Also Sprach jlewis@lewis.org
On Sun, 13 Apr 2003, Stephen Sprunk wrote:
Please explain how somebody with more than 4096 hosts in PA space is supposed to renumber into a /20 of PI space.
I fear you propose that he move the first 3276.8 hosts, request a second block, move another 3276.8 hosts, request a third block, etc. until he's got a dozen new allocations which can't be aggregated. Perhaps this explains the explosive growth in the routing tables since ARIN took over.
Perhaps the poster who mentioned they didn't get enough space to renumber should have started, filled the allocation, requested another, and finished the renumbering.
Ignoring, for the moment, that absolute absurdity of that type of procedure...you forget what I've now said twice...that ARIN said as clarification after I got the first block that renumbering wasn't a consideration, full stop. Either ARIN's policies are screwed up beyond even what I thought to begin with, or their communications with customers/ISPs/whatever is absolutely pitiful. Most likely, both.
In your request, did you mention any sort of projected timeline for renumbering into the block you requested?
During the first request, we proposed a timeline of 6 months to a year for renumber, if I remember correctly. And please don't even *think* of suggesting that we should have done it in 3 months...that's just laughable.
I don't know anyone who's actually followed this, but I haven't communicated with many ARIN members about this sort of thing lately. Is this policy being enforced consistently now? I know in the past, ARIN has had their own policies (at least for initial and at one time for second allocations) that pretty much ignored this. Once upon a time, you could request a /20 from a reserved /19 as long as you were multi-homed and could justify a /21. Fill the first /20 in 18 months or less, and you get the other half, and have a /19. I think the rationale for this at the time was routing filters, as you were allowed to announce the /19 even before the second half of it was officially yours. Now, the ARIN tune seems to be "we only assign numbers, routability is your problem".
FWIW, the second block that we got just a short time ago, was an extension of the previous /20, to make it a /19...not that this is relevant, in any way, to any of the issues raised. We still haven't never received from ARIN, a sufficiently large block to be able to renumber out of the currently utilized space as was offered for the first request, and strongly requested for the second; and the communications that we received after the first request was a flat out lie about the consideration of renumbering in allocations. There is no was for ARIN to get out of this one smelling like roses...they screwed up...probably twice, depending on your opinions about policies...but at least once in the lie about renumbering considerations.
I don't claim to have an easy solution for this. If every idiot with a business plan could request and receive a /16, there'd be an awful lot of wasted space.
FWIW, the first request we made was for a /19, which would have been the smallest single block that could have been allocated to us to allow us to renumber into; and the second request was for an /18, with the same reasoning. We got /20's both times (with the second /20 being the second half of the /19 of the first /20).
But if you've been around for most of the past decade and have continued to grow, should you really be issued new non-agregable blocks every several months?
IgLou has been in the Internet providing business for the better part of 15 years.
Somebody must have a better idea.
Here's a radical thought. Use some common sense and critical thinking skills in deciding what the allocation should be. It certainly seems to be lacking at the moment. -- Jeff McAdams Email: jeffm@iglou.com Head Network Administrator Voice: (502) 966-3848 IgLou Internet Services (800) 436-4456