OK..... sage comments from both sean and mike. They still I think leave an interesting question. when you have IP networks as large as sprints and mci's and you are having a lot of serious problems, if this frame relay architecture is not necessarily the answer, then what is? IE how are you going to avoid the crash into the brick wall at 60 mph? One way is to cidrize like crazy.....ie aggregate routes, clean up the swamp, etc. Any other solutions out there? From what I can remember everytime someone suggested a solution someone else showed that said solution produced an undesirable side effect. ******************************************************************** Gordon Cook, Editor & Publisher Subscript.: Individ-ascii $85 The COOK Report on Internet Non Profit. $150 431 Greenway Ave, Ewing, NJ 08618 Small Corp & Gov't $200 (609) 882-2572 Corporate $350 Internet: cook@cookreport.com Corporate. Site Lic $650 Newly expanded COOK Report Web Pages http://pobox.com/cook/ ********************************************************************