To be hyper pedantic, lithium / li-on batteries are recyclable. It’s just not being done today on a substantive scale today for mostly economic reasons. On Sat, Dec 28, 2019 at 14:51 Dan Hollis <goemon@sasami.anime.net> wrote:
Nothing.
It is extremely cheap, extremely durable, and nearly 100% recyclable. All the things lithium is not.
The only thing is lead acid is not power dense, but that is not generally a problem at sites.
-Dan
On Sat, 28 Dec 2019, Baldur Norddahl wrote:
What is wrong with lead acid battery backup? Seems to be exceedingly stable from my experience. We have all our equipment on -48V DC and have never had a power interruption at any site.
The requirements here are 48 hours of backup by law. Telecom is declared to be part of emergency and defense, so they put in a requirement for resilience.
Regards
Baldur
tor. 26. dec. 2019 11.33 skrev Joe Maimon <jmaimon@jmaimon.com>:
Unless telecom infrastructure has been diligently changing out the lead acid battery approach at all their remote terminals, powered gpon, hfc and antennae plants will never last more than minutes. If at all.
A traditional car has between a 100-200amp alternator @12volts
How much generating capacity can you get out of a typical hybrid?
Self-isolating and re-tieing inverters. Economic household ATS systems. Do those exist?
Enough independent distributed capacity and now comes the ability to create grid islands. How might that look?
Electric grid shortage is likely coming to NYC, courtesy of folk of certain political persuasion and their love of stone age era living. IP decommissioning.
If you have CO loop copper, keep it.
Joe
Don Gould wrote:
This is a very short term problem.
The market is going to fill with battery storage sooner rather than later.
Solar is just exploding.
Your car will "house tie".
6G will solve your data problem.
D
-- Don Gould 5 Cargill Place Richmond Christchurch, New Zealand Mobile/Telegram: + 64 21 114 0699 www. <http://www.tusker.net.au/>bowenvale.co.nz
-------- Original message -------- From: Michael Thomas <mike@mtcc.com> Date: 26/12/19 2:33 PM (GMT+12:00) To: nanog@nanog.org Subject: power to the internet
This article details some of the issues with California's "new reality" of planned blackouts. One of the big things that came to light with these blackouts is that our network infrastructure's resilience is pretty lacking. While I was (surprisingly to me) ok with my DSL connection out in the boonies, lots and lots of people with cable weren't so lucky. And I'm not sure how bad the situation is with cellular infrastructure, but I assume it's not much better than cable. And I wouldn't doubt that other DSL deployments go dark when power is down. I have no clue with fiber.
So I guess what I'm wondering is what can we do about this? What should we do about this? These days IP access is not just convenience, it's
way we go about our lives, just like electricity itself. At base, it seems to me that network operators should be required to keep the
https://www.politico.com/news/2019/12/25/california-power-shutoffs-089678 the lights
on in blackouts just like POTS operators do now. If I have power to light my modem or charge in my phone, I should be able to get onto the net. That seems like table stakes.
One of the things we learned also is that the blackouts seem to last between 2-3 days apiece. I happen to have a generator since I'm out in the boonies and our power gets cut regularly because of snow, but not everyone has that luxury. I kind of want to think that my router+modem use about 20 watts, so powering it up would take about 1.5kwh for 3 days. a quick google look shows that I'd probably need to shell out $500 or so for a battery of that capacity, and that's doesn't include your phones, laptops, tv's, etc power needs. What does that mean? That is a major expense for a lot of people.
On the bright side, I hear that power generator companies stocks have gone through the roof.
On the dark side, this is probably coming to a lot more states and countries due to climate change. Australia. Sigh.
Mike