented with non-experimental technology and operated by people with clues about telco-grade service quality. It would also be nice if the exchange operator were not a competitor of the subscribers, but all of these desires may over-constrain the problem. One would think there is a nice little business in running exchange points around the country. Get co-lo space on a contract that will let you sub-let, put in a nice FDDI Gigaswitch, heavy-duty power with generator backup, good remote hands, plenty of DS3 entrance facilities (ideally on OC12 or faster sonet for growth!), monitoring and statistics gathering facilities, out-of-band management network, and a nice NOC somewhere to coordinate with all your customers. Put locations in major metro areas and go to town. You may need some up-front cash, but hey, this Internet thing is hot, so you can probably find investors (big grin). So how much do you have to charge subscribers to make this work? -mo
One would think there is a nice little business in running exchange points around the country. Get co-lo space on a contract that will let you sub-let, put in a nice FDDI Gigaswitch, heavy-duty power with generator backup, good remote hands, plenty of DS3 entrance facilities (ideally on OC12 or faster sonet for growth!), monitoring and statistics gathering facilities, out-of-band management network, and a nice NOC somewhere to coordinate with all your customers.
Put locations in major metro areas and go to town. You may need some up-front cash, but hey, this Internet thing is hot, so you can probably find investors (big grin).
So how much do you have to charge subscribers to make this work?
-mo
(1) Find out whether anyone has a clue about how to add more major exchange points and actually usefully use them in their routing fabric. But anyway: I was looking at the Tech Data catalog (we've been very happy with a $3k 24-port 3com Etherswitch we got from them). I found: Digital GIGAswitch platform with a 2-port FDDI line card; switches up to 3.6Gbps, forwards at 290kpps per port, 11 slots, FDDI point to point and ring connections, future ATM ready......................................... $30,000 $21,784 GIGAswitch 2-port FDDI Line Card, hot swappable.......... $ 9,000 $ 6,525 GIGAswitch 4-port FDDI Line Card, hot swappable.......... $12,500 $ 88085 A backup switching proc. is $15k, a backup 20amp power supply $2k. Last time I was at MAE-East, I only remember < 20 ports on the Gigaswitch. And there's no generator @ MAE-East. And I'm not sure that those batteries mean diddly. In Philly, the batteries are for DC only. @ MFS, we're on our own for AC backup. Anyway, with some etherswitches with FDDI uplinks and a GIGAswitch or two, you're off. I don't have list prices on the Catalyst series... Then, as mentioned above, NOC & telco facilities, and you're off. We're talking with an IXC about taking an OC3 from Pennsauken to NYC and handing FDDI off for $4k and Ethernets for $2k @ 60 Hudson. We ourselves don't have an interest in it, but hey... Of course, an extended NY Nap that hits 60 Hudson, a building in Philly, and Pennsauken could be interesting... I don't know how crazy a mac-level bridged medium like a bridged FDDI in 3 locations many ms apart would function. And the technology they're thinking of using doesn't scale well - Netedges speaking to each other over OC3s. But if they can get 4 customers @ $4k per, they'll do it. Avi
participants (3)
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Avi Freedman -
Mike O'Dell -
William Allen Simpson