|> -----Original Message----- |> From: Roeland Meyer |> Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2001 8:39 AM |> To: 'Elisabeth Porteneuve'; 'ga@dnso.org'; 'kent@songbird.com' |> Subject: Net-block issues |> |> |> In this text, I typo'd a cost issue; Net-block cost |> $1US/month/IP-address. A /24 will cost $256/month, minimum. |> |> |> From: Elisabeth Porteneuve |> [mailto:Elisabeth.Porteneuve@cetp.ipsl.fr] |> |> Sent: Wednesday, August 15, 2001 1:58 AM |> |> |> The rivers of comments has been sent out about domain |> |> names, there is a dangereous silence about IP numbers. |> |> It is with wry amusement that I have been following the MAPs |> debate, on NANOG, recently. Then you make this comment, it |> couldn't dove-tail more beautifully. Those that do not know |> what MAPs is, please review http://www.mail-abuse.org/. |> |> The fundimental function is to create blacklists used for |> various filtering of IP blocks. While this sounds innocuous |> on its face, MAPS has recently announced intention of |> charging for their service, in order to raise money for |> legal fees (they are under legal attack). Until now, Paul |> Vixie has been the main funder of MAPs. |> |> The problem is that MAPS was distributing the lists and |> there were many local copies, within places like EarthLink |> and AOL. As long as those copies are maintained by MAPS, |> this is not a serious problem. They have an efficient and |> timely distribution mechanism. The result of an net-block |> being listed in MAPS is that entire chunks of the Internet |> cannot reach that net-block. This is done at the provider |> level. The effects are global in that they over-ride ARIN, |> RIPE, and APNIC. |> |> The problem arises when there are stale entries in the |> black-list. In fact, the danger has always been, the issue |> of stale entries. The effect, given MAPS market-share, is |> that a net-block can be issued, to a new business, that may |> be perfectly useless and neither the ISP or the business |> knows about it until it is too late. I might point out that |> a similar problem can occur with DNs, so it is not entirely |> an PSO issue. There are now stale entries, in abundance, |> because many providers are still evaluating the new cost |> issues. Meanwhile, they have disconnected from the distro |> system and aren't having their black-lists updated. Ergo, |> they have stale entries. |> |> What this, in effect, does is to over-ride various registry |> policies. Names and net-blocks that are issued may not, in |> fact, be issued. Names are not a serious cost issue and they |> can, with some logistical difficulty, be re-issued. However, |> net-blocks cost over $1US/month (at the ISP level), or |> $2500/year from ARIN (the US registry), and they are not all |> that plentiful. |> |> The fundimental process disconnect here is that, IMHO, the |> various registries should be performing the MAPS function as |> part of their policy enforcement mechanism. This is not |> written into any of the registrar/registry agreements. |> |> If anything argues for a centralised systems approach, the |> MAPS functionality does. IMHO, this makes it an ICANN issue. |> Yes, this also politicizes it somewhat. No, some NANOG |> denizens won't like it and that is guaranteed. |> |> -- |> R O E L A N D M J M E Y E R |> Managing Director |> Morgan Hill Software Company |> t:01 925 373 3954 |> c:01 925 352 3615 |> f:01 925 373 9781 |>