On Tue, Oct 02, 2007, Iljitsch van Beijnum wrote:
On 2-okt-2007, at 16:53, Mark Newton wrote:
By focussing on the mechanics of inbound NAT traversal, you're ignoring the fact that applications work regardless. Web, VoIP, P2P utilities, games, IM, Google Earth, you name it, it works.
O really? When was the last time you successfully transferred a file using IM? It only works half the time for me and I don't even use NAT on my main system myself. Some audio/video chat applications work well, others decidedly less so. The only reason most stuff works most of the time is because applications tell NAT devices to open up incoming ports using uPnP or NAT-PMP.
"Ah, god damn Microsoft MSN client. Just send it via gmail already." People deal with slightly broken crap all day, every day. If they had a low tolerance for it then we'd be running OSF/1+Motif on multi-core Alphas cause Windows on whiteboxes wouldn't have cut the mustard.
Right. Building something that can't meet reasonable requirements first and then getting rid of the holes worked so well for the email spam problem.
Ah, but: * y'all didn't know what were reasonable requirements when SMTP was built; and * You're not trying to do a forklift upgrade of SMTP protocol (which, arguably, would include reasonable anti-spam methods!) Whereas: * Y'all know the issues involved in migrating from ipv4 to ipv6, as you've got operational experience with both now, and * You're trying to do a forklift upgrade of the IP protocol. Adrian