I'm not normally one to respond to NANOG messages with opinions.... but... Yeah, NAT broke the internet. Yes you can engineer around it. There is NO reason to hold onto NAT as a standard. With v6 we have the opportunity to do it right (or at least semi-right) from the beginning, lets not choose to break it all from the beginning. Don't worry, if you understand basic routing these concepts shouldn't be hard for you. And don't worry, there is still plenty of market for residential "firewalls" and all but yeah maybe they'll actually have to be a firewall/router as opposed to just a NAT box. So there is my opinion; I don't understand why anyone thinks NAT should be a fundamental part of the v6 internet even after reading almost every message in this thread. It is just a stop-gap v4 measure and yeah, before people understood real security it was a security thing. Lets just move ahead with the good stuff! There'll be plenty of legacy/nostalgia around for years for those who still want to work with it. Just an opinion, Carl