On May 31, 2015, at 7:46 PM, Christopher Morrow <morrowc.lists@gmail.com> wrote:
On Sun, May 31, 2015 at 9:07 PM, Owen DeLong <owen@delong.com> wrote:
As I said before:
Host Virtual (vr.org <http://vr.org/>) Softlayer (softlayer.com <http://softlayer.com/>) Linode (Linode.com <http://linode.com/>)
All have full dual-stack support.
<snip>
At the risk of feeding the troll...
This isn't just an AWS problem.
So... ok. What does it mean, for a customer of a cloud service, to be ipv6 enabled?
It means that I should be able to develop my cloud application(s) with full native IPv6 support and expect to be able to serve IPv4-only, IPv6-only, and dual-stack customers using native IP stacks on my virtual machines without requiring external proxies, translators, etc. from the cloud service provider.
What really matters for a cloud service user? What information could be surfaced to the cloud providers in order to get the most important ipv6 'stuff' done 'now’?
Ideally, simple native routing of IPv6 to provisioned hosts should suffice in most cases.
o Is it most important to be able to address ever VM you create with an ipv6 address?
Yes.
o Is it most important to be able to talk to backend services (perhaps at your prem) over ipv6?
It’s hard to imagine how you could provide the first one above without having this one come along for the ride.
o Is it most important that administrative interfaces to the VM systems (either REST/etc interfaces for managing vms or 'ssh'/etc) be ipv6 reachable?
This would be the one where I would most be able to tolerate a delay.
o Is it most important to be able to terminate ipv6 connections (or datagrams) on a VM service for the public to use?
If you can’t get the first one, this might be adequate as a short-term fallback for some applications. However, it’s far from ideal and not all that useful.
I don't see, especially if the vm networking is unique to each customer, that 'ipv6 address on vm' is hugely important as a first/important goal. I DO see that landing publicly available services on an ipv6 endpoint is super helpful.
Here’s the thing… In order to land IPv6 services without IPv6 support on the VM, you’re creating an environment where: 1. The services basically have to be supported by some form of proxy/nat/etc. So long as you are using a supported L4 protocol, that might be fine, but not everything fits in TCP/UDP/ICMP. Generally supporting GRE, IKE, and application-specific protocols becomes an issue. 2. The developer has to develop and maintain an IPv4-compatible codebase rather than be able to use the dual stack capabilities of a host with IPV6_V6ONLY=FALSE in the socket options. This delays the ability to produce native IPv6 applications. 3. Proxies and translators add complexity, increase fragility, and reduce performance.
Would AWS (or any other cloud provider that's not currently up on the v6 bandwagon) enabling a loadbalanced ipv6 vip for your public service (perhaps not just http/s services even?) be enough to relieve some of the pressure on other parties and move the ball forward meaningfully enough for the cloud providers and their customers?
For the reasons outlined above, I don’t really think so. Owen