The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing. Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully? Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much. I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on? Thanks, -Adam Adam Thompson Consultant, Infrastructure Services [1593169877849] 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca<mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> www.merlin.mb.ca<http://www.merlin.mb.ca/>
I have used it successfully in a test environment that I was using ECMP in. Most of the public networks that I've worked with don't use ECMP as often as other methods for steering traffic (LAGs, BGP MEDs, etc). What I have seen it fantastically useful for was troubleshooting a transit provider, or for when they were congested or had a flapping core link. Granted I *think *it's still subject to ICMP deprioritization (most SP's use it prodigiously), and most MPLS cores don't decrement TTL, but it was still useful to be able to show them "no, at this IP, I *always* drop traffic, when..." - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:23 PM Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca> wrote:
The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing.
Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully?
Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much.
I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on?
Thanks,
-Adam
*Adam Thompson* Consultant, Infrastructure Services [image: 1593169877849] 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca www.merlin.mb.ca
Ha, my apologies, I thought I was writing this for a Linux User Group, not a NOG. Ignore my simplistic explanations. - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:47 PM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
I have used it successfully in a test environment that I was using ECMP in. Most of the public networks that I've worked with don't use ECMP as often as other methods for steering traffic (LAGs, BGP MEDs, etc).
What I have seen it fantastically useful for was troubleshooting a transit provider, or for when they were congested or had a flapping core link. Granted I *think *it's still subject to ICMP deprioritization (most SP's use it prodigiously), and most MPLS cores don't decrement TTL, but it was still useful to be able to show them "no, at this IP, I *always* drop traffic, when..."
- Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com
On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:23 PM Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca> wrote:
The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing.
Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully?
Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much.
I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on?
Thanks,
-Adam
*Adam Thompson* Consultant, Infrastructure Services [image: 1593169877849] 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca www.merlin.mb.ca
What about some other options? https://paris-traceroute.net/ https://dublin-traceroute.net/ https://github.com/rucarrol/traceflow -- Hugo Slabbert On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 9:54 AM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
Ha, my apologies, I thought I was writing this for a Linux User Group, not a NOG. Ignore my simplistic explanations. - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com
On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:47 PM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
I have used it successfully in a test environment that I was using ECMP in. Most of the public networks that I've worked with don't use ECMP as often as other methods for steering traffic (LAGs, BGP MEDs, etc).
What I have seen it fantastically useful for was troubleshooting a transit provider, or for when they were congested or had a flapping core link. Granted I *think *it's still subject to ICMP deprioritization (most SP's use it prodigiously), and most MPLS cores don't decrement TTL, but it was still useful to be able to show them "no, at this IP, I *always* drop traffic, when..."
- Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com
On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:23 PM Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca> wrote:
The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing.
Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully?
Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much.
I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on?
Thanks,
-Adam
*Adam Thompson* Consultant, Infrastructure Services [image: 1593169877849] 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca www.merlin.mb.ca
Historically the bufferbloat effort has used irtt, ping, mtr in combination with a set of tcp flows to attempt to induce and graph the problem via the flent tool. I haven't thought all that much about ecmp or isolating the bloated hop until recently as an outgrowth of apple's networkQuality effort here: https://raw.githubusercontent.com/network-quality/draft-cpaasch-ippm-respons... TCP_INFO, at least in linux, has now accumulated an amazing number of useful looking statistics few are using as yet. monitoring hopcount also, and perhaps changes to the flowid in transit possibly useful? Key to my thinking at the moment, is I think it's possible, after viewing RTT inflation, to drop the TTL during a fat flow to find where the bloated hop is, and although I started drafting the ideas for the new tool here https://github.com/dtaht/wtbb I am sufficiently lazy to wonder if it's been done before? And what other statistics would be useful to try and obtain? On Thu, Nov 25, 2021 at 8:42 AM Hugo Slabbert <hugo@slabnet.com> wrote:
What about some other options?
https://paris-traceroute.net/ https://dublin-traceroute.net/ https://github.com/rucarrol/traceflow
-- Hugo Slabbert
On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 9:54 AM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
Ha, my apologies, I thought I was writing this for a Linux User Group, not a NOG. Ignore my simplistic explanations. - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com
On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:47 PM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> wrote:
I have used it successfully in a test environment that I was using ECMP in. Most of the public networks that I've worked with don't use ECMP as often as other methods for steering traffic (LAGs, BGP MEDs, etc).
What I have seen it fantastically useful for was troubleshooting a transit provider, or for when they were congested or had a flapping core link. Granted I *think *it's still subject to ICMP deprioritization (most SP's use it prodigiously), and most MPLS cores don't decrement TTL, but it was still useful to be able to show them "no, at this IP, I *always* drop traffic, when..."
- Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com
On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:23 PM Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca> wrote:
The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing.
Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully?
Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much.
I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on?
Thanks,
-Adam
*Adam Thompson* Consultant, Infrastructure Services [image: 1593169877849] 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca www.merlin.mb.ca
-- I tried to build a better future, a few times: https://wayforward.archive.org/?site=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.icei.org Dave Täht CEO, TekLibre, LLC
Thank you!! Some of those tools are proving much more useful for me than fbtracert. (In particular, traceflow has been updated recently enough that it “just works” in common environments that have Python3. And while it may not be perfect, it’s good enough to show what I need.) -Adam (who apparently has lost the skills needed to Google usefully, in his decrepitude) Adam Thompson Consultant, Infrastructure Services [1593169877849] 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca<mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> www.merlin.mb.ca<http://www.merlin.mb.ca/> From: Hugo Slabbert <hugo@slabnet.com> Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 10:39 AM To: Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> Cc: Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca>; nanog <nanog@nanog.org> Subject: Re: anyone use fbtracert successfully? What about some other options? https://paris-traceroute.net/ https://dublin-traceroute.net/ https://github.com/rucarrol/traceflow -- Hugo Slabbert On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 9:54 AM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com<mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com>> wrote: Ha, my apologies, I thought I was writing this for a Linux User Group, not a NOG. Ignore my simplistic explanations. - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com<mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:47 PM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com<mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com>> wrote: I have used it successfully in a test environment that I was using ECMP in. Most of the public networks that I've worked with don't use ECMP as often as other methods for steering traffic (LAGs, BGP MEDs, etc). What I have seen it fantastically useful for was troubleshooting a transit provider, or for when they were congested or had a flapping core link. Granted I think it's still subject to ICMP deprioritization (most SP's use it prodigiously), and most MPLS cores don't decrement TTL, but it was still useful to be able to show them "no, at this IP, I always drop traffic, when..." - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com<mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:23 PM Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca<mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca>> wrote: The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing. Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully? Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much. I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on? Thanks, -Adam Adam Thompson Consultant, Infrastructure Services 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca<mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> www.merlin.mb.ca<http://www.merlin.mb.ca/>
smokeping in master slave mode. A bit old school, but maybe still worth a try. https://oss.oetiker.ch/smokeping/doc/smokeping_master_slave.en.html Jean From: NANOG <nanog-bounces+jean=ddostest.me@nanog.org> On Behalf Of Adam Thompson Sent: November 25, 2021 1:31 PM To: Hugo Slabbert <hugo@slabnet.com>; Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> Cc: nanog <nanog@nanog.org> Subject: RE: anyone use fbtracert successfully? Thank you!! Some of those tools are proving much more useful for me than fbtracert. (In particular, traceflow has been updated recently enough that it “just works” in common environments that have Python3. And while it may not be perfect, it’s good enough to show what I need.) -Adam (who apparently has lost the skills needed to Google usefully, in his decrepitude) Adam Thompson Consultant, Infrastructure Services 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca <mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> www.merlin.mb.ca <http://www.merlin.mb.ca/> From: Hugo Slabbert <hugo@slabnet.com <mailto:hugo@slabnet.com> > Sent: Thursday, November 25, 2021 10:39 AM To: Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com <mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> > Cc: Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca <mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> >; nanog <nanog@nanog.org <mailto:nanog@nanog.org> > Subject: Re: anyone use fbtracert successfully? What about some other options? https://paris-traceroute.net/ https://dublin-traceroute.net/ https://github.com/rucarrol/traceflow -- Hugo Slabbert On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 9:54 AM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com <mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> > wrote: Ha, my apologies, I thought I was writing this for a Linux User Group, not a NOG. Ignore my simplistic explanations. - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com <mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:47 PM Thomas Scott <mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com <mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> > wrote: I have used it successfully in a test environment that I was using ECMP in. Most of the public networks that I've worked with don't use ECMP as often as other methods for steering traffic (LAGs, BGP MEDs, etc). What I have seen it fantastically useful for was troubleshooting a transit provider, or for when they were congested or had a flapping core link. Granted I think it's still subject to ICMP deprioritization (most SP's use it prodigiously), and most MPLS cores don't decrement TTL, but it was still useful to be able to show them "no, at this IP, I always drop traffic, when..." - Thomas Scott | mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com <mailto:mr.thomas.scott@gmail.com> On Wed, Nov 24, 2021 at 12:23 PM Adam Thompson <athompson@merlin.mb.ca <mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> > wrote: The tool fbtracert (http://github.com/facebookarchive/fbtracert) was mentioned here recently as a way to get visibility into multi-pathing. Has anyone here ever used this tool successfully? Supposedly Facebook uses this tool internally, but… that doesn’t help much. I’ve tried it on 4 different platforms/OSes (WSL Ubuntu; RedHat; Debian; OpenBSD), and versions of Go (v1.10 through v1.16), in three very different environments (on-prem public IP; on-prem NAT’d; cloud public IP), and I’ve yet to see it produce any meaningful output – each run/iteration/thread only detects one, single, hop out of the entire chain of routers, making it less than useful. Granted, that’s not a full regression test by any means, but if anyone here has ever used it successfully, could you please let me know what sort of environment you ran it in/on? Thanks, -Adam Adam Thompson Consultant, Infrastructure Services 100 - 135 Innovation Drive Winnipeg, MB, R3T 6A8 (204) 977-6824 or 1-800-430-6404 (MB only) athompson@merlin.mb.ca <mailto:athompson@merlin.mb.ca> www.merlin.mb.ca <http://www.merlin.mb.ca/>
participants (5)
-
Adam Thompson -
Dave Taht -
Hugo Slabbert -
Jean St-Laurent -
Thomas Scott