Why is it not also 100% that government's fault for wilfully and intentionally making impossible blocking orders? And why stop at ECH? Why not 100% blame Github's if China blocks Github, for using TLS? You're running defense for totalitarianism here - not a good look. Yes, to help prevent totalitarian censorship, networks have been designed to prevent anyone other than the endpoints of a communication from learning what is being communicated. It's been a gradual process, ongoing for 30 or more years now. Dictatorships still sometimes turn off the entire internet because they can't block specific content, which makes their population angry at the dictator, who turned off the internet, and not at the content providers, who prevented the dictator from doing gradual blocks. Know what those dictators do the rest of the time? Turn on the entire internet, including content they don't like, because they can't selectively block it and the guillotines will come out if the internet stays off for too long. On 15/04/25 03:22, Constantine A. Murenin via NANOG wrote:
You cannot expect the entire world to have the same laws as the United States.
If laws of foreign countries specify that some content that's legal in the US has to be blocked in said country, it's 100% Cloudflare's fault for wilfully and intentionally making such blocking impossible apart from blocking Cloudflare's entire network, affecting all the other customers, too.
You can't have your cake and eat it, too. A simple Google Search for ESNI / Encrypted Client Hello (ECH) / DNS over HTTPS (DoH) is all Cloudflare on top. They didn't just make it impossible by accident, they made it impossible by design. They've literally wilfully and intentionally engineered their entire network for the all-or-nothing scenario.
C.
On Mon, 14 Apr 2025 at 18:10, Tim Burke <tim@mid.net> wrote:
These incidents shouldn’t be a thing to begin with, as “censorship” is not within the scope of an ISP’s responsibilities. Eyeball customers pay for access to the whole internet, not “the internet minus every CDN because ISP thinks it’s their responsibility to block websites they don’t want to allow”.
On Apr 14, 2025, at 16:16, Constantine A. Murenin via NANOG <nanog@lists.nanog.org> wrote:
How is it NOT Cloudflare's fault that their entire network always gets blocked in these incidents?
NANOG mailing list https://lists.nanog.org/archives/list/nanog@lists.nanog.org/message/LHV6DVAB...