Chris, I think those are very sane opinions and very well stated at that. There is no reason for there to be a fundamental shift here, there is nothing all that revolutionary about IPv6 that breaks existing model (policy decisions around MH, dreaming about NAT / PAT-less Internet, etc aside). Once businesses decide that it's time to adopt, this should be a normal process like any other adoption. Best Regards, Christian ------Original Message------ From: Chris L. Morrow Sender: owner-nanog@merit.edu To: Durand, Alain Cc: John Curran Cc: nanog Sent: Jul 24, 2007 12:11 PM Subject: RE: An Internet IPv6 Transition Plan On Tue, 24 Jul 2007, Durand, Alain wrote:
One of the things that is missing IMHO is that there is no clear vision of what the IPv6 Internet will/should looks like. Let me focus on the
'look like'... there are mostly ipv4 paths from each ipv4 endpoint to each other ipv4 endpoint (keeping ourselves to the 'global internet' here). I think it makes sense that the 'ipv6 internet' will look very similar (v6 connectivity from endpoint to endpoint). Now, the tricky parts are the mean time where some ipv4-only host (due to it's network infrastructure not being upgraded to dual-stack capabilities) needs to access some 'important' ipv6-only content. Or the reverse situation as well... (yes, there are firewalls and things that block some end-to-end connectivity those are mostly not important for the 'looks like' discussion)
residential broadband for a minute, I'm fully aware there are other cases, but let's start somewhere.
1) What is the IPv6 'service'?
I think that in the near term 'all' dsl/cable/dial folks will have to offer dual-stack environments. There is little hope of gateways being successful in larger deployments. (imho)
2) What is the connectivity model in IPv6 for the residential customer? 1 address versus prefix delegation? what prefix size?
I had thought it was 1 prefix, I had thought it was a /64 or a /56 someone keeps moving the classful boundaries :( but pick one. Maybe it'd be helpful to be able to subnet that, we ought to think about that too I suppose.
is this prefix 'stable' or 'variable' over time? (ie renumbering is expected)
renumbering is 'free' in ipv6 right? why not stick to your 7 day leases? Surely you'll want to keep the ability to move netspace around as capacity issues arise?
What types of devices are connected? PCs or appliances or sensors?
what types exist today? pc's, appliances, sensors... I suspect phones as well.
What is the management model in the home?
call grandson? I am probably missing your question here...
Are there 'servers' (ie things that answers connections from the outside) in the home?
my personal opinion is 'yes'... there are a number of things today that do this sort of function, in the IETF v6ops meeting slingbox was mentioned as a specific example.
3) What is the security model of all this? I just listened today half mistified to a presentation at IETF that was saying that the 'recommended' deployment model in the home is to put a NAT-like stateful firewall in the home gateway... This would mean that IPv6 would have to inherit all the NAT-traversal technologies from IPv4 to work... Is this really what we want?
I think that NAT is coming, regardless of anyone's want to avoid it, we'll have to plan for that. I think that if we get the chance to start over, let's do it 'right' or 'righter' or 'more correctly/securely' if at all possible, eh? Less direct pc->internet more pc->firewally-thingy->internet. (imho)
4) What about the 'legacy' devices that cannot upgrade to IPv6? What kind of service is expected for those? Does defining an 80% type solution as in 1) take care of them?
won't they have ipv4 'forever'? at some point the traffic will flip (more v6 than v4) but for the near term v4 seemingly will dominate and thus remain strong. -Chris -- Sent from my BlackBerry.