If you check on the GNP and Internet statistics for California, you might come up with a different opinion/order. i.e. Southern California, fith largest GNP in the world. 11% of registered domains (although that has changed with dot.bomb, maybe up, maybe down), etc. Take a look at any Internet map before making comparisons to .kr, .mx, .br or others. Hint, count major IXs. Some of the proposals in this thread also have scaling issues. Think transiting millions of E-mails a day at a reasonable cost to the consumer. Fast, cheap, good. Choose two. McDonalds proves most consumers opt for the former over the latter. I personally make every effort to be the exception, but it's an uphill battle. :) Just my 2ยข Best regards, _________________________ Alan Rowland -----Original Message----- From: owner-nanog@merit.edu [mailto:owner-nanog@merit.edu] On Behalf Of batz Sent: Wednesday, August 21, 2002 1:45 PM To: Gary E. Miller Cc: nanog@nanog.org Subject: Re: IETF SMTP Working Group Proposal at smtpng.org On Wed, 21 Aug 2002, Gary E. Miller wrote: California and Washington may seem like important jurisdictions, but not compared to .kr, .cn, .ru, .br, .mx, or even .ca. :I set up a lot of help desks, online shopping carts, etc. White lists :do not work in those roles. The mail is just too all over the place :and telling a boss that he is only losing a few orders or losing a :few customers due to a white list is not an option. I do IT secuirity incident response for about 60k people, 45k hosts, their AV gateways, IDS's and firewalls and I can assure you, spam is a security problem. Security as a discipline is uniquely positioned to articulate solutions to spam. Read the tmda.net site. Read the FAQ and the README files. Mail isn't lost, it is queued. See myprivacy.ca for an example of how it operates. <snip> -- batz