particularly "interesting" when someone downloads CP (or, as it now seems to be called, CSAM) using their ipaddr and causes them to become a Person of Interest. On Apr 25, 2019, 12:43 PM -0700, Tom Beecher <beecher@beecher.cc>, wrote:
It seems like just another example of liability shifting/shielding. I'll defer to Actual Lawyers obviously, but the way I see it, Packetstream doesn't have any contractual or business relationship with my ISP. I do. If I sell them my bandwidth, and my ISP decides to take action, they come after me, not Packetstream. I can plead all I want about how I was just running "someone else's software" , but that isn't gonna hold up, since I am responsible for what is running on my home network, knowingly or unknowingly.
These guys likely just wrote a custom TOR client and a billing backend, and are banking on the fact that most people running as the exit aren't going to get caught by their provider. Ingenious, although shady. I do like they have the classic pyramid scheme going for "income off referrals", just so make sure you KNOW they're shady if you might have suspected otherwise. :)
On Thu, Apr 25, 2019 at 3:28 PM K. Scott Helms <kscott.helms@gmail.com> wrote:
After all, it worked for Napster....
Scott Helms
On Thu, Apr 25, 2019 at 3:23 PM John Levine <johnl@iecc.com> wrote:
In article <af762f22-9431-4137-b87e-2444a62bdd87@Spark> you write:
-=-=-=-=-=-
feeling cranky, are we, job? (accusing an antispam expert of spamming on a mailing list by having too long a .sig?) but it’s true! anne runs the internet, and the rest of us (except for ICANN GAC representatives) all accept that.
to actually try to make a more substantial point, i am quite curious how the AUPs of carriers try to disallow bandwidth resale while permitting
• cybercafe operations and other “free wifi" (where internet service might be provided for patrons in a hotel or cafe) • wireless access point schemes where you make money or get credit for allowing use of your bandwidth (e.g. Fon) • other proxy services that use bandwidth such as tor exit nodes and openvpn gateways
To belabor the fairly obvious, residential and business service are different even if the technology is the same. For example, Comcast's residential TOS says:
You agree that the Service(s) and the Xfinity Equipment will be used only for personal, residential, non-commercial purposes, unless otherwise specifically authorized by us in writing. You are prohibited from reselling or permitting another to resell the Service(s) in whole or in part, ... [ long list of other forbidden things ]
Their business TOS is different. It says no third party use unless your agreement permits it, so I presume they have a coffee shop plan. (The agreements don't seem to be on their web site.) I'd also observe that coffee shop wifi isn't "resale" since it's free, it's an amenity.
As to how do these guys think they'll get away with it, my guess is that they heard that "disruption" means ignoring laws and contracts and someone told them that is a good thing.
R's, John