yes, we're gonna hack desperately for a decade to make up for asecure (innocent of, as contrasted with devoid of, security) application protocols and implementations. it'll take half that time for the ivtf and the vendors to realize how deeply complexity is our enemy. and until then we'll hack everywhere in our desperation. but in the long run, i don't think we can win with an active middle. the problem is that the the difference betwen good traffic and bad traffic is intent. did the sender intend to send / reveal those data? did the recipient wish to receive them? and, i don't think we can stand in the middle and judge. and there's the rub. the cute example is, as i said to you privately, that i have customers who wish to receive what is sent by what i think of as malicious folk. the recipients are security folk and net-sociometricians. so who am i to judge? some people even eat at macdonalds. randy, who enjoyed his lunch of seared ahi and asparagus