Re: Request for comment -- BCP38
On Mon 2016-Sep-26 12:25:58 -0400, John R. Levine <johnl@iecc.com> wrote:
I gather the usual customer response to this is "if you don't want our $50K/mo, I'm sure we can find another ISP who does."
I myself am talking about the latter and included the option of PI space to cover that (although I guess at some point this can be made fly with PA space from another provider if both providers are willing enough to play ball), though from the $50/mo figure John listed, I'm assuming he's talking about the latter.
Who said $50/mo?
Apparently I need even more caffeine that I first imagined... If we're talking about networks with that kind of MRC, is it really that far of a stretch to require PI space for this? Then again: If we're talking about that kind of MRC, then I'm assuming ISP A can be coaxed to allow explicit and well-defined exceptions on the customer's links. This discussion started wrt to COTS dual-ISP routers though, as mentioned in Ken Chase's message, no? Where I'm assuming we're talking about mom-and-pop operations rather than a $50K/mo business account.
Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
-- Hugo Slabbert | email, xmpp/jabber: hugo@slabnet.com pgp key: B178313E | also on Signal
If we're talking about networks with that kind of MRC, is it really that far of a stretch to require PI space for this? Then again: If we're talking about that kind of MRC, then I'm assuming ISP A can be coaxed to allow explicit and well-defined exceptions on the customer's links.
Yes. A) Check the prices for PI space, if you can even get any. B) Our network works fine with PA space. If you claim otherwise, we know plenty of other operators who aren't as wedged as you are. Trying to solve technical problems with social solutions rarely works. See for example, the sad history of passwords. Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
On Mon 2016-Sep-26 12:39:21 -0400, John R. Levine <johnl@iecc.com> wrote:
If we're talking about networks with that kind of MRC, is it really that far of a stretch to require PI space for this? Then again: If we're talking about that kind of MRC, then I'm assuming ISP A can be coaxed to allow explicit and well-defined exceptions on the customer's links.
Yes.
A) Check the prices for PI space, if you can even get any.
B) Our network works fine with PA space. If you claim otherwise, we know plenty of other operators who aren't as wedged as you are.
Trying to solve technical problems with social solutions rarely works. See for example, the sad history of passwords.
Mike and Aled covering this better than I am.
Regards, John Levine, johnl@iecc.com, Primary Perpetrator of "The Internet for Dummies", Please consider the environment before reading this e-mail. https://jl.ly
-- Hugo Slabbert | email, xmpp/jabber: hugo@slabnet.com pgp key: B178313E | also on Signal
On 9/26/16 9:37 AM, Hugo Slabbert wrote:
On Mon 2016-Sep-26 12:25:58 -0400, John R. Levine <johnl@iecc.com> wrote:
I gather the usual customer response to this is "if you don't want our $50K/mo, I'm sure we can find another ISP who does."
I myself am talking about the latter and included the option of PI space to cover that (although I guess at some point this can be made fly with PA space from another provider if both providers are willing enough to play ball), though from the $50/mo figure John listed, I'm assuming he's talking about the latter.
Who said $50/mo?
Apparently I need even more caffeine that I first imagined...
If we're talking about networks with that kind of MRC, is it really that far of a stretch to require PI space for this? Then again: If we're talking about that kind of MRC, then I'm assuming ISP A can be coaxed to allow explicit and well-defined exceptions on the customer's links.
This discussion started wrt to COTS dual-ISP routers though, as mentioned in Ken Chase's message, no? Where I'm assuming we're talking about mom-and-pop operations rather than a $50K/mo business account.
This is getting insanely silly, especially for this list. A $50K/mo customer should have PI space and announce via BGP to both (all) upstreams. He isn't going to do this with a COTS Belkin "router". A mom-and-pop with said Belkin router who ties to source its /29 or dynamic /32 from ISP A out ISP B isn't going to get very far with it. The COTS "router" isn't going to NAT the traffic out the wrong interface in the first place. In any case, ISP B will never see the return traffic. The rest of the Net isn't going to accept its /29 and /32 random advertisements, period. -- Jay Hennigan - CCIE #7880 - Network Engineering - jay@impulse.net Impulse Internet Service - http://www.impulse.net/ Your local telephone and internet company - 805 884-6323 - WB6RDV
participants (3)
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Hugo Slabbert -
Jay Hennigan -
John R. Levine